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God Knows All?
Joel:
Hi Claypot, Welcome!
Did God see me welcome you to this forum?
Of course He did, Seriously WELCOME, and I know you will find Gods answers here if you apply yourself.
If he dragged you here, who are you to resist God?
If we don't believe God knows everthing, down to the most minute detail such as the smallest atom particles. That Jesus didn't know before hand the suffering he was to endure, down to the very last detail.
Then we ALL are calling God a liar, and my He have mercy on those that do so.
Nothing wrong with questioning God, He can handle it.
Does it matter what we BELIEVE? absolutely.
Joel
claypot:
--- Quote from: Joel on March 21, 2010, 09:08:43 AM ---Hi Claypot, Welcome!
Did God see me welcome you to this forum?
Of course He did, Seriously WELCOME, and I know you will find Gods answers here if you apply yourself.
If he dragged you here, who are you to resist God?
If we don't believe God knows everthing, down to the most minute detail such as the smallest atom particles. That Jesus didn't know before hand the suffering he was to endure, down to the very last detail.
Then we ALL are calling God a liar, and my He have mercy on those that do so.
Nothing wrong with questioning God, He can handle it.
Does it matter what we BELIEVE? absolutely.
Joel
--- End quote ---
Thanks Joel. I am learning so much right now I literally feel as if my head and heart may explode…..in a good way. You all are great. I never expected such good and just amazing responses and so fast. I am in awe! I have more questions or at least desire to be more specific in the questions I already asked and questions that have been generated within me by all the responses. Man, I love this! I do get burned out at times but currently God has me on a learning roll and I do love it! I’m going to respond to Arc now, thanks again, Joel.
cp
mharrell08:
--- Quote from: claypot on March 21, 2010, 08:41:31 AM ---Marq, That was excellent and your brief comment at the end helped more than you will know, or maybe you will know one 'day'.
I have discovered and am listening to LRS's free will video. It is good. If I were in the room with him I would ask this question.....
LRS (L Ray Smith) showed the verse in James about when we are drawn away by our lusts then we sin. LRS is saying it not of God that we sin but it is of our own lusts which I do see in operation in Eve before she ate of the tree.
My question is, who is in control or who or what creates the circumstances that form my lusts?
--- End quote ---
Matt 15:18-20 Those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man. For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: These are the things which defile a man...
Luke 6:45 A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.
It is from our heart that we desire the lusts of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life [1 John 2:16]. It is God who creates us in this spiritual weak condition:
Rom 8:20 For the creature [creation; all mankind] was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope
Jer 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked [Heb. 'exceedingly weak']: who can know it?
--- Quote from: claypot on March 21, 2010, 08:41:31 AM ---Am I correct is saying that it would be God Himself? As I gleaned from your words it is God who is subjecting us to this amazingly horrible amount of evil. God is actually creating the environment that form my lusts like Eve in the garden.
Scriputure says that God tempts no one yet am I correct in assuming God orchestrates events that cause temptation to come to us?
I will be reading and re-reading your previous post as I sense God is talking to me but the voice is so small I am only getting a bit of it now.
cp
--- End quote ---
James 1:13-14 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
Yes, James explains in the very next verse regarding God not tempting any man to evil. Every man is drawn by his/her own lust, though God does send those who do tempt:
Excerpt from Lake of Fire Part 16-D1 (http://bible-truths.com/lake16-D1.htm):
Am I saying that God Himself deceives people? No, I never came up with any such teaching - I READ IT IN THE BIBLE:
"And there came forth a spirit [a lying spirit], and stood before the Lord, and said, I will persuade him. And the Lord said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a LYING spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And He [the Lord] said, You shall persuade him, and prevail also, go forth, and DO SO. Now therefore, behold, the Lord [Who? 'the LORD'] has put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these your prophets, and the Lord has spoken evil concerning you" (I Kings 22:22-23).
"Then there came out a spirit, and stood before the Lord, and said, I will entice him. And the Lord said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go out, and by a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And the Lord said, You shall entice him, and you shall also prevail: go out, and DO EVEN SO. Now therefore, behold, the Lord has put a lying spirit in the mouth of all His prophets, and the Lord has spoken evil against you" (II Chron. 18:21-22).
But I though that "God cannot lie" (Titus 1:2)? He can't, but He does send those who DO LIE.
But I thought that "God tempts no man" (James 1:13)? He doesn't, but He sends those who DO TEMPT. (Matt. 4:1, I Cor. 7:5, I Thes. 3:5, Heb. 4:15).
Surely God does not desire for even one person to be deceived? Surely He DOES:
"and for this cause GOD shall send them strong DELUSION [Gk: 'fraudulence, straying, deceit, delusion, error'] that they should BELIEVE A LIE" (II Thes. 2:11).
Read that again a few times, as most of you either didn't get that verse, or you just flat out don't believe it should be a part of Scripture.
Hope this helps,
Marques
claypot:
Before I reply to Arc, I want to comment to you Marq.
So am I correct in saying that God doesn't tempt anyone yet He creates the circumstances that cause us to be tempted?
I will leave it at this to keep it simple. Your words are hitting home!
cp
Marky Mark:
--- Quote ---My question is, who is in control or who or what creates the circumstances that form my lusts?
--- End quote ---
Hello and welcome claypot.
Just an added email response from Ray. Hope it helps also.
http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,1700.0.html
Dear Charles:
You say: "You wrote about free will and proved it scripturally to be a myth of which after doing the studying myself concluded that it is a myth."
Then you say: "Do you think i would be hard on you if i were to use the word CONTRADICTING Mr Smith?"
Now don't get angry with me, Charles, but it is clearly YOU who are doing the "contradicting." First you positively agree that the whole teaching of "free will" really is a myth, but then you say that it doesn't fit YOUR ideas concerning the fairness of God, and therefore I CONTRADICT WITH THE TRUTH? I though that you agreed and saw that we have no free will? How then can that TRUTH contradict ANY OTHER TRUTH?
I am afraid that like hundreds of thousands before you, you have not read carefully. I fully cover all of this in my paper on free will. How could you miss it?
How many times have I showed our readers Romans 9:18-23 where in Paul says people will ask why God finds fault with their sins since it is God Himself who is behind all things throught the intentions of His plan and purpose?
We are to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling because: "For it is GOD which works IN YOU [not in the uncalled wicked of the world, but "you,'"--you Believers] both to will and to do of His good pleasure" (Phil. 12:13). Well what of the uncalled wicked then? Does God not "WILL THEM TO DO SIN?" No He doesn't: "Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God [as you have just suggested] for God cannot be tempted with evil, NEITHER TEMPS HE ANY MAN: But every man is tempted, when he is drawn way of H-I-S O-W-N LUST, and enticed. Then when lust has conceived, it brings forth sin...." (James 1:13-15).
God does NOT MAKE OR FORCE ANYONE TO SIN!!! I have stated this over and over and over and over again, and yet, I get email after email suggesting that I teach that "GOD MAKES AND FORCE MEN TO SIN." I have never taught or even though such a thing. God made man SPIRITUALLY WEAK. So weak that he cannot resist the pulls of his own carnal nature. Man volunteers to sin, God does not FORCE him to sin. And it is not a sin on God's part for making man weak, because He has also a plan to MAKE HIM SPIRITUALLY STRONG, and with God the end ALWAYS JUSTIFIES THE MEANS. In judgment, God will RIGHT EVERY WRONG. The "so-called" innocent children He had killed in wars and battles with be given back their life and more--they will eventually be given IMMORTALITY in the Family of God (more than sufficient compensation for a short and early death in this life).
God be with you,
Ray
Peace...Mark
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