Van Impe and Hagee
Haven't a Clue
[Ray replies to a reader who asked him to look at another site]
I read a couple of dozens pages of Johnson's site. I grow weary reading his stuff. I fully realize that God is not dealing with historical Israel in His prophecies for today. However, Johnston takes about ten pages or more stating that NOT ONE PERSON IN ISRAEL TODAY CAN PROVE THE HE CAME FROM ONE OF THE TRIBES OF ISRAEL. So what? Neither can Johnston, himself, PROVE that he is not of one of the historical tribes of Israel. Neither can he PROVE that every single person living in Israel today is descended from a Gentile. How pray tell would he ever prove such a thing??? What person alive today anywhere on the face of the earth, can trace his lineage back to Adam and Eve? I rest my case.
I explain the origin of the "Jews" in Jerusalem at the time of Christ's ministry in my paper on "Lazarus and the Rich man."
[The reader replies]
You write "NOT ONE PERSON IN ISRAEL TODAY CAN PROVE THE HE CAME FROM ONE OF THE TRIBES OF ISRAEL. So what?"
The so what is that if today's Christians believe that Jews will on day return to making sacrifices in the temple and the antichrist will one day step into the temple and declare himself God then we all have our timeline wrong. I like most follow the Van Impe's, Hagee's, Thomas Ice, etc. For then it means that today's Jews may not hold a special place in God's time calendar and all that is going on in Israel may not be significant.
Pastor Hagee believes that Jews don't need to be saved however everyone else who does not get saved is going to hell. If you were taught that all this time today's Jews were the anointed (no matter how Jewish they were) only to find out that they may not be, it opens up your eyes. I found it interesting that he had a different take on the issue and wondered what your thoughts were?
Van Impe and Hagee HAVEN'T A CLUE as to the meaning of and timetable
of prophecy. Do you remember twelve years ago when Van Impe had a series on
"How long is a Biblical Generation?" His method of calculation was about as
inept as anything could be. But anyway, from his 'Biblical calculations' he determined
that Jesus Christ would RETURN IN 1996! He used the sets of fourteen generations in
Matthew to prove his calculations. He totally neglected the genealogy in the book of Luke.
I guess those figures didn't work in his favor as well as those in Matthew. I wrote a
paper after those broadcasts because a friend of mind believed every word of Van Impe. I
don't even know if I still have the paper, but I proved his calculations to be nonsense,
as time itself has now proved the same fact. Need I note the fact that it is now just
fourteen hours until 2003? He has already missed it by SEVEN YEARS, and I suspect it will
be a lot more. How quickly people forget what these self-styled, self-appointed false
prophets have prophesied in the past that never came about!!
TBN is a great evil to the true gospel of Christ. Paul and Jan Crouch will let anybody appear on their stage so long as the ratings are high, and the money is flowing. Why else would God let men desecrate His name and the precious sacrifice of His Son?
Just speak the truth of these wolves, and the children (like myself) who were once deceived will hear Him calling to them from deep inside. They know something is wrong but cannot pinpoint it.
Ministry for profit. These are the sons of Baal today, the offspring of Simon who would try to buy the Spirit of God rather than be transformed from his blackened soul. These T.V. con-artists, have been put in place that the sons of Light may be made evident by the Truth that they speak to those of kindred spirit. We are known as those who have gone astray, but the fruit of truth glistens from the Source within.
Bless you in your work of preserving the true Gospel before a lost
and dying world.
My father and I have been discussing many of the ideas on your site for years and have not found anyone who had any similar beliefs.
Most people start making the sign of the cross towards you if you want to discuss the things that you bring up on your site.
I have just finished printing up your entire site and sending it to my father, who I know will be equally excited.
God bless you Ray and may none of us ever stop seeking truth in
I have been doing some research on Tithing and found your writings most interesting. I am not a Bible scholar by any means but have read the Bible completely through.
