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Author Topic: spirit bodies-vs spirit  (Read 3942 times)

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gallenwalsh

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spirit bodies-vs spirit
« on: March 07, 2010, 11:03:26 AM »

I have heard Ray say that we will eventually have spirit bodies, we will not be spirits. Which made me start thinking about God and Gods spirit. I have also heard that God is a spirit and that his spirit fills everything and is everywhere all at once and that the heavens and heavens heavens cannot contain him.So, if Christ has a spirit body as well, Does the Father have  a Body? Or is he just a gigantic spirit that is everywhere?Sounds rather childish even as I write this but it just got me thinking about Christ and the Father and their differences.
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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2010, 11:09:31 AM »

Hi gallenwalsh

Just for starters, God is not a Spirit. God IS SPIRIT. :)

There is much more to add to your question. I expect others will come forward to help reply to you more fully. :)

Arc
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Kat

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2010, 12:41:52 PM »


Hi Gallenwalsh,

Here is an excerpt from the transcript of 'The Father's Will' Mobile conference 06.

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3720.msg27960.html#msg27960 ---

where is God? in heaven?  Well, where is heaven?  Waaay up there?
He is not far from any one of us, but what does that have to do with the theory, you have to go worship in a church or on this day or that day? He is not far from any of us! We donít pay attention to the words.
 
GOD IS SPIRIT, but nowhere in scripture does it say, God is a Spirit, God is Spirit.
 
v. 28 ďFor in Him we live, and move, and have our being (we exist in Him), as certain even of your own poets have said, for we are also His offspring.Ē
v
So letís think about this a little bit, who is the Father?  In Him we live and breath and have our being.  Liken the ocean to the Spirit of God, and liken us to the fish.  The fish are 95% water, the ocean is in the fish, and the fish are in the ocean, get it.
A bird has very porous bones, because they have to be very light.  It flies in the heavens, it breaths fast, because it needs strength and oxygen.  So the air (which is like the Spirit of God, which is what he calls it in the NT, Greek word for spirit is pheuma), the expanse is even called heaven, where the bird flies, and liken the air to the Spirit of God.  The bird has air in him and is flying through the air.

Now this is what the Scriptures say, we are in God and God is in us.  So, get it out of your head that God is a man, sitting on a stone throne, like Abraham Lincoln in Washington D.C., an old man with gray hair.  God is right here, it (Bible) says so, we have to just listen to the words.

God is Spirit, it also says God is invisible, you canít see Him, not literally.  We can see Him in Spirit, as in our heart, in our mind, our soul, our spirit, in our innermost being.
 
The thing that makes us different from plants and other animals, is we can see God.  Iím trying to help you right now, to see God.  So when you leave here, you will see God in a way you didnít, when you walked in here.  If God opens it up to you, I can only tell you, but God must open it up for you to grasp it.
 
God is here, not here because we are here, but He was here before we got here and Heíll still be after we leave.  Because this desk is here and this desk has it's cohesion in Jesus Christ.  It is through Jesus Christ that this desk holds together or it would fall apart.  It takes energy and power, what is the source of the power, Jesus Christ, which comes from the Father and itís passed off out of Him.  One Father, one God, all and everything is out of Him.  GOD IS ALMIGHTY!
v
Weíre in Him and Heís in us, because Heís Spirit.  Not a Spirit, in some geographical location.  The reason God knows everything, is in all places at all times, is because thatís where He is.  Heís Spirit and He refers to Himself as Spirit.  My Spirit is here, there and everywhere.
v
David was inspired to write, where can I go to get away from you God, up to heaven, down to sheol, (Psalms 139:7-12).
Thereís no place I can go, where you are not.  Why?  God is Spirit, God is not a man, get that out of your head.  He (God) tells us that, God is not a man... Jesus Christ is a man.

Where is God?  EVERYWHERE!
If you're in a life raft, out in the middle of the ocean, you donít have to cry out to God, to help you.  God can see you, in the big ocean.  Heís there, whether Heíll help, thatís a different story.  But He is there.

I clipped this saying years ago and pasted it in the front of my Bible,

          'Thy ocean, O Lord, is so great and my boat is so small.'

Itís the truth, we are pretty small in the universe.  Everything is out of God.
----------------------------------------------------------

mercy, peace and love
Kat
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gallenwalsh

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2010, 01:57:23 PM »

Most excellent, I like it ! God is spirit. Is Christ spirit or a man or both ? Christ was not always a man ? But became a man and is now a spirit once again? As we have seen him he has a spiritual body or did have a spiritual body I am confused. When we see Christ we will be like him in what way ? Character or composition or both ?
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mharrell08

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2010, 02:12:34 PM »

Most excellent, I like it ! God is spirit. Is Christ spirit or a man or both ? Christ was not always a man ? But became a man and is now a spirit once again? As we have seen him he has a spiritual body or did have a spiritual body I am confused. When we see Christ we will be like him in what way ? Character or composition or both ?


1 Cor 3:17  Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty

1. Yes, Christ is spirit but also a man or male [1 Tim 2:5].

2. I don't know why you would think Christ was not always a man.

3. Yes, He emptied Himself, not to become a man, but for the purpose of dying [Phil 2:8] and was raised in a spiritual body as We, who continue in the faith, will do at His coming.

4. Yes, He was raised in a spiritual body, with power (changed appearance, go through solid objects, be 'like the wind' [John 3:8]).

5. Yes, we will 'see Him as He is' and we will be 'like Him' in character and spiritual body with power. But Christ will always be preminent and is King of Kings (that's us, the KingS).


