Church leaders

[jopie]

Hi to all of you.
I just joined the forum a few days ago, my name is John, I live in Victoria B.C. Canada.
Found the topic on tithing interesting.
I remember some years back at a Annual business meeting at the Church I used to go to,
a board member had done some statistics on tithing.
He found it rather strange that single women in the middle age bracket tithed the least.
My wife made a comment that it is easier to tithe on eighty thousand then it is on twenty thousand.
I am glad that God opened my eyes, only He knows why it took so long.
Paul says "It's for freedom you've been set free". It feels so good to be free.
The joy of the Lord comes after you've been set free.

But the real reason I am writing is that I am looking for a good Bible translation.
I have the common ones in addition to several Dutch translations, the Country I was born in.
I am on a yearly Bible reading program,
and the last two years I have been reading from the English Standard Version.
I also have a copy of the Concordant Literal New Testament.
If any of you can give me some advice I would really appreciate that.
I am glad to be part of the group.
God bless you all.
John.

[Dave in Tenn]

Hi John, and welcome to the forum.  Lots of people have said good things about Rotherhams translation.  I haven't been able to find it here in the Bible Belt USA.  No surprise there.  I'm enjoying The Amplified Bible.

If you can read on your computer, the resources at www.e-sword.com are great, with lots of different translations to choose from and compare.

[Roy Martin]

I got up this morning and saw this topic which I think is related to my thread about animosity.
I'm just a little fish in a big pond, but I'll add to this thread if no one minds.
 What I see here are reflections or dwelling on the past, questioning whats right or wrong, their heart, our heart, Babylon and more Babylon.
I use to dwell on my past and think of these things, I could have or should have done this or that, what was I thinking. The thoughts were many until I was feeling hurt, anger, and on it went. But now I dwell on the past to see where God was working and guiding every step I took. Its a joyful and peaceful feeling.
My point is this; When we start talking about the past in a negative way with the questions  and comments I have seen on this thread and many others, it stirs emotions of pain and disappointment.
There is always the bad with the good in our trials and steps in growing and learning, but if we dwell on the bad then it keeps us from seeing the good. It bogs us down with unnecessary baggage.
All the mistakes we have made in our lives are to teach us and see how God is loving and so in control of everything.
I use to talk a lot about my ex-wife, about how she cheated on me, and if I was talking to someone that has gone through it also, well it wouldn't be long until we would be out of control. All we were doing is re living the pain and never putting it behind us. Now I can talk about these things but God is the topic w/o all the other stuff that edify s nothing.
Have I made any sense here? I hope not to offend.
My past, present and future has been given to me to humble me, to be a witness of Gods glorious work and presence. How can Gods glory be seen in us by reliving our past in a negative way. Babylon this and that, motives, hearts right or wrong. I just can't see any edification in any of it. I had to ask myself, why do I keep reliving Babylon if I have came out of it?
Peace
Roy

[G. Driggs]

I got up this morning and saw this topic which I think is related to my thread about animosity.
I'm just a little fish in a big pond, but I'll add to this thread if no one minds.
 What I see here is reflections or dwelling on the past, questioning whats right or wrong, their heart, our heart.
I use to dwell on my past and think of these things, I could have or should have done this or that, what was I thinking. The thoughts were many until I was feeling hurt, anger, and on it went. But now I dwell on the past to see where God was working and guiding every step I took. Its a joyful and peaceful feeling.
My point is this; When we start talking about the past in a negative way with the questions I have seen on this thread and many others, it stirs emotions of pain and disappointment.
There is always the bad with the good in our trials and steps in growing and learning, but if we dwell on the bad then it keeps us from seeing the good. It bogs us down with unnecessary baggage.
All the mistakes we have made in our lives are to teach us and see how God is loving and so in control of everything.
I use to talk a lot about my ex-wife, about how she cheated on me, and if I was talking to someone that has gone through it also, well it wouldn't be long until we would be out of control. All we were doing is re living the pain and never putting it behind us. Now I can talk about these things but God is the topic w/o all the other stuff that edify s nothing.
Have I made any sense here? I hope not to offend.
My past, present and future has been given to me to humble me, to be a witness of Gods glorious work and presence. How can Gods glory be seen in us by reliving our past in a negative way. Babylon this and that, motives, hearts right or wrong. I just can't see any edification in any of it.
Peace
Roy

Great point Roy. I must admit, Im guilty of all that. What better place than this to have all this brought to the Light? Im not just saying that either, it is truly humbling to be exposed like that, especially in the company of BT. Be patient, I have a long way to go.

Peace, Love, G.Driggs

[aqrinc]

Hi Roy & G. Driggs,

Most forum members, who have been here and studied for a while, know that all those blinded ones, are still our brothers and sisters. What is our focus today, is not on saving anyone, that is GOD'S TO DO. We need to learn and study and grow in the revealed Truths Of The Scriptures. We need to study to show ourselves approved by GOD, not any man.

It is more like, Come out of her My People.

