> General Discussions

Institution or Christ Followers Meeting

(1/3) > >>

aqrinc:

With all the questions coming from members, this latest answer from Ray, can be helpful to clear up some basic misunderstandings about differences at BT from being a Church follower. Please note the reason for this is not to ridicule any person or Church group, but to have some healthy discussion, as we get a check-up from the neck-up.

I Highlited 5 of Rays points that stand out as bedrock in most Institutions with some variation.

Dear  :) :) :):  This will have to be short as I am hopelessly behind in answering my emails.
 
"Institution" means something that is usually highly developed with laws and customs approved of by larger segments of a culture or society.  Or any smaller such
institute which follows the teachings and practices of a larger institution.
 
There are tens of thousands of small and very small congregations of "Christians" around the world.  Most all of them, however, follow the pattern and customs of the
larger well established Churches.  If your church follows and practices such laws, customs, and teaching, then you are an institutionalize church of men.
In Christendom, there is not one teaching or doctrine that is completely Scriptural.  Virtually all churches believing in and teach the following unscriptural doctrines:
 
Tithing is Biblical for the New Testament Church.
Sunday is the "Lord's Day" of worship.
Man has an immortal soul.
Death is LIFE at a different location.
Judgment takes place instantly at death, hence all dead people go immediately to heaven or hell at death.
The wicked and unbelieving will suffer eternal torment (in a Christian hell).
Jesus will not save the world even though that is what His Father commissioned Him to do (I John 4:14).
Resurrection is a useless doctrine, seeing that people supposedly go to heaven at death without first being resurrected.
Christmas and Easter are Biblically sanctioned holy days.
God is a Trinity of three different persons.
Prayer changes God's mind.

What Christians are "saved" from is an eternal hell of torture.
Salvation means going to heaven.
God gave mankind "free will/free choice/free moral agency."

Anyone can repent and come to Jesus anytime he chooses.

Speaking in tongues is the sign that one is a truly converted Christian.
It is a virtue to become a soldier and kill our nation's enemies.
The King James Bible is inerrant.

The Apostle's Creed is a true outline of Scriptural truth.

Jesus was wrong when He called His followers a LITTLE flock, seeing that Christianity is the LARGEST flock in the world, and the "many called but few chosen" is now the "many chosen" seeing that there are now two billion Christians in the world.

There are many things that God desires, but will never realize, even though the Scriptures tell us that God will fulfill ALL his pleasure and desires.

According to Genesis chapter one, the heavens and earth are only about 6000 years old.
Noah's flood killed every living thing on earth except those things in the ark.

Etc., etc., etc.
 
If your group teaches and believes the above unscriptural heresies, then they are an "Institutionalized Church" of men.
Let me know how your teachings stack up against what I have presented to you.

God be with you,
Ray.

george :).

Roy Coates:
On my leaving and after being asked by the Senior pastor, i gave a futile attempt to point these things out to him. I even used his own teachings that "If you want to better understand the pastor look to his pastor and his pastor's pastor" after much investigating I showed him if you follow the pastors it eventually leads to teaching that even he disagreed with. I found that he taught all the same things some time with a slight twist to make it look like he had found the truth. I even spent a year in a bible college that he had obtained his Doctorate from. It was awful, I was seeing the hearsay but as surrounded by blind leading the blind. The other thing I pointed out was that even one of his associate pastors was teaching a doctrine "speaking in tongues is the only way to prove you have the Holy Spirit" that the pastor open disagreed with. I said you support this pastor yet you disagree with his teaching, that his hypocrisy. He just didn't see the trouble with such a practice. It didn't matter much anyway, I could see the error in both. I don't begrudge any of them, it is all part of God's plan.

arion:
The humbling thing is that I used to believe most if not all of those points and I could twist the scripture to support these fallacies and I had no idea that I was believing and teaching error.  I am so thankful for Ray but the fact is that Ray did not teach me these truths.  God opened my spiritual heart and eyes to receive them and the teaching came through Ray.  If God didn't do a work in me then I would have rejected everything I have read here.  I do get angry as I see Christians belittle the truths that we now hold dear but God has changed me so that I'm not angry at the person any more but I'm angry at the blindness.  And just about every time I come across such resistance the spirit witnesses to me that I am no better than they are because I believed the same as they for most of my adult life.  The truths that are shared here certainly can change your whole perception of who God really is and what his nature really is and this knowledge is liberating.  'Who the son sets free is free indeed!!'

Samson:
Yes George,

                 That was a good Email response by Ray. Just believe the opposite of that list of what the Denominations of Christendom believes and you get another review of Basic BT Truths taught at this Site,  ;)

                                Thanks, Samson.

Deborah-Leigh:
Hello George

It brought to mind other things we have been shown through Ray in LOF part 2.
THEY SPEAK WITH FORKED TONGUE

Most all Christian theologians would claim to believe the first statement of Scriptural Truth that I present below, especially when I cite a Scripture verse with it, but they will then contradict and refuse to teach the second statement of Truth. Here are a few examples:

Do they believe the fire in I Cor.3:15 burns mans’ works, but not the man himself? Yes.

But do they teach that this same fire in Rev.20:15 also burns works, not the man? No.

