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journey to confusion - my letter to Ray
9440geoff:
Thank you Carol for sharing your heart with us. Thank you Ray for your response, and thank you Dennis for making it happen.
It's great when we read about good news on the forum, but the reality is that we all have our cross to bear. The good news about that is that our Lord knows exactly what we're going through, He is with us in our suffering, and is interceding for us with our Father.
Rom 8:18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
Geoff
Amrhrasach:
I’ve hesitated to post since yesterday morning, probably shouldn’t still. God gave 2 ears 1 mouth, so I’m attempting to live by “shut up every chance you get”, which is good course for someone who understands very little of Gods ways.
Carol thank you for your post. Your words have been ringing in my head, and will continue. Sometimes it sure seems like God has lost his eyesight and his hearing.
Ray I know you don’t read the forum and that makes me sad because you won’t know how grateful I am to God for you and your wisdom, courage and inspiration and your generosity.
And to M.G., thank you for these words:
--- Quote from: M.G. on August 14, 2009, 04:17:34 AM ---
"I know people who seem to just pull things right out of the air and understand them. I am not one of those. I break everything down in a million pieces and then put it back in a box that is understandable to me. I have had to wait until God answered my hard questions to put in that piece. I learn the hard way. It took me 5 years to learn that there is no free will. Piece by little piece. Circumstance by circumstance. Suffering and more suffering.
I felt insane most of that time and confusion was screaming at me. My faith was attacked every step of the way. God pulled the rug out from under my reality. When I found BT God pulled the rug out even more."
--- End quote ---
Right to the heart of the matter M.G., thank you, I could search for a long time to find the right words but you said it perfect. Now I know I’m not insane. Now I know there is life after confusion and that, hopefully, the next train stop is at this point:
--- Quote from: M.G. on August 14, 2009, 04:17:34 AM ---
I learned that a lot of those hard questions were the flaming arrows of the evil one that were used to attack God's character. They put fear and doubt in my heart. Even this was all a process in my life to strengthen me. I learned to not doubt God even though I didn't have the answer yet. I learned that God is good even though some things make him look bad from our limited sight. I learned that all my thoughts that attacked God's character were not of God. The wrestling I went through was my carnal man wrestling against the will of God.
--- End quote ---
Gary
firefly77:
Hi to all who have contributed to this thread; I appreciate everyone's honesty and transparency... I can so relate!
--- Quote ---I felt insane most of that time and confusion was screaming at me. My faith was attacked every step of the way. God pulled the rug out from under my reality. When I found BT God pulled the rug out even more."
Right to the heart of the matter M.G., thank you, I could search for a long time to find the right words but you said it perfect. Now I know I’m not insane. Now I know there is life after confusion and that, hopefully, the next train stop is at this point:
--- End quote ---
After 4 years of confusion, I am finally arriving at a place where everything is making more sense than it ever has. Just reading that others have had this "insane" feeling in the beginning makes me feel not so alone. It is good to be part of this wonderful group.
Angie
carol v:
I read Ray's response yesterday. Thank you Dennis. I would like to thank Ray especially and all those here. Your comments and scriptures mean a lot to me.
I wish I had mentioned in my original email that this woman in San Antonio is schizophrenic -- a point which nullifies the usual debate over free will v. God's sovereignty. This woman made no choice.
She also said that "the devil made her do it." But the only one I see sending evil spirits in scripture is God. To me, the devil is a non-entity in the overall scheme of things. God is sovereign.
Ray's letter was beautiful though and please thank him for me Dennis. I would love to sign up for the November conference.
Samson -- you have done NOTHING to cause me any stress. I did not mean my comments about the forum to be personal to anyone. It's the debating of scripture I am weary of.
Looking for heretics and babylonians under every bush has made me unloving, impatient and self-righteous at times.
Bluzman -- I'm a believer in oxygen. Haven't tried a tank but I do a miracle of a little workout called Oxycise. Doesn't help my headaches much but it has made me lose weight and feel better. It's great for everyone and even those with bad knees or feet can get all the cardio and muscle toning they want. No equipment, no shoes, no sweating, and ladies, you don't even have to wear a bra. 15 MINUTES A DAY!
Ray -- I am still confused about how we are "receiving evil at the hand of God" yet God is guilty of no crime. I don't know who or what is responsible for the death of this baby but the mother is the last person I would blame. A schizophrenic with post partum depression cannot be held responsible. Yet I know these are questions that confuse us all.
And where is the line between "not agreeing on every issue" and heresy. I look forward to discussing all these things with you at the conference.
ericsteven -- WOW. I love the Habbakuk scriptures. I will mark those scriptures in my Bible if I ever open it again. (a little joke, very little)
MG, I've got to say that your situation only makes me more depressed -- I know you have been praying fervently for all those years.
What does it mean that with the faith of a mustard seed, you can move a mountain? We don't have faith?
God definitely has a sense of humor though. In the midst of it all I have such terrible menopausal symptoms that I could cry at a picture of a kitten -- and I am a dog person!!
Okay, I'm as tired of my wallowing in self-pity as you guys must be of listening to my wallowing. Whew. I really hope to attend the conference and will hope that Ray's health will allow him to be there.
I heard a country-western song yesterday that kind of sums it up...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqrogegV1lw
Amen.
Love you all,
Carol
Vangie:
Hi Carol,
I LIKE that song--it is upbeat in spite of the fact that "people are crazy". Or maybe because of it..God is great, beer is good--like you said, that sums it up. No need to give the "people are crazy" bit a whole lot more credence, as we don't have a say at all regarding that. I've been there (psycho land) myself, and who knows what God has in store for the schizophrenic San Antonio lady. I pray she gets the opportunity to experience the opposite of where she is now. I'm so thankful that my eyes and ears are being opened daily, as but for the grace of God, I could have done the same type of heinous acts that she did to her own child back in that era when I was out of it. And regarding the baby, I'd like to think that the saying "God never gives us more than we can handle" applies to children as well. When pain nears the point of unbearable, He takes either it, or the one experiencing it, away. No need to doubt His sovereignty regarding us--we are all His children and He loves us. It is not our place to step in for our God.
I pray that it is God's will to take your headaches and your pain away so that you can feel His Love above the heartache and disgust with the world you are experiencing. I think Ray's reply speaks volumes to all of us and I really thank you for being so straight up about where you are right now. I hope I'm not offending you by sharing my thoughts.
Love to you in Christ,
Vangie
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