chastizing or under discipline

[karenmarie]

some of my friends and family are undergoing rough times right now, and have been, for at least a year. They've been praying, I've been praying, and yet, situations didn't seem to be resolved. We've talked about the Dark Night of the Soul, Wandering in the Desert, the aloofness (seemingly) of God.

I've been praying alongside, and remembering also the times I went through where God didn't answer my prayers for relief quickly or in the way I wanted.

Sometimes, He answers all of a sudden, out of the blue, after years of prayers, in ways we couldn't imagine but are so much better. Even BETTER than that, I have learned, and my friends have learned through these recent experiences, the dross is burned off and we realize that through this parching dryness, searching for literal water, we've been given spiritual water - His presence, His fellowship, even when we didn't see Him at first.

I'm learning that He wants me to want Him, first, before the blessings I ask for. Seek first His kingdom, and His righteousness, and then all these things will be added to you. In hindsight, I am glad for the purging and the trial by fire.

What I have learned recently (and I KNEW this already, but this new realization has sunk deeper into my soul) is that all the while I am undergoing the trials, God is there, making the trial BEARABLE. I don't know if I can explain this well. But I have looked back at things that have happened to me, knowing it was chastisement, but seeing God's LOVE and tenderness through and through. I guess I am reminded of the 3 Israelites in the fiery oven and Jesus there with them. I have seen this in some of the things my friends and family members have gone through, too. At first, they had to say in blind faith that God was with them even though they couldn't see. I saw the dross being burned off. Now they are seeing all of this, too. The love and faithfulness of God, sustaining them even though He brought them to pain.

This helps me understand further how God will be with those who undergo the lake of fire later. Besides the horribleness of teaching about eternal torment in a burning torture pit, there is the additional false teaching of how God won't be there - the "lost souls" will be eternally apart from Him. Or, some pastors have taught that hell is not a literal lake of fire, but the absence of God forever. How false both of these teachings are. He is a loving father, teaching us righteousness, never abandoning anyone.

Karen

[arion]

But I have looked back at things that have happened to me, knowing it was chastisement, but seeing God's LOVE and tenderness through and through.

I think many of us can identify with that.  I had a problem with not being able to live within my means and credit cards were always a temptation.  God answered my prayer by having the IRS ding me for what they claimed were back taxes from about ten previous years and having interest and penalties on top of it.  They put a tax levy against me and for 18 months took every cent I made over the $630 a month they decided to let me keep.  Looking back....it was an answer to prayer because I learned how to make do with what I had, I learned how to save for something that I want and pay in cash because I could no longer get credit, ect.  I'm thankful that I learned that lesson and had that purged out of me before this depression (government says recession, LOL) that we've been in for the last couple of years.  God doesn't always answer our prayers the way we expect or want but the Father knows exactly how to wield the whip and it's always in love for our own good even if we can't see it until much later.  Those things lend experience that we can draw against for current trials and that is something that the world can never take away from us.

[acomplishedartis]

I can kind of see, how does praying both ways helps and bring fear away; If I get one side: good. If i get the other, it is God's will again.

Sometimes I let my imagination go, and try to overcome (try to accept God's will) in the worst scenarios I can put myself. Then fears get away.

[grapehound]

Amen John K,
In a nutshell.

God Bless

[waarheid77]