Rev 2: 4-6 MKJV)
4  But I have against you that you left your first love.
5  Therefore remember from where you have fallen, and repent, and do the first works, or else I will come to you quickly and will remove your lampstand out of its place unless you repent.
6  But you have this, that you hate the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate.

Rev 3: 9-11 (MKJV)
9  Behold, I give out of those of the synagogue of Satan, those saying themselves to be Jews and are not, but lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before your feet, and to know that I have loved you.
10  Because you have kept the Word of My patience, I also will keep you from the hour of temptation which will come upon all the habitable world, to try those who dwell upon the earth.
11  Behold, I come quickly. Hold fast to that which you have, so that no one may take your crown.

Rev 14: 8-11 (CLV)
8 And another, a second messenger, (Angel) follows, saying, "It falls! It falls! Babylon the great has made all nations drink of the wine of the fury of her prostitution!"

9 And another, a third messenger, follows them, saying with a loud voice, "If anyone is worshiping the wild beast and its image, and is getting an emblem on his forehead or on his hand,

10 he, also, is drinking of the wine of the fury of God, blended undiluted in the cup of His indignation, and he shall be tormented in fire and sulphur in the sight of the holy messengers and in the sight of the Lambkin."

11 And the fumes of their torment are ascending for the eons of the eons. And they are having no rest day and night, those worshiping the wild beast and its image, and if anyone is getting the emblem of its name."


Rev 18: 1-5 (CLV)
1 After these things I perceived another messenger descending out of heaven, having great authority. And the earth is illuminated by his glory."

2 And he cries with a strong voice, saying, "It falls! It falls! Babylon the great! And it became the dwelling place of demons and the jail of every unclean spirit and the cage of every unclean and hateful bird,

3 for, as a result of the wine of the fury of her prostitution have all the nations fallen. And the kings of the earth commit prostitution with her ,and the merchants of the earth are rich as a result of her power to indulge."

4 And I hear another voice out of heaven, saying, "Come out of her, My people, lest you should be joint participants in her sins, and lest you should be getting of her calamities,
5 for her sins were piled up to heaven, and God remembers her injuries."

george.

[Roy Martin]

Exactly George, but also, forgive and move on, learn, and study, and grow in the Truths of the Scriptures. Study to show ourselves approved by God. Forgive and move on. Let it go. See the good.

Peace
Roy

[Roy Martin]

Bob, thank you for your words and wisdom and gentleness in your delivery.
I would like to hear more from you.

Roy

[bunnylife]

I have been reading on this subject and the one about animosity. I believe that Daddy God had planned our all our lives to picking out our parents, siblings or not, schools everything knowing what our choices would be in all situations... that He was molding us and preparing us. When we starting attending churches He knew who the leaders would be and they were blind. I believe through all of this that Daddy God used all of it for His glory. He knew when He call us we would respond to His voice.. His sheep and come out. George and Roy are right we have to have forgiveness in our heart. There is no point on dwelling on the past.. we have to move on. We love those people.. we hate the message of hell and tithing.. all the doctrines of men. I know that Jesus had harsh words to say to the pharisees, scribes, the others... I know also that Jesus loved them. He died for them too. He forgave them and loved them.. so must we.

I can not go back. I hope and pray to stay close to Daddy God that I would not become blind again. The past in our lives are to be like Ebenezer stones.. to see where Daddy, Father God has brought us from, to learn from it and to give Him all the glory.

We are the beast, the sinner but if we just focus on that all the time then we are not focusing on Daddy God. He is the only one that can change us through His spirit. I do see in the NT where in Romans we are called the sinner but later in the NT they are called saints. Not that we forget we are the beast but quickly repent ask forgiveness and move on to the next lesson the our wonderful Father has for us.

What has all this to do with church leaders? It was a necessary step in our growth in being made into the image of God. But knowing this wonderful truth of the Gospel and study it will do us no good if we don't walk it out in our lives bearing fruit of the spirit.

In His Love,
Bunni

[aqrinc]

Sometimes we really need to pay attention to the words we use. From all the counsel being given, it would appear that some are being highminded or haughty about the knowledge given to us By GOD.

I say it would appear, not it is happening; because if we can discern between the object (hate sinning) and subject (sinner), then we are in accord with Scripture.

Their is no place in Scripture that i have read, where GOD instructs us to love sinning. 

Pro 24: 23-25 (CLV)
23 These also are sayings of the wise:To be biased in judgment is never good.
24 He who says to the wicked man, You are righteous--The people shall revile him; the populace shall be indignant toward him."

25 Yet for those who reprove, it shall be pleasant, And on them shall come the blessing of good.

Rom 12: 6-10 (CLV)
6  God has also given each of us different gifts to use. If we can prophesy, we should do it according to the amount of faith we have.
7  If we can serve others, we should serve. If we can teach, we should teach.

8  If we can encourage others, we should encourage them. If we can give, we should be generous. If we are leaders, we should do our best. If we are good to others, we should do it cheerfully.

9  Be sincere in your love for others. Hate everything that is evil and hold tight to everything that is good.

10  Love each other as brothers and sisters and honor others more than you do yourself.

george.