We belong to a Non-denominational Christian Church that is a New Testament Church. I was Chairperson of the Pulpit Committee in search for a Sr. Pastor one year ago. To cut to the chase we found a wonderful Minister with his Doctorate and more then qualified for our small Church. He and his wife have been with us for nine months now and he has been everything we had hoped for. He has been teaching us a series called Life Design that he has Authored.
The last two weeks have been on Tithing and after completing the second week we in the class were all given a paper with three things to commit to and the one I have the problem with states that we should give our first ten percent of our income in Tithing first and we are to sign this paper committing to this. He has quoted a lot of Scripture about Tithing and in Bible Study has talked about it a lot but has never given an exact Scripture that states we should give our first ten per cent.
Our belief is we should support our Church financially and commit to an amount and abide by that commitment but feel that amount should be just between us and God as we also believe it is important in supporting your Church in giving of your time for needs within the Church.
My husband is an Elder and we are very active members. We and the Congregation love this Minister and his wife who is also very hands on into her husbands Ministry but this is of great concern to us. If it is Scripture according to God's word then it should be abided by but in your writings you show all the Scriptures about Tithing and this is just what I was looking for so we can know for sure what the Scriptures demand. Any other insight you could give us on this we would appreciate. Also are you a Minister, or a Bible Scholar?
I guess I am asking what your Title is as far as your expertise although I do realize all your quotes to back up what you are saying is Scripture. Thank You for your knowledge and narrowing the subject of Tithing down to what it is.
With Love In Christ, Mr. & Mrs. William ...
Dear Mr. and Mrs. ...
Interestingly, it was discovered that following this ridiculous
unscriptural laws of financing the church, was a impossibility for our brothers and
sisters in the Australian Congregations. You see, after taxes they didn't earn enough to
tithe even if they gave 100% of their paycheck!!!!!!! A minor technicality, I guess.
GOD IS ABLE! God can and does provide for HIS ministries, and He
does NOT require believers to TITHE THEIR SALARIES! "God LOVES A CHEERFUL
GIVER"--that my friends is SCRIPTURE. God DEMANDS BY LAW TEN PERCENT OF YOUR GROSS
SALARIES is man-made heresy!
Question: Is no one's word good in your congregation, it requires a
signature? I am not being sarcastic, but I am trying to get you to THINK, which, of
course, you are already doing, or you would not have asked my opinion on this matter.
Do we need to witness to people, or does God build His church?
"The Holy Spirit draws men to God, not people."
"Going door-to-door witnessing is simply religious works of the flesh."
Do you have a quick response?
Unfortunately those who make the biggest practice of door-to-door
teaching, don't even teach the true Gospel. Of the two largest groups that do
this--Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons, neither one teaches the true gospel. I don't
believe either one teaches that Jesus Christ is the SAVIOUR OF THE WHOLE WORLD!!!
In little more than a year , my web master tells me that we have already reached over ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND people. At least that many have come to our site. So I think I will keep on doing what I am doing and leave the "door-to-door" for someone else.
Yes, God does build HIS church, but He also inspired Paul to say
that He uses the "foolishness of preaching" to accomplish it.
I can appreciate your approach to the scriptural relevance of tithing, particularly under the new covenant. However, when Jesus says that "I did not come destroy the law, but to fulfill it."
Giving the tithe was a part of that law... While I certainly agree with you with regard to ceremonial foreskins and other Levitical materials... we must also remember that we must be very careful when quickly claiming grace and abolishing law. Does this mean we can now murder, covet, bare false witness, steal, lie, fornicate, commit adultery because we are no longer under the law? As Paul said, "Should we continue in sin that grace should abound? God forbid."
I agree that God does want all of us... but all of us will incline us to keep His laws, which are now written on our hearts. Again, I think you lifted up a very powerful perspective, I simply believe that God still requires us to provide financial support to his church, and specific support at that. When God's Word says that the tithe is Holy, holiness transcends time, covenant and testament. Because we are under the new covenant, what was Holy then does not become unholy now. Thanks Ray for your viewpoint... I would love to get a response from you on this...
