"In three days"

[edpro]

Hi everyone. I have posted a question earlier about Jesus being in the heart of the earth for three day's and got some help from you guy's.  Ray's explanation of it being a parable was sufficient enough for me. But now I read this verse and wanted to know if you guy's can help me again.

John 2:19  Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in THREE days I will raise it up.

[Dave in Tenn]

It's been a long time since New Testament 101, but I always though this was the less problematic statement the way the Jews counted days.  Friday Saturday Sunday--3 days.  Like that. 

[Heidi]

edpro.....Ray addresses this here in LOF Part 4;

"DESTROYED, PERISHED, AND LOST

DESTROYED: Is being destroyed a condition from which there is not salvation? Jesus said,

"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear Him which is able to DESTROY both soul and body in hell [the Greek is "gehenna" NOT hell. It is 'gehenna fire,' Mat. 5:22, not 'hell fire']" (Matt. 10:28).

Is there no salvation from this "destruction" in gehenna fire? Notice that they are not "eternally lost" in gehenna fire, but they are "DESTROYED" in gehenna fire. Their condition is that of being DESTROYED. This is not a hopeless condition or even our own Lord would have been put into a hopeless condition.

"Jesus answered and said unto them, DESTROY this temple, and in three days I will raise it up ... but He spake of the temple of His BODY" (John 2:19 & 21).

Later they did destroy Jesus Christ and sure enough three days later God SAVED Jesus from that destruction.

Notice what Job said with relation to being "destroyed":

"Thine hands have made me and fashioned me together round about; yet Thou dost DESTROY me" (Job 10:.

Yet Job knew that God would yet save him. In Jeremiah 18 God tells Jeremiah to go down to the Potter's house and observe him work. Jeremiah sees the potter destroy a marred work in his hand and refashion it into something useful. This we learn is an analogy of how God would "destroy" Judah (Ver. 7), and yet save him in the end. God will refashion all of marred (destroyed) mankind into glorious sons of God!"
Jesus died, end of story.....He was dead AND 3 days later GOD SAVED Jesus...it was God who resurrected Him to be the firstbourn of those who will follow later.

[Samson]

Heidi,

Below is an excerpt from Ray's letter to John Hagee regarding the Greek word Apollumi which means "Destroy,Lose, Lost. This Greek Word is used in the passage You refer to at Matthew, 10:28. Read Below !

Look carefully at what Jesus really said in Matt. 10:28:

"And do not fear those who are killing the body, yet are not able to kill the soul. Yet be fearing him, rather, Who is able to destroy the soul as well as the body in Gehenna."

Jesus said not to fear those who can "kill," but rather fear Him [Jesus Christ] who is able to destroy the soul as well as the body in Gehenna. The first part of the verse is man's operation, but the second part of the verse is God's. Men have no jurisdiction over the soul. All they can do is kill the body. But God can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.

Man consists of a body which, when God imparts His spirit to it, becomes a living soul. The soul is the result of the combination of body and spirit. There is "soul" only as long as God's spirit unites with the body. At death, God takes back His spirit and the "soul" goes to the unseen (or imperceptible). Hades in Greek or Sheol in Hebrew are not geographical locations, but rather a condition.

Those who teach annihilation rather than eternal punishment use this verse to show that when God destroys, the soul is irretrievable. This, however, is not true. "Destroy" comes from the Greek word Apollumi = FROM-WHOLE-LOOSE, that is, to "lose." The disciples were afraid that they would perish [apollumi] by drowning (Mk. 4:38). The sheep was lost [apollumi] by straying (Lk 15:4). We may destroy [apollumi] a weak saint by our knowledge (I Cor. 8:11). And Christ destroys [apollumi] both body and soul in Gehenna. Never does the Greek word apollumi mean annihilation! Besides destruction is the prelude to SALVATION! All we like sheep have gone astray. To be "lost" is the same Greek word used for "destroy." So it is axiomatic that if an apollumi [LOST] sheep can be SAVED, then certainly an apollumi [DESTROYED] soul can be saved also. Believe God's Word, not man's doctrines.

