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aqrinc:
Whose timetable is GOD supposed to work on, ours o' man?. If you think you know then you are fully in the control of your carnal nature.

Rom 8: 6-8 (KJV)
6  For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7  Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8  So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Act 17: 30-31 (KJV)
30  And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
31  Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.


1Ti 4: 1-11 (GNB)
1  The Spirit says clearly that some people will abandon the faith in later times; they will obey lying spirits and follow the teachings of demons.
2  Such teachings are spread by deceitful liars, whose consciences are dead, as if burnt with a hot iron.
3  Such people teach that it is wrong to marry and to eat certain foods. But God created those foods to be eaten, after a prayer of thanks, by those who are believers and have come to know the truth.
4  Everything that God has created is good; nothing is to be rejected, but everything is to be received with a prayer of thanks,
5  because the word of God and the prayer make it acceptable to God.
6  If you give these instructions to the believers, you will be a good servant of Christ Jesus, as you feed yourself spiritually on the words of faith and of the true teaching which you have followed.
7  But keep away from those godless legends, which are not worth telling. Keep yourself in training for a godly life.
8  Physical exercise has some value, but spiritual exercise is valuable in every way, because it promises life both for the present and for the future.
9  This is a true saying, to be completely accepted and believed.
10  We struggle and work hard, because we have placed our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all and especially of those who believe.
11  Give them these instructions and these teachings.

george. :)

bunnylife:
<<Whose timetable is GOD supposed to work on, ours o' man?. If you think you know then you are fully in the control of your carnal nature.>>

I know that we can not make God change His timetable for our lives. However, I think that we can hinder Father, Daddy God by our choices in giving into the carnal nature instead of being led by the spirit of God. We can't make it go any faster but it can make it slower (in our perspective not God's). God knows of our all decisions not that He makes us choose the carnal nature. It is not pointless. God is truly Love. You say you know the Truth but have you applied the Truth to your life?

Of course, people are not going to listen.. they are blind.

2 Thessalonians 2:10 "and in all deceitfulness of the unrighteousness in those perishing, because the love of the truth they did not receive for their being saved, 11and because of this shall God send to them a working of delusion, for their believing the lie, 12that they may be judged -- all who did not believe the truth, but were well pleased in the unrighteousness".

However, perchance there is one that is called to be the elect then your postings are not in vain. You are not there to win or debate (what is your motivation? Love?) the Truth on forums. Christ Jesus told us we would be persecuted for His name. (Mat 5:11-12)"Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great [is] your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you".

God will direct your steps.. they are ordered by God. Psalm 37:23 and 24, "The steps of a good person are ordered by the Lord, And He delights in his way. Though he fall, he shall not be utterly cast down; For the Lord upholds him with His hand."

You do have a part to play, it is not just only up to God to zap you.. you are not a robot or puppet.. you are a child of the Most High God being made into His image. You do have choices.. follow carnal nature or be led by the spirit of God.

Romans 8:14-15

14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption,(sons of God) whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

hillsbororiver:
Hi 24 Grams (interesting name) and Everyone,

A few thoughts came to mind as I read through this topic and I thought I would respond to a couple points (maybe more later).

In regard to Paul being "converted" in a few seconds after being struck blind, I guess this has something to do with how you define or perceive the word converted, or actually what really transpired. Saul was convicted of his beast nature, his carnal self righteous self and was newly conceived as Paul.

No one in this body of flesh is truly 100% converted, we are a new creature yes, but incomplete until "the change" when we receive our full inheritence.

Does Paul sound as if he believes he is a pure, holy and a completely "converted" spiritual creature?
 
 Romans 7

 14For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

 15For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.

 16If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.

 17Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

 18For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

 19For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

 20Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

 21I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

 22For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

 23But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

 24O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?

