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Luke 1:35
Marlene:
All, I can say to this is that what Kat posted just boggles my mind. We really do need to take time and read the scriptures. I have read 2 John many times.
But, what really gets me is how Ray found that verse that blows the trinity away. It is not good enough just to read the scriptures we need to meditate upon them all.
We know that Joseph did not create Jesus. So, I have no problem with Jesus coming out of his Father. Because he did. I actually think people who believe in the Trinity see something that is not there. They believe a lie. It never made sense to me. But, the scriptures Ray has shown on this paper and other papers speaks volumes to me, that Jesus is no mere man.
In His Love,
Marlene
Kat:
Hi Micah7:9,
--- Quote ---I have to believe that Joseph and Mary had intercourse and had a baby, Jesus, for the lineage,
--- End quote ---
Thinking of the immaculate conception, you would think the lineage that Christ need to come through Joseph? Well actually there is an explanation and that is not necessarily so. Here is an email about that.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php?topic=3811.0 ---
Dear Ray,
I'm stumped. Genealogies (several in the O.T. and the 2 in the N.T.) It's not so much that they are culturally male oriented as it is that they are jumping generations, names, etc. here and there. This makes a messy timeline. But more importantly;
Mary(mother of Jesus) has no genealogical record that I have found. She was of Abraham (obviously) and may have been of the line of Aaron ... but of David, I don't know?? We know of Joseph as was customary. Yet Jesus was conceived by the Holy Ghost. Praise God! Point: wouldn't it be important to know Jesus' human lineage?
Thanks,
Josh
Dear Josh:
Apparently, Luke's account IS Mary's genealogy.
King James reads: "...the son of Joseph which was the son of Heli" (Luke 3:23).
Rotherham: "...the son of Joseph of Heli."
Concordant: "...being a son (as to the law) of Joseph, of Eli, of Matthat, of Levi.
Now then, "son of" is clearly not in the Greek, and so it is not necessarily fitting that
it should be supplied by the translators in this case.
Joseph in Matthew's genealogy of Jesus is not the "son of Heli" but rather Jacob (Matt. 1:16).
And so this could be a case such as we find in Deut. 25:5-6--"If brethren dwell together, and one of them die, and have no child, the wife of the dead shall not marry without unto a stranger: her HUSBAND'S BROTHER shall go in unto her, and take her to him to wife, and perform the duty of an husband's brother unto her. And it shall be, that the firstborn which she bears shall succeed IN THE NAME OF HIS BROTHER which is dead, that his name be not put out of Israel."
And so Heli may have been a "son IN LAW" rather than "a son." And this could be Mary's genealogy back to Solomon where they apparently merge again with Joseph's line. It is quite complicated. Theologians have made a life study of the genealogies, and their are several theories extant.
Don't ask me any more questions on genealogy, as I really do have more important things to write about, but it is an interesting question.
God be with you,
Ray
barrabus:
I think the term Holy Spirit in Luke 1:35 is referring to the spirit of God. I don't think it is a name for a separate entity... simple as that... even today it would be hard to explain something like that... just imagine how it would be to have every word you wrote to be discected and examined... I try to keep it as simple as I can... I still feel that one of the fundamental beliefs I have is that Jesus was born of a virgin... and that is one of the things that made him differant... not just a great man, or a prophet... I am afraid to write too much on this subject right now because I know so little... I have learned a lot during the last year reading on this forum and a lot of my ways of interpreting the scriptures have changed... I no longer blindly accept what I hear or read ... I pray for God to help me discern what is true... I realize that a virgin birth is incomprehensable to some... I think the whole concept of God is incomprehensable to the human mind... the evidence of creation all around us being created from nothing... way beyond comprehension... just the fact that I got where I'm at today from where I was at a few years ago is incomprehensable, you don't get here from there... sorry for straying from the subject...
Dave in Tenn:
Barrabus, it sounds to me that on these points you are in agreement with Scripture and Ray. Jesus was born of a Virgin.
"Immaculate Conception" is a theological (not a scriptural) term and therefor, by definition, confusing.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immaculate_Conception
I do not believe in the Immaculate Conception either. Let's get our terms straight.
barrabus:
Thank you... I guess I don't believe in the Immaculate Conception either...
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