Now then, did Jesus Christ "fulfill" all of the prophecies
concerning Him? Well if He did, then does there REMAIN any that He DID NOT FULFILL? Then
why doesn't anyone, it seems, believe that He also and in the very same way fulfilled
You have partial truths (like many others) -- BUT if God created Satan to be an adversary so that people could "develop virtue" then God is the one ultimately responsible for all of mankind's suffering because God certainly could foresee all the evil, suffering and pain that sin&Satan caused when they induced Adam&Eve to sin.
What type of sick trick would that be for a God who is FULL of Love as his main "virtue"? Angels have free will just as mankind, some chose to rebel with the chief slanderer - the angel who BECAME Satan CHOSE to leave God's truth. Eze. 28:12-19 and Isa. 14:12-20 tell of that angels fall into sin that he CHOSE to rebel against Jehovah God and became Satan the devil.
You would indeed do well to study with one on Jehovah's Witnesses to find the truth about God's plan to do away with the devil and the suffering of mankind.
Have a nice day!!
Dear Nameless Jehovah Witness:
What the Jehovah's Witnesses have done at many places is to fall in line with the same pagan teachings of Christendom that they supposed have condemned and come out of.
And so you have a God Who does not "torture" most of humanity for all eternity, but on the other hand you do NOT have a God Who plainly says many times, that He WILL save all mankind and NOT "annihilate" many of them for all eternity as you teach.
You saw through the unscriptural fallacy of ONE argument, and
swallowed down whole the Satanic teaching of another unscriptural heresy.
But ... BUT, here is the evil in this teaching:
FAILED AGAIN! How many times must your god FAIL until you find
Now then, with that said, read Part IX of my Series on "The
Lake of Fire" which will be posted Oct 12 on this site. You will see the Scriptural
proof against the "Lucifer became Satan" theory.
Hello, I stumbled upon your site and happy that I did. I have struggled of late with many issues on your site.
I have "fallen away" from my Assemblies of God Church for many reasons a lot have to do with what I feel God has pointed out to be false teachings on the tithe, importance of an altar (in the church of course). But most has to do with the arrogance and greed of our pastor.
My church is in a small farming community and the pastors wears expensive clothing and has a large house. He teaches on the tithe and says that if you stop no matter how much debt you have in your household you risk losing God's covering. I have pointed out the new testament teaching about owing no man anything but the debt of love and the response I got was is it God's fault that you got yourself into a situation by being a poor steward with your money. The word 'pastor' is only mentioned once in the NKJ version which tells me God didn't put to much thought into the position.
Enough of my ranting.
I have a couple of question now that I completely doubt my belief and the teachings I have been under.
1. How do you know you are right with God?
2. What would cause your name to be blotted out of the Lambs book of life?
3. What does the future hold for pastors that teach error laden sermons?
Conversion is a process. It starts with faith and desire. Both of
which are gifts of God. You come to the place that you no longer hold out on God, you
are no longer playing church, see the deception and corruption in the Babylonish Church
System smothering the earth, and surrender your will to God, then you will start to feel
"right" with God. When your desire is to mortify the lusts and deeds of the mind
and body rather than to feed them, you will begin to feel right with God. When you find
yourself thinking about God and praying to God for yourself and for the suffering of
others EVERY DAY, ALL DAY LONG, then you will begin to be RIGHT WITH GOD.
What is the book of life? JESUS CHRIST IS THE WALKING, TALKING, LIVING BOOK OF LIFE. The Father has given His son LIFE, and Jesus can give that same LIFE to anyone He desires. People don't have their names written on a page in a literal book, and then later have an angel come with a bottle of white-out and remove it. Those who are not walking, talking, and living the life of Christ in them are CONTINUALLY BEING BLOTTED OUT OF LIVING BOOK OF CHRIST. Life is not in a book, but in CHRIST WHO IS THE LIVING BOOK.
