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Author Topic: concerning the idol sacrifices... ''?''  (Read 1866 times)

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moshe

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concerning the idol sacrifices... ''?''
« on: January 30, 2011, 08:32:16 AM »


'' On this age of history, What does feeding on the idol sacrifices can stand for   ?  ''

(just asking)











« Last Edit: January 30, 2011, 08:34:22 AM by Moises »
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mharrell08

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Re: concerning the idol sacrifices... ''?''
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2011, 11:26:20 AM »


'' On this age of history, What does feeding on the idol sacrifices can stand for   ?


Israel was admonished to 'not learn the way of the heathen' [Jer 10:2]. This included partaking of their pagan sacrifices. Paul instructs the New Covenant believers in similar fashion:

Eph 5:1-20  Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children; And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweetsmelling savour.

But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.

Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience. Be not ye therefore partakers with them. For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth;) Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.

And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them. For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret. But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light: for whatsoever doth make manifest is light.

Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light. See then that ye walk circumspectly, not as fools, but as wise, Redeeming the time, because the days are evil. Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is.

And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit; Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord; Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ


Any of these sinful activities that Paul admonishes us to not participate in can be likened to pagan idol sacrifices. They all, as the pagan sacrifices, give praise & worship to something other than the One True God. We can give praise & worship by obeying the Spirit and walking in love as Christ loves us [Eph 5:1-2]


Hope this helps,

Marques
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mharrell08

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Re: concerning the idol sacrifices... ''?''
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2011, 04:21:13 PM »

So whatever we could fill on the parenthesis as personal day to day examples of 'what is sacrificed to the idols' IS What does 'feeding on the idol sacrifices' on 1Cor. 1-8 can stands for ?

Or, Those verses were talking about certain foods like meat sacrificed to the idols of that age of history only and now those verses have nothing to do with the consequences of today's bigest idols
''?''


I think you are referring to this passage:

1 Cor 10:14-31  Therefore, my beloved, flee from idolatry. I speak as to wise men; judge for yourselves what I say. The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ? For we, though many, are one bread and one body; for we all partake of that one bread.

Observe Israel after the flesh: Are not those who eat of the sacrifices partakers of the altar? What am I saying then? That an idol is anything, or what is offered to idols is anything? Rather, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice they sacrifice to demons and not to God, and I do not want you to have fellowship with demons.

You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons; you cannot partake of the Lord’s table and of the table of demons. Or do we provoke the Lord to jealousy? Are we stronger than He?
   
All things are lawful for me, but not all things are helpful; all things are lawful for me, but not all things edify. Let no one seek his own, but each one the other’s well-being. Eat whatever is sold in the meat market, asking no questions for conscience’ sake; for “the earth is the LORD’s, and all its fullness.” If any of those who do not believe invites you to dinner, and you desire to go, eat whatever is set before you, asking no question for conscience’ sake.

But if anyone says to you, “This was offered to idols,” do not eat it for the sake of the one who told you, and for conscience’ sake; for “the earth is the LORD’s, and all its fullness.” "Conscience,” I say, not your own, but that of the other.
For why is my liberty judged by another man’s conscience? But if I partake with thanks, why am I evil spoken of for the food over which I give thanks? Therefore, whether you eat or drink, or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God.


Paul is speaking about eating idol sacrifices with the Gentiles. This can be relevant today, as someone may offer you a meal in the name of Allah, Buddha, etc. Paul says, if they simply offer you food, don't ask who is it in worship to, just eat.

But, Paul says that IF they tell you it is for an idol worship, do not eat. Not for your sake, but for THEIRS. As Paul notes, WE know there is only 1 true God, so we know that anything is good to eat because 'the earth is the Lord's and all it's fullness' [1 Cor 10:26]. But one of pagan worship does not and we would be representing their false beliefs by knowingly partaking with them.

And as you noted, this same admonishment applies in everyday activity. Church activity, politics, gambling, our conversation & dress, work relationships & interactions, etc. There are many idols that people participate in that we should not, not for our sake, but for theirs as they may think we worship as they do.

1 John 2:15-17  Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world—the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life—is not of the Father but is of the world. And the world is passing away, and the lust of it; but he who does the will of God abides forever.