 The sad thing I saw when my eyes were opened to it was that I reaped what I had sown.
21+ years married to the 1st wife and she claimed I beat her for 20 years. I never raised a hand to her. She charged me with CDV and highly aggravated assault (10 year automatic). She would get mad at the drop of a hat and go off on me like a windmill. Face, head and shoulders got hit. No issue with me as it never hurt a bit. Hardhead I guess. I was shown where I planted the seed that brought all the false accusations on me. She had 4 credit cards in my name that I knew nothing about and the divorce papres said I was to pay it off. 3 cards $11k + on the other card was $3600+. On a gas card over $1k. I paid the gas card. I signed over my retirement account to her and was told what a fool I was. The IRS website said if I gave her half she would get half of all I ever got. It said if I gave her all she could get no more.
No brainer she got all. They thought I knew something and took the credit card debt and claimed that since I signed the retirement over she took them. In reality it was because when I found out I killed the cards. I think they were afraid I would press charges. Not sure what scared them. Went from me paying all and 30 day divorce with physical abuse to 366 separation and her pay them off and after the daughter graduated from H.S. no more child support.
Then the criminal charges were lowered to CDV (misdemeanor) and that was all if I took the deal. I could not as it was a lie. I told April to make the call. Lawyer said i could not do that. She made the call take the CDV. They had 4 polieman that had never seen me going to testify that they knew I beat her. Also 2 women that worked with her. The cops children went to the school she works at so they agreed to help her. I was shown when what seemed like little things (mustard seed) grow into something big.
Things that I had read in the Bible that I saw but did not see before gave me the answer that I planted the seed for every thing evil I thought was done to me.
Can blame no one but myself. All scripture is God-breathed and is profitable fo rdoctrine, for conviction, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. The heart is deceitfulabove all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? I the Lord search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings. He also says; My people perish for lack of knowledge.
Then Jesus said, Father forgive them, for they know not what they do.
Sevaral things have happened over and over many times. I find this true for everyone. The cycle keeps repeating so maybe we can see what we are doing to cause it. Of the things that kept repeating I was able to overcome all but one. It came from the owner and I knew that I could do nothing. That was one mountain i could not climb. That tongue has started wars and created all kinds of havoc. Change the way you think and you will not say it again. Repented and he showed me how to move the mountain. Told the man I was sorry for what I said as it was wrong. That it was done out of ignorance and that the other thing that effected them I also saw it was wrong and it was gone also. I said I hope one day you can forgive me, and he said let's forget it . DONE moved the mountain.
All it took was to realize to use God's word looking to the inside. Christianity puts it to the outside. Not only that but
Judeo-christianity is serving to masters. Look how convoluted it is.
 
John from Kentucy i have no idea why I am drawn to some people. You are one of them. Stop accusing, judging and condenming yourself. We are told to put on the mind of Christ. He came not to juge but, to save. He did not criticize, or condemn either. So when you hear that voice that says you can't make it then know it is the devil inside making his false accusations. He is a liar. Tell him so and he will go away.ray says the Bible is not literal. So when Jesus was taken up into an exceeding high mountain and showed Him all the kingdomsof of the world it was not literal. It was the heavens of His mind. And He saw satan fall as a star from heaven.
John make him fall too.

In  Christ Jesus love and grace to all
Ken  

[hillsbororiver]

Hello Everyone,

This is another very interesting topic, one we all might profit from as we all to some degree struggle with the things written here so far, as I was reading through the posts I was reminded of Solomon's prayer.

Check it out;

1 Kings 3

5In Gibeon the LORD appeared to Solomon in a dream by night: and God said, Ask what I shall give thee.

6And Solomon said, Thou hast shewed unto thy servant David my father great mercy, according as he walked before thee in truth, and in righteousness, and in uprightness of heart with thee; and thou hast kept for him this great kindness, that thou hast given him a son to sit on his throne, as it is this day.

7And now, O LORD my God, thou hast made thy servant king instead of David my father: and I am but a little child: I know not how to go out or come in.

8And thy servant is in the midst of thy people which thou hast chosen, a great people, that cannot be numbered nor counted for multitude.

9Give therefore thy servant an understanding heart to judge thy people, that I may discern between good and bad: for who is able to judge this thy so great a people?

10And the speech pleased the LORD, that Solomon had asked this thing.

11And God said unto him, Because thou hast asked this thing, and hast not asked for thyself long life; neither hast asked riches for thyself, nor hast asked the life of thine enemies; but hast asked for thyself understanding to discern judgment;

12Behold, I have done according to thy words: lo, I have given thee a wise and an understanding heart; so that there was none like thee before thee, neither after thee shall any arise like unto thee.

13And I have also given thee that which thou hast not asked, both riches, and honour: so that there shall not be any among the kings like unto thee all thy days.

14And if thou wilt walk in my ways, to keep my statutes and my commandments, as thy father David did walk, then I will lengthen thy days.

15And Solomon awoke; and, behold, it was a dream. And he came to Jerusalem, and stood before the ark of the covenant of the LORD, and offered up burnt offerings, and offered peace offerings, and made a feast to all his servants.

Does this strike you as the kind of mindset that all who aspire to please God should have?

Do you think if we exercise the discipline of constantly seeking and praying for Godly discernment there will be less cause for Godly chastising?

Peace,

Joe  

[Kat]

Learning things the hard way, that's seems to be the what it takes for us to really get it. We have to actually live these difficult experiences that happen in our lives for it to imprint upon our mind, so we will never forget it. So we all have our share of good and bad experiences.