Hope this helps,

Marques
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Roy Coates

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #5 on: March 08, 2010, 03:05:38 AM »


2. I don't know why you would think Christ was not always a man.

Marques

I thought prior to His birth via Mary that Jesus was not a man. Please expound on this I am curious
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mharrell08

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #6 on: March 08, 2010, 07:18:41 AM »

I thought prior to His birth via Mary that Jesus was not a man. Please expound on this I am curious


Or rather 'male'...what do you believe He was before He was made flesh? What scriptures refer to Him as female?
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gallenwalsh

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2010, 09:38:53 AM »

I do not think I am alone in thinking that Christ was "something else" before he became flesh. When I think of Christ as a "MAN" I think of him as "HUMAN", FLESH and blood.To me flesh and blood is "MAN". Christ always refers to us as "HUMAN" or MAN in a condescending way as to remind us of our inferiority before him.I think I am totally confused regarding Christ and who and what he is then.Although that concept is a real mind opener! Can anyone expound on this a little more, please? Any insights on the Female image of GOD ? I'd love to hear about it.
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Roy Coates

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #8 on: March 08, 2010, 10:41:27 AM »

I was thinking human man/male. prior to the birth via mary I was thinking Spirit
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mharrell08

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #9 on: March 08, 2010, 11:12:03 AM »

I was thinking human man/male. prior to the birth via mary I was thinking Spirit


And as Spirit, does He not refer to Himself as male? Has the Lord ever referred to Himself as a 'she' or any other female attribute?

How many times has the Lord referred to Himself as a husband?


This is the line of thinking when I stated male. I believe He possessed femininity, as all is of Him. But He is always referred to as a male (He, His, Him, etc.). Even when Adam still possessed the 'rib' which was used to make Eve, Adam was still referred to as 'he, his, him'.

But this is really not an issue that I believe is worth debate so hopefully this thread doesn't go in that direction.


Marques
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Roy Coates

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #10 on: March 08, 2010, 03:06:55 PM »

No Debate,  I misunderstood This question."2. I don't know why you would think Christ was not always a man."


 Because we know before He was a man he was. I didn't mean to imply he was anything ther than a man/male but Spirit prior to bith by Mary.

I agree that "He possessed femininity"

My line of thinking was albiet it was based on a misunderstanding was
: I don't know why you would think Christ was not always a man[human]? Because He wasn't always human.

Sorry for the confusion

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Dave in Tenn

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #11 on: March 08, 2010, 04:30:18 PM »

Hi Gallenwalsh.  I don't think anybody can answer 'what is the nature of God' in a forum post.  But maybe this will nudge you decently.

Male and Female created He them.  He created humanity to be male and female.  Despite what theology says, God doesn't create things out of nothing.  He creates things which are 'seen' out of that which cannot be 'seen'.  What is it that cannot be 'seen'?  Spirit is what cannot be 'seen'.  God is Spirit.  God created 'male and female' out of Himself.  How could He create 'female' or 'male' except He possessed 'femininity' and 'masculinity'? 

Ray talks about this in greater detail and with fuller scriptural proof, but I can't remember where.  Maybe another member does and will post.  There's not only more to it 'doctrinally', but much more to it Spiritually, the surface I'm just beginning to scratch.

Roy, I know you weren't talking of Christ being literally 'female' before He became flesh. 

Just one more thing I want to share.  We can discuss the Nature of God all day long.  We can strive to know God better and better.  These are good things.  But on this path to 'enlightenment', somewhere, somehow, we have to do what they did in Scripture.  Time after time, when THEY finally recognized Him more fully, they fell down and worshipped Him.  When we see Him as He is, that's when life begins to change.  This has to happen in Spirit and in Truth, not visibly, or 'religiously'.  We have precious little idea how big and smart our God is. 



 
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Heb 10:32  But you must continue to remember those earlier days, how after you were enlightened you endured a hard and painful struggle.

Joel

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #12 on: March 08, 2010, 08:55:47 PM »

Its easy for me to think of God as Spirit, and Jesus as the Word.
I and My Father are ONE.
Can you separate yourself from your word?
God thinks, and speaks Jesus the Word to us.
The letter or the Word kills, add THE SPIRIT to the Word and it makes it alive.
Of course Jesus was, and is the Word make flesh.
We all think in our words, in our minds before we speak don't we?  :)
unless, maybe we are running off at the mouth.  :-[
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markn902

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #13 on: March 08, 2010, 10:10:46 PM »

I thought prior to His birth via Mary that Jesus was not a man. Please expound on this I am curious


Or rather 'male'...what do you believe He was before He was made flesh? What scriptures refer to Him as female?

I took that question as being not about gender but rather about WHAT Jesus was before he became a Human Person. Before He was born to Mary what was HE? What did He exist as? and what did He do?

I'm not answering this question just clarifying it. I'll leave the answering to someone else...
« Last Edit: March 08, 2010, 10:12:12 PM by markn902 »
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mharrell08

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #14 on: March 08, 2010, 10:18:39 PM »

I took that question as being not about gender but rather about WHAT Jesus was before he became a Human Person. Before He was born to Mary what was HE? What did He exist as? and what did He do?

I'm not answering this question just clarifying it. I'll leave the answering to someone else...


I don't really understand what or if there is a question anymore and who is asking. Where is this going again, for clarification sakes?
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markn902

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Re: spirit bodies-vs spirit
« Reply #15 on: March 08, 2010, 11:04:06 PM »

Actually I am editing this because my question ( which I was interjecting into someone elses question) is off topic from the OPs question.  :) if that makes any sense! So I'll just leave it at that
« Last Edit: March 08, 2010, 11:51:18 PM by markn902 »
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