Marques
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moshe

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Re: concerning the idol sacrifices... ''?''
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2011, 01:22:42 PM »


Ok, so I can see both sides on the equation and I hope that I am not confusing anyone,

On one side


''Now some, used hitherto to the idol, are eating of it as an idol sacrifice, and their conscience, being weak, is being polluted.'' (1Cor. 8:7)

''Now beware lest somehow this right of yours may become a stumbling block to the weak.'' (1Cor. 8:9)

''Now in thus sinning against brethren, and beating their weak conscience, you are sinning against Christ. Wherefore, if food is snaring my brother, I may under no circumstances be eating meat for the eon, lest I should be snaring my brother.'' (1Cor. 8:12-13)

''Therefore, my beloved, flee from idolatry'' (1 Cor 10:14)

''...the things which the Gentiles sacrifice they sacrifice to demons and not to God, and I do not want you to have fellowship with demons. You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons; you cannot partake of the Lord’s table and of the table of demons.Or do we provoke the Lord to jealousy? Are we stronger than He?'' (1 Cor 10:20-22)

But if anyone says to you, “This was offered to idols,” do not eat it for the sake of the one who told you (1 Cor 10:28)



Now, I will bring this just as an example that is closer for us to happen: Buying famous brand of clothing that is mostly selling the experience of wearing the peace of cloth more than the product itself. Fullfilling the ''Idol of greed'' of it's owners, and linked to covetousness and oppression. Using the big brand logo in front of you is like saying ''“This was offered to the idols,” and can be a stumble block to the weak (but it is very unusual that somebody tell you with words that something has been sacrificed to the idols: so ''we can talk with actions as well.'')

Then, in the other side


''Now concerning the idol sacrifices: We are aware that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffs up, yet love builds up. If anyone is presuming to know anything, he knew not as yet according as he must know. Now if anyone is loving God, this one is known by Him.
Then, concerning the feeding on the idol sacrifices: We are aware that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is no other God except One. For even if so be that there are those being termed gods, whether in heaven or on earth, even as there are many gods and many lords, nevertheless for us there is one God, the Father, out of Whom all is, and we for Him, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through Whom all is, and we through Him.'' (1Cor 8:1-6)

''Now food will not give us a standing with God, neither, if we should not be eating are we in want, nor if we should be eating are we cloyed.'' (1Cor 8:8)

''Eat whatever is sold in the meat market, asking no questions for conscience’ sake; for “the earth is the LORD’s, and all its fullness.” (1 Cor 8:23-24)

''But if I partake with thanks, why am I evil spoken of for the food over which I give thanks? Therefore, whether you eat or drink, or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God.'' (1Cor 8:30)


So you can see the dilema ??


And maybe, here is the answer,


''All things are lawful for me, but not all things are helpful; all things are lawful for me, but not all things edify. Let no one seek his own, but each one the other’s well-being.'' (1Cor 8:23)

I know it all has to do with the motivation of our hearts, and that if we have knowlege we are more accountable of our actions but,

but for example, on the example that I give, how do you practice it?



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mharrell08

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Re: concerning the idol sacrifices... ''?''
« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2011, 02:06:16 PM »

Now, I will bring this just as an example that is closer for us to happen: Buying famous brand of clothing that is mostly selling the experience of wearing the peace of cloth more than the product itself. Fullfilling the ''Idol of greed'' of it's owners, and linked to covetousness and oppression. Using the big brand logo in front of you is like saying ''“This was offered to the idols,” and can be a stumble block to the weak (but it is very unusual that somebody tell you with words that something has been sacrificed to the idols: so ''we can talk with actions as well.'')

And maybe, here is the answer,

''All things are lawful for me, but not all things are helpful; all things are lawful for me, but not all things edify. Let no one seek his own, but each one the other’s well-being.'' (1Cor 8:23)

I know it all has to do with the motivation of our hearts, and that if we have knowlege we are more accountable of our actions but,

but for example, on the example that I give, how do you practice it?


I don't think you'll receive one distinct answer Moises. Paul does speak of women dressing moderately [1 Tim 2:9] and I would safely assume that applies to men as well. But one person's idea of dressing moderately may be entirely different than another.

Sometimes we just have to make a decision or judgment based on how God is leading us.
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moshe

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Re: concerning the idol sacrifices... ''?''
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2011, 10:00:47 PM »

Thanks Marquez

Sometimes  I think of me as the weak brother with a weak conscious.

I must keep in mind that anytime my mind presume me to know anything, I know not as yet according as I must.



Moises




ps. It seems like if on this post, it's just you and me talking long on one empty room.

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