 25I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

arion:
 
--- Quote ---And I must admit I understand everything written hear, but I can't help but still question what's the point?
--- End quote ---

This isn't what you want to hear right now but if you did understand everything Ray has written you wouldn't be asking the question.  I don't understand everything written on this site....as a matter of fact I feel that I'm still in Kindergarten and just barely scratching the surface.  Until you quit trying to force God's hand in things you'll probably never grow, at least thats been my experience.  Let God be God.  In time if it's his will for you he will open your spirit into deeper truths but it comes about on his time table and not ours.  There is so much I don't understand yet but I just have to be content to wait until he does, if he does.  We are the clay and he is the potter remember?

hillsbororiver:
From;
 
WHO AND WHAT IS JESUS? & WHO IS HIS FATHER? . . . Nashville Conference 2007

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,4472.0.html
 
Phi 2:12  “Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.”

Doesn’t that contradict this whole thing... we’re saved by grace and not of works?  Now we’re to work out our own salvation?  What is that?  How do you explain that “Of Myself I can do nothing” (John 5:30)?   And He said YOU can do nothing (John 15:5), to the apostles.  Then Paul says “work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.”  Well it does sound like a contradiction.  But read the next verse and He tells us why.  "For" now that word always means ‘because' or it’s another word for because.

Phi 2:13  “For (because) it is God who works in you both to will and to do of His good pleasure.”

Some of you probably still don’t get the answer, but it is there.  "Work out your own salvation," is not the gist of that saying.  He is not saying, work out your own salvation(.)  No, He’s saying “work out your own salvation with fear and trembling, that’s where the emphases is, on fear and trembling, not on work out your own salvation. 

You work out your own salvation with fear and trembling, why?  Because it all depends on God!  If God doesn’t do it, it won’t happen, IT WON’T HAPPEN!  So we live in fear and trepidation.

I cannot drive down the street, being the safest driver that I can be and know that I will avoid an accident, if God has already determined I’m going to have one.  What it doesn’t mean is you can drive down the road foolishly... or you don’t need to wear a seat belt... or close your eyes for a while... or something like that.  But you do have to act it out.  Why?  You have to, He makes you. 

He made you come out of your mother’s womb and He made you cry.  Not that He forced you, but circumstances, He brought about all the circumstances.  He made you cry, makes you grow and makes you fight with your kid brother. 

You do all these things and people reach a place where they get tired of it.  So we have plays like ‘Stop the world I want to get off.’  It's like I’ve had enough, I’m at the end of my rope and it’s the end of the line.  Well it’s only the end of the line IF God has determined it’s the end of the line. 
If say you came to that conclusion at 8:30, and He knows you won’t die until your 77 1/2, then you're not going to end it. 

That’s where the fear and trepidation come in.  It ALL depends on God, there’s nothing you can do.  But YOU have to work it out.  YOU have to get up and go to work.  YOU have to do all this stuff. 

Then you say I don’t want to anymore, well circumstances make you.
So you think, I’ll just end it all... then your child comes up and says ‘Mommie.’  Now you say, oh my gosh I have a child, I can’t kill myself I’ve got to live for my child.  You see? 

So God makes you live this life.  He makes you do all this, HE MAKES YOU DO IT.  But not against your will.  He puts you in circumstances and that’s the only way you can go.  The ONLY way!

You think, 'I shouldn’t have done this or that.'  That’s right you should think that way.  You should think that... 'I shouldn’t have done that,' because then you're learning.
 
When you learn, you will then put that into practice.  Because God doesn’t have you learn things so you can’t put them into practice.  He has you learn things so you CAN put them into practice.  But the only way you will learn them, is if you see how stupid it was, and you say if I had it to do over, I wouldn’t have done that.  So YOU HAD TO DO THEM!  Because that lead to a lot of trouble and pain and sorrow.  But did you learn your lesson?  'Well yea.'  Then don’t do it again okay, now their back on track.
 
But the whole human race does not comprehend that they do not have free-will.  They have a will based on everything that everything makes them do.  That’s their 'free' will.

When you think about this you can go crazy, because the whole thing is bizarre.

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