Also, from the Topic, Greek Words defined and Usage regarding the Greek Apollumi and being in a Lost or Destroyed condition. Read Below !

5) Apollumi: Lose, Lost, Destroy, Ruin.
    Matt. 10:28 ( Fear Him who is able to DESTROY)
    Matt. 18:11 ( Came to Save that which was LOST)Not even one, zero, not some, not any, not at all any ) should perish (Gk. apollumi - perish, destroy, lose) but that all (Gk. Pas - all, as many as.  We can take that out, forget the word all, you don't need it.  Put 'that they,' who? Anybody who doesn't come under the category of none) should come to repentance."

Are you following this?  This is all based on the negative.  How many that don't come under the category of none, not any, not any man, not any woman, not any thing, none whatsoever, nothing.  Now if you are not in that category, you are going to come to repentance and not have a destiny of perishing or perished - apollumi.  How many is that?  Everyone does not come under the mē, the none, so it includes everyone.  Therefore the "all" in that verse is everyone who is not included in the "any," and that's EVERYONE!

Now we understand that all humanity is in a state of 'apollumi,' sometimes.  Because apollumi meaning destroy, perish or lose.  All mankind are lost, so it's not talking about in this lifetime that no one will ever be destroyed or die or be perished or not be spiritually lost, as their destiny, because this life time they do.  But ultimately our destiny for everyone, is to be unperished or lost.  None, because the negative here proves it.  If there is even one that comes under that category, it can't come under that category, because that category doesn't include anyone, it's a negative, no one.  He's not willing that anyone, no one be perishing or lost forever.  There again the apollumi, Christ said I've come to save those that are apollumi.  When the scripture say, "the Lord is not slack,"  is there any room for slackness?  No.  A little slackness?  No.  No slackness at all.  When He says, "...is not willing that any should perish,"  it proves the positive side.  The negative proves the positive.

       Hope this Helps Heidi, Samson.

[mharrell08]

Jesus died, end of story.....He was dead AND 3 days later GOD SAVED Jesus...it was God who resurrected Him to be the firstbourn of those who will follow later.

Not exactly Heidi, Jesus was not dead for 3 days. Jesus said He would be in the 'heart of the earth' for 3 days.

[aktikt]

I just noticed something interesting.  Why does Jesus say "I" will raise it up.  Isn't it the father Who would have to raise Him?  Why does He say I? Hmmm.

[Joel]

Here are a couple of scriptures.

1 John 5:11
And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

John 11:25-26
Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

Joel

[Kat]

Hi Antawian,

Here is how the concordant has that verse.

John 10:17 Therefore the Father is loving Me, seeing that I am laying down My soul that I may be getting it again."
v. 18 No one is taking it away from Me, but I am laying it down of Myself. I have the right to lay it down, and I have the right to get it again. This precept I got from My Father." (CLV)

We have a few Scripture that says who raised Jesus Christ from the dead.

Gal 1:1  Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead;)

Eph 1:20  which He worked in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly places,

1Pe 1:20  He indeed was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you
v. 21  who through Him believe in God, who raised Him from the dead and gave Him glory, so that your faith and hope are in God.

Rom 10:9  that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

Acts 17:31  because He has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained. He has given assurance of this to all by raising Him from the dead."

mercy, peace and love
Kat

[edpro]

"Not exactly Heidi, Jesus was not dead for 3 days. Jesus said He would be in the 'heart of the earth' for 3 days."

I was referring to this topic. Jesus was said to be in the heart of the Earth for three day's and He was not necessarily dead for three day's. So I looked at the other verse to see if maybe it say's something like "destroy this temple for three day's and I will raise it up" but it did not.
So I wanted to see what did Jesus mean when he said that "in three day's I will raise it up".

So the question is "Was Jesus dead for three day's"?

[Kat]

Hi Edpro,

So I wanted to see what did Jesus mean when he said that "in three day's I will raise it up".

So the question is "Was Jesus dead for three day's"?

Well from the Scriptural accounts Jesus was not dead for three complete days and night, as Ray has explained He was "in the heart of the earth" for that amount of time.

