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isaiah 14:12??
wisdom:
Who/ what is the light-bringer/daystar/son of the morning as described in Isaiah14:12? Are these adjectives of the king of babylon? Are they to be takin literal or figuratively I'm just a little confused. Thanks for all responses.
Kat:
Hi Wisdom,
It is in article #9 as John said. Here is the excerpt from that article.
http://bible-truths.com/lake9.html ----------------------------
And notice carefully that the Hebrew verb eill in Isa. 14:12 is the identical form of the first verb eill in Zech. 11:2. Now try substituting the personal noun "Lucifer" in place of the verb "howl" in the two places it occurs in Zech. 11:2. Here as in many Scriptures, the trees are likened to people who are crying out because of the death and destruction:
"Lucifer, fir tree; for the cedar is fallen; because the mighty are spoiled: Lucifer, O ye oaks of Bashan; for the forest of the ventage is come down."
Such a translation would be nonsense. Or let’s try it back in Isa. 14 where we find the word Lucifer in verse 12, but notice how this word is translated in verse 31: Instead of "Howl, O gate; cry, O city…" We would have, "Lucifer, O gate; cry, O city…" Again, such a translation would be nonsense, as it is also nonsense in Isa. 14:12.
Kittel in a footnote informs us that it is only the Septuagint (which, remember, is the Greek Translation of the Hebrew Scriptures) that we find this word ell instead of eill. This word was translated into eospearos, which Jerome translated into Lucifer with a capital "L," which the King James translators carried over into English without checking the HEBREW manuscripts, which would have solved this dilemma. All Hebrew manuscripts have eill in Isaiah 14:12, and remember that the Old Testament was written in Hebrew, NOT Greek or Latin!
Well, there you have it. There ain’t no Lucifer who was supposedly perfect before he supposedly turned into Satan. Lucifer is a Christian hoax! What a difference a Hebrew "yode" (‘i’—iota) makes. We dare not LEAVE OUT THE IOTAS.
"For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in NO WISE PASS from the law, till all be fulfilled" (Mat. 5:18).
A "jot" is a Greek "iota" and in Hebrew a "tittle" is a "yod," which is the very smallest stroke in a Hebrew letter. And just how important are those little iotas? The difference between the absence of "i", or the presence of "i", is the reason why, we have the Lucifer LIE!
Now back to Isa. 14. With "Lucifer" out of the way, let’s read a couple versions other than the KJV and see how they dealt with this strange word ell which comes to us by way of the Greek Septuagint and the Latin Vulgate:
"How you are fallen from heaven, O morning star, son of the dawn!" You are hacked down to the earth, destroyer of nations" (New International Version)
"How you are fallen from heaven, O Day Star, son of Dawn! (New Revised Standard Version)
There is absolutely no reason to capitalize "day," "star," or "dawn" in this last version.
Here is how the Concordant Literal Old Testament translates this verse by following the Hebrew Manuscripts rather than the Catholic Latin Bible:
"How you have fallen from the heavens! Howl, son of the dawn! You are hacked down to the earth, defeater of all nations."
It is the king of Babylon who elevated himself to high heaven in the heavens of his own mind, and it is the same king of Babylon who has "fallen from the heavens," and it is the same king of Babylon who is "hacked down to the earth," and it is the same king of Babylon who was the "defeater of all nations," and not a "perfect Satan."
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mercy, peace and love
Kat
wisdom:
John and Kat thanks, that helped a lot, may God continue to enlighten all of us daily as we fulfill his will in our lives
Deborah-Leigh:
Dear Kat and John
My husband Abrie, our son Byron and I, met a couple this week end. Through the course of our discussions one evening, Dannie explained that he was looking for the Greek translation of the OT.
This morning as I read the except God caused you to past into this Thread, I saw the information that Dannie was looking for! 8) :)
I emailed Dannie the following ~ This morning, while doing some Bible study, I was reminded that you told me you were looking for the Greek translation of the Old Testament. I found out that the “Septuagint” is the name for the translation you are looking for. I also learned that it is vital to base conclusions and beliefs upon the ORIGINAL Manuscripts. I learned this from the following excerpt that was posted in the Forum in which I am a member. It comes out of the website Bible-Truths.com ~ Lake of Fire Series 9. It seems to me that God wants you to know this. 8) :)
I copied the article excerpt you posted Kat, to Dannie. As it happens, we also discussed Lucifer. I reminded Dannie that Jesus said of Satan that he was a Murderer from the BEGINNING and that anulls, and disqualifies any false doctrines about there ever being a Lucifer that was perfect and rebelled against God. God has built upon this discussion, for the Plan of Dannie's edification, your post with John's, that forms a perfect link to the very discussions we had here in Africa over the weekend! I am so happy God is doing this for Dannie and that He embraces us all here reading and seeing what He is doing to bring His Word and understanding of His Spirit and Truth into a weekend in the African bushveld to a person looking for Him and who came to catch butterflys on the weekend where God has caught him ..... :D ;D 8)..to set him free from errors and lies.
How gently and expansively our God works and displays through us, His generosity and Love. No work He gives us, is in vain and in Faith, God makes us believe! 8)
Blessings
Arc
Kat:
Hi Arc,
It is a beautiful thing to see the workings of our God through us and reaching out to others. It's such a blessing to hear of someone seeking and responding to the truth. Thanks for sharing that, I think we rarely see these inter-workings that are continually going in.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
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