But even if one is being blotted out somewhere along his life, he can be restored. Paul turned people over to SATAN THE DEVIL to have their flesh destroyed (not there physical body, but their CARNAL HEART AND MIND) so that they would learn not to blaspheme. But after they learn not to blaspheme, then they are RETURNED to fellowship with man and God.
It has been the churches that have caused men to fear God as a fickled kind of a god who one never quite knows for sure which side of the bed he got up on and therefore we must always be in fear and trepidation of our salvation. The "Pastors" (you are correct there is truly only ONE PASTOR of the sheep and that is Christ) love this power over the dumb sheep.
Have no fear. If you love God you will NEVER be blotted out of
Christ the true book of life.
Let me know if you still have questions. God be with you always.
I read your page ... well most of it. I am a Pastor of of a church and agree with a lot of what you have said on this page (no 10% tithe in the church) although I do find in the book of Acts 5 with Ananias and Sapphira where they were required to give all.
I believe as New Testament believers that we are required to give our all. Although I don't know any of us that are doing that. Jesus said if any man would follow Him that that man must 1st deny himself. He also said if anyone left homes lands husbands wives children that they would receive 100 fold not only in the life to come but in this life as well.
I agree it isn't 10% but I personally believe it is our all and not for some man or woman to live high & mighty off of.
In His Service of Love,
Dear Pastor Tim:
Do you believe that if you Tithe you will receive abundant blessings, whether you are Christian or not?
Is this power of giving really a law of nature?
It is a LAW of nature, that if you give away ten percent of your
salary, are taxed ten percent of your salary, spend ten percent of your salary, or even
LOOSE ten percent of your salary, YOU WILL ALWAYS HAVE TEN PERCENT LESS THAN WHAT YOU
People email and tell me that they have been tithing and are NOT
BLESSED financially in any way, but in fact, have severe problems with making ends meet
after giving away ten percent of their salaries.
I live here in the heart of the bible belt and I am totally surrounded by well intended, misinformed holy rollers. Before I had my awakening [five years ago] this was a simple problem to solve, I just told them to go to HELL! But now all I can do is look at them and THANK GOD for setting me free from their hellfire and brimstone bull. I lived there for thirty years.
I was a drug addict, full blown needle freak on my way to an early grave and worse I was already dead inside. I don't know man, I met a guy, he told me to pray for an open mind and I did. I did because I had to, everything I knew and believed had failed repeatedly. So I asked God to show me. I surrendered completely, mentally, spiritually, and physically. I threw in the towel.
I was driving down the road one day not thinking about anything in particular and it happened, it happened big time and I was changed forever. I saw everything in a new light especially the bible and all the B.S. I'd been taught. At first I was absolutely on FIRE with it and I ran out to tell the world, found out the hard way that the world couldn't, wouldn't hear it. Oh how they fight for their devil and their hell. Ridiculous huh?
So anyway I found myself among the few who find this and often I have wondered if it's a blessing or a curse to be so alone. When you're free from this world, it's hard to pretend with these idiots. Soooooo what do I do?
A few months ago my twenty three year old sister-in law committed suicide. I was having dinner at her grandmothers house a few weeks later and she started in on me with that hellfire, you better get in church or you're going to hell crap. I told her that I didn't believe in hell and that if there was a hell, I'd already been there. I thought she was going to flip her lid on me. She did everything but jump up on the table and slap me in Satan's defense. Now she sends me E-mails, things she finds on the computer about the devil and how much power he has. Doesn't make sense to me, they tell you how ALL MIGHTY God is on one hand, then turn around and contradict themselves with a sermon on how sneaky, and cunning their devil is. So I say well, what is it? Is God ALL MIGHTY or is he just what, fifty or sixty percent mighty?
It's funny and its sad, just thought I would share it with you. Again I would like to say THANKS I enjoy reading your material and if I can ever be of service let me know, that's why I am here