Do they believe that God is the Creator of ALL? Yes.

But do they teach that God created EVIL as He says in (Isa. 45:7)? No.

Do they believe that God is absolutely and totally sovereign (Eph. 1:11)? Yes.

But do they teach that God exercises sovereignty over man’s supposed "free" will? No.

Do they believe that Jesus Christ IS the Saviour of the whole world (I Jn 4:14)? Yes.

But do they teach that Jesus Christ will SAVE the whole world? No.

Do they believe that presently Christ only has immortality (I Tim. 6:16)? Yes.

But do they teach the truth therefore that men’s souls are mortal and not immortal? No.

Do they believe that the original manuscripts of God’s Word were inerrant? Yes.

But do they teach us that the King James translation, which they say is "inerrant" has gone through THOUSANDS of error corrections since 1611? No.

Do they believe that the soul that sins shall DIE (Ezek. 18:4)? Yes.

But do they teach that souls of deceased sinners are actually DEAD? No.

Do they believe there are many cults today that need exposing? Yes.

But do they teach that Christendom, by its OWN definitions, is also a cult? No.

Do they believe that Sodom is "suffering the vengeance of eternal [aeonian] fire? Yes.

But do they teach that Sodom will be restored to their former estate (Ezek. 16:55)? No.

Do they believe in a future resurrection of dead people back to life (John 5:29)? Yes.

But do they teach that a resurrection is imperative for dead people to live again? No.

Do they believe the first half of I Cor. 15:22 that "For as in Adam ALL die?" Yes.

But do they teach the last half, "even so in Christ shall ALL be made alive?" No.

Do they believe that "...the end of the world [Gk: aion -- age]" ends in Mat. 24:3? Yes.

But do they teach that this same "aion -- age" in Matt. 25:41 & 46 will also end. No.

Do they believe that Jn 3:13 & Acts 2:34 are truthful Scripture (II Tim. 3:16)? Yes.

But do they teach this truth that "NO man," including David, has gone to heaven? No.

Do they believe ALL God purposed, spoke, and willed (Isa. 46:10-11), He will do? Yes.

But do they teach that God’s "will" to save all, I Tim. 2:4, etc., will be done? No.

Do they believe that Satan lied when he told Eve, "thou shalt not surely die?" Yes.

But do they teach the truth that sinners really do DIE at death as God has stated? No.

Do they believe that the Apocryphal books do not belong in the Bible? Yes.

But do they teach us that the 1611 so-called "inerrant" King James Bible contained fourteen such books, including "Tobit," "Judith," "The idol Bel and the Dragon"? No.

Do they believe that Christ is totally responsibility for our salvation? Yes.

But do they teach that "no man can" come to Christ of himself (John 6:44)? No.

Do they believe that Satan is the greatest sinner of all? Yes.

But do they teach Jn. 8:44 which states that Satan "sinned from the beginning?" No.

Do they believe Christ really died for the sins of the world? Yes.

But do they teach that Jesus Christ was dead when they placed Him in the tomb? No.

Do they believe the many Scriptures that liken death to "sleep?" Yes.

But do they teach that dead people are unconscious, "sleeping" till resurrection? No.

Do they believe that the last enemy to be destroyed [Gk: abolished] is death? Yes.

But do they teach that ALL death, including the second death, will be abolished? No.

Do they believe that all things are possible with God (Mark 10:27)? Yes.

But do they teach that it is possible for God to save nonbelievers after they die? No.

Do they believe that every tongue in heaven and earth will confess Jesus as LORD? Yes.

But do they teach that the Holy Spirit inspires this sincere voluntary act (I Cor. 12:3)? No.

Do they believe that good and evil are both in the same tree of knowledge? Yes

But do they teach that good and evil both come from the same root source? No.

Do they believe that God absolutely "knows all" (I John 3:20)? Yes.

But do they teach that God knows in advance ALL who will reject Christ? No.

Do they believe that God’s love will never fail (I Cor. 13:8)? Yes.

But do they teach that God’s love will never fail in saving the world He loves? No.

Do they believe the apostles spoke in foreign languages in Acts 2:4-11? Yes.

But do they teach that of the hundreds of thousands who claim to speak in tongues today, not one of them can speak in multiple languages which they did not already study? No.

Do they believe that the masses did not understand Christ’s parables (Mat. 13:13)? Yes.

But do they teach that Christ purposely didn’t want them to understand, (Vs. 14-17)? No.

Do they believe the Old Covenant contained the Ten Commandments (Deut.4:12)? Yes.

But do they teach a New Covenant which contains a much higher law (Heb. 8:8-9)? No.

Do they believe that God created all the spirits and messengers of heaven? Yes.

But do they teach that God also created Satan who was always His adversary? No.

Do they believe that loving our enemies means doing good and not evil to them? Yes.

But do they teach that God will never subject His enemies to eternal torture and evil? No.

There seems to be no end to the Scriptural contradictions of Christian beliefs. But we can learn from their mistakes. It is good for us that God makes us dig deep for the precious gems of His word. It really is like searching for hidden treasure. And I have never found a hidden treasure in God’s Word that has disappointed me. Each new discovery brings more appreciation for God and His plan of salvation for all.

Navigation

[0] Message Index

[#] Next page