"In the HEART OF THE EARTH" is a parable showing the unbelievable agony of the human spirit and flesh that Jesus would go through LEADING UP TO and INCLUDING the time in the tomb. And those three days began on the PREPARATION FOR THE PASSOVER (John 19:14), seeing that Jesus, HIMSELF, was to BE THE PASSOVER!!!

And don't forget the AGONY IN THE GARDEN when Jesus SWEAT BLOOD!! No one will ever know what torture He endured those "three days and three nights in the HEART OF THE EARTH." BEFORE the beatings and crucifixion we read this: 

"NOW is My SOUL TROUBLED [Greek: DISTRESSED, IN TURMOIL!]; and what shall I say? Father, save Me from this hour: but for his cause came I unto THIS HOUR" (John 23:27).

The "heart of the earth" is the very DEPTH OF THE FLESH.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,11616.0.html

So the "sign of Jonah" was what He gave to the scribes and Pharisees.

Mat 12:38  Then some of the scribes and Pharisees answered, saying, "Teacher, we want to see a sign from You."
v. 39  But He answered and said to them, "An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and no sign will be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah.
v. 40  For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

Now concerning the verse in John 2.

John 2:19  Jesus answered and said to them, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up."

Could it be that what Jesus said in John 2 is a different parable of the same event? That Christ said when His body was destroyed, then in three days or the third day He would be raised, as we have many Scripture that state it was the 'third' day.

Third \"th€rd\ adj : next after the second. 2 : n. one that is number three in a countable series. (Merriam-Webster's)

Mat 17:23  and they will kill Him, and the third day He will be raised up." And they were exceedingly sorrowful.

Mat 20:19  and deliver Him to the Gentiles to mock and to scourge and to crucify. And the third day He will rise again."

Mat 16:21  From that time Jesus began to show to His disciples that He must go to Jerusalem, and suffer many things from the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised the third day.

Mark 9:31  For He taught His disciples and said to them, "The Son of Man is being betrayed into the hands of men, and they will kill Him. And after He is killed, He will rise the third day."

Acts 10:40  Him God raised up on the third day, and showed Him openly,

1Co 15:3  For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
v. 4  and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures,

Luke 24:46  Then He said to them, "Thus it is written, and thus it was necessary for the Christ to suffer and to rise from the dead the third day,

Well this may seem too far fetched, but it is something that occured to me and thought I would bring it to the discussion.

mercy, peace and love
Kat

[Dave in Tenn]

Remember that the Hebrew scripture doesn't count 'days' as 24-hour periods...or as 'days and nights'.  Day is day and night is night.  He was raised on the third day.  He was raised again in three days.  From crucifiction to resurrection:  3 days.  FriDAY day, SaturDAY day, SunDAY day, as we'd say it in English.

However, He DID spend Three Days and Three Nights in the heart of the earth.  He did not spend all three NIGHTS in the tomb, however, as Ray has explained.  The FIRST of those three nights he spent in Gethsemene.  There is no contradiction. 

[mharrell08]

"Not exactly Heidi, Jesus was not dead for 3 days. Jesus said He would be in the 'heart of the earth' for 3 days."

I was referring to this topic. Jesus was said to be in the heart of the Earth for three day's and He was not necessarily dead for three day's. So I looked at the other verse to see if maybe it say's something like "destroy this temple for three day's and I will raise it up" but it did not.
So I wanted to see what did Jesus mean when he said that "in three day's I will raise it up".

So the question is "Was Jesus dead for three day's"?

Edpro,

See Samson's post regarding the word 'destroy'. When Jesus said 'Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up' (John 2:19), it was not just about in the physical sense. Jesus had also predicted that He would be 'betrayed and condemned' [Matt 20:18, Mark 10:33]. All these events happened over 3 days and were part of destroying of the temple, in the symbolic sense.


Hope this helps,

Marques

[edpro]

Thank you guy's soooooo much. This helps a lot. Some time's it takes a person who can thing outside the box to see certain thing's that another might not see.

Thank you.

Ed