Ecc 1:13 I applied my heart to inquiring and exploring by wisdom concerning all that is done under the heavens:it is an experience of evil Elohim has given to the sons of humanity to humble them by it.

It occurs to me that this "experience of evil" as hard as it is to endure at the time, is actually of great value for us to learn from. So just as all mankind must suffer in this life, Christ also suffered. Suffering is a necessary part of this process.


http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php?topic=3720.0 ----

They (Israelites) were forgiven for a whole year, just by the sprinkling of a goat's blood, in the Holy place on the Day of Pentecost. But Christ wanted to prove to the human race that He was every bit as good of a man, as any other man was.  He doesn't sit in His ivory tower telling us how great He is. He did it as a man. God became a man and died, because He loves His creation and He wanted us to know He loves us.

This is awesome stuff.  It's like a fairytale from Greek mythology, but it's not, it the Bible.

So He puts us through hell to get us in His family.  It's necessary to go through this pain and suffering and evil, to become holy, righteous, and good, you have to go through it.

I got as email just yesterday, a man said anybody that couldn't do what God wants to do for humanity, instantly, is not God. Some things, by there very nature, require time and circumstances. The gift of the Holy Spirit is patience, well I want it and I want it now, no. Patience is waiting for something under duress and the pain of not having it, that's patience. How can you develop that without time and duress. The more you think about it, just try to think of one virtue, love, kindness, faith, any virtue that you try to think of, that is not in some way, shape or form the result of overcoming some form of evil. To be good you must overcome evil.  Because your tendency is to be evil.
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mercy, peace and love
Kat

[arion]

'So just as all mankind must suffer in this life, Christ also suffered. Suffering is a necessary part of this process.'

Problem for us is that Jesus suffered for doing good only.  My suffering at times seems to be more for the evils that I have done than the good.  I would rather suffer for doing of the good as that would be easier to bear.

[hillsbororiver]

'So just as all mankind must suffer in this life, Christ also suffered. Suffering is a necessary part of this process.'

Problem for us is that Jesus suffered for doing good only.  My suffering at times seems to be more for the evils that I have done than the good.  I would rather suffer for doing of the good as that would be easier to bear.

Hi Arion,

I couldn't agree with you more!

And even more importantly neither could Peter under the inspiration of His Spirit. 

1Pe 3:16  Having a good conscience; that, whereas they speak evil of you as of evildoers, they may be ashamed that falsely accuse your good conversation in Christ.

1Pe 3:17  For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing.

Peace,

Joe

[Deborah-Leigh]

It is more painful to suffer for well doing than for evil doing. At least for evil doing, you know you're guilty....well, that's an assumption! You are supposed to know and if you don't well that's tough.

For well doing, as Jesus suffered, died and was buried, that's real tough ~ and that's the way to go!

Arc

[G. Driggs]

If suffering is a necessary process, can it be said that so is the "glory which shall be revealed in us" a necessary process? It helps to know and hopefully make the suffering a little more bearable.

G.Driggs

[One Love]

Hi All
Just what I'm going through for the past 8 months now, lost my job, no income, banks on my back, vehicle payments are behind, just breaking even on the bond and everything else that goes with this situation, however, GOD has supplied our immediate needs every single day, FOOD, HEALTH, whatever one needs to get through this phase, not one single strand of hair lost to date, THAT'S A GREAT GOD.

Even though it's tough and you feel there's no hope or it is the end, we still awake to go through a new day. My every thought is "I wish this was over" or "when LORD" but let YOUR will be done and then I'm dragged to this website and read the papers again and go through the daily posts here and find so much relief, knowing that it will be over, it's one day more closer.

Thank you all for your posts
GOD Bless!

[walt123]

Great ,replies from all.

"SO let it be written,So let be Done"
O,one more.

Hebrews 2:9-13 (New Living Translation)

9 What we do see is Jesus, who was given a position "a little lower than the angels"; and because he suffered death for us, he is now "crowned with glory and honor." Yes, by God's grace, Jesus tasted death for everyone. 10 God, for whom and through whom everything was made, chose to bring many children into glory. And it was only right that he should make Jesus, through his suffering, a perfect leader, fit to bring them into their salvation.

11 So now Jesus and the ones he makes holy have the same Father. That is why Jesus is not ashamed to call them his brothers and sisters. 12 For he said to God,

   "I will proclaim your name to my brothers and sisters.
      I will praise you among your assembled people."

13 He also said,

   "I will put my trust in him,"
      that is, "I and the children God has given me."

Walt.