> General Discussions
Physical Healing - Is it in the Will of God?
Dave in Tenn:
It's a daunting task to come to believe ALL the scripture when we've been trained since spiritual babes to believe each of the scriptures, at best, and some of them at worst. We even believe what scripture says about scripture.
arion:
--- Quote from: jong on July 29, 2011, 10:25:44 PM ---
I believe the only 'condition' God wants is for us to have "faith as a mustard seed" Luke 17:6). Mustard seeds figure prominently in one of Christ's parables. There must be a reason why ;)
--- End quote ---
It takes much time and the grace of God for us to come to an understanding of the scriptures. Ray, without a doubt is the most godly man that I know who has been suffering for 3 years with terminal cancer. Does he not have 'faith as a mustard seed'? Indeed Christ himself was sickly quite often;
Luk 4:23 And he said unto them, Ye will surely say unto me this proverb, Physician, heal thyself;
And also at times the disciples were sick and didn't receive healing at the time.
1Ti 5:23 Drink no longer water, but use a little wine for thy stomach's sake and thine often infirmities.
Php 2:27 For indeed he was sick nigh unto death: but God had mercy on him; and not on him only, but on me also, lest I should have sorrow upon sorrow.
2Ti 4:20 Erastus abode at Corinth: but Trophimus have I left at Miletum sick.
And yet at other times....
Act 28:8 And it came to pass, that the father of Publius lay sick of a fever and of a bloody flux: to whom Paul entered in, and prayed, and laid his hands on him, and healed him.
Act 19:11-12 And God wrought special miracles by the hands of Paul: So that from his body were brought unto the sick handkerchiefs or aprons, and the diseases departed from them, and the evil spirits went out of them.
Act 5:16 There came also a multitude out of the cities round about unto Jerusalem, bringing sick folks, and them which were vexed with unclean spirits: and they were healed every one.
So what do we make of all of this. These scriptures are all true and they all harmonize one with another. The difference between the first set and the last set is simply the sovereignty of God. It's simply all up to him. We pray and the results and timing is up to God alone. When I was in my old church we believed the health and wealth gospel but it was amazing how many believed this and were still sick. Of course they felt beaten down and second class citizens as opposed to those who never got sick (like myself). It was commonly said 'sickness doesn't glorify God' but I beg to differ. The sickness itself may not glorify God but the way that one bears up under such circumstances brings great glory to the Father. We need to look no further for that lesson than to look at how Ray has been able to bear up through these last few years.
Kat:
Another email.
http://bible-truths.com/email10.htm ---------------
[Ray Replies]
Many assume that the statements that Jesus made to his eleven apostles on the evening of His arrest, were a blanket statement to all believers to follow, for all time. This is not so.
Jesus did do many miracles through His apostles after His death and resurrection. He promised them the gift of the Holy Spirit (Comforter), which would give them faith and power to spread His gospel message.
This came true fifty days later on the Day of Pentecost. The apostles were given the gift of tongues so that they could even speak in foreign languages which none of them had ever studied. They were able to heal the sick. And they even RAISED THE DEAD. Peter and Paul both RAISED THE DEAD.
These special miracle gifts did not follow all generations of the church. Even later in the ministry of the apostles, God began to withdraw these gifts. No one was raised from the dead in their later ministry. Paul said that "tongues would cease" in I Cor. 13. Only "faith, hope [expectation] and charity [love]" were to "NOW remain...." Some of Paul best friends and servants in spreading the gospel were sick and not healed. Paul told his dear friend Timothy, to "take a little wine for thy stomach's sake, and thine OFT [MANY] INFIRMITIES. God did NOT heal them. Do we think that Paul did not even ask?
Many in the charismatic church try to make a carnival exhibition of such gifts, but I am afraid all they do is deceive.
However, with that said, does God no longer perform miracles or healings? Yes, He does. I have seen and experienced them. Does He always heal? Does He always alleviate our problems and trials? NO. Why should we pray for God to TAKE AWAY all the things that are absolutely NECESSARY FOR OUR FAITH AND PERFECTION?
Don't neglect to ask God for EVERYTHING you feel you should have. But don't be disappointed if God allows you to CONTINUE IN YOUR TRIALS. Sometimes He removes certain trials after a period of time. We do not know when and how or even if God will do this that or the other thing, so we keep praying. I ask for STRENGTH AND FAITH to face my trials and OVERCOME my flesh. I no longer pray for God to make me HEALTHY, WEALTHY AND WISE, with absolutely no price to pay for such privileges.
This site is an answer to prayer. My understanding of the Scriptures is an answer to prayer. Everything I have is an answer to prayer. I pray for others and many times, GOD ANSWERS MY PRAYERS! But I do NOT always heal the sick through my prayers, I do not make people wealthy through my prayers, and I have NEVER raised the dead through my prayers. So don't stop praying!! And ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS, thank God for all that you have.
And then, don't WORRY about anything. Phil. 4:6 is a terrible translation in the KJV. Instead of "Be careful in nothing..." it should read:
"DON'T WORRY ABOUT ANYTHING..."
God be with you,
Ray
Rene:
--- Quote from: jong on July 29, 2011, 10:25:44 PM ---I know God is sovereign, and everything is according to His will. But it is clearly stated in the OT and NT that God's will is Divine Health. It is an Abrahamic right for His children to be healthy until the day we die or until the Lord returns.
--- End quote ---
Jong,
Do you know anyone who is "physically" healthy their entire life on this earth? That is not God's will during this age.
The "true" healing has to do with spiritual healing. Don't you get that?
1 Peter 2:24-25: “and He Himself bore our sins in His body on the cross, so that we might die to sin and live to righteousness; for by His wounds you were healed. 25 For you were continually straying like sheep, but now you have returned to the Shepherd and Guardian of your souls.”
René
G. Driggs:
--- Quote from: jong on July 29, 2011, 10:25:44 PM ---I know God is sovereign, and everything is according to His will. But it is clearly stated in the OT and NT that God's will is Divine Health. It is an Abrahamic right for His children to be healthy until the day we die or until the Lord returns.
Even Jesus in the Lord's prayer called the Father's will in Heaven down into Earth ..."Thy kingdom come, Thy Will be done, On earth as it is in Heaven"....There is NO sickness in Heaven.
And Jesus did not 'pray' for the sick, He cast out demons and commanded sickness and disease to leave! And ALL who came to Him in faith were healed!
Psalm 103. A Psalm of David.
1 Bless the LORD, O my soul; And all that is within me, bless His holy name!
2 Bless the LORD, O my soul, And forget not all His benefits:
3 Who forgives all your iniquities, Who heals all your diseases...
I believe the only 'condition' God wants is for us to have "faith as a mustard seed" Luke 17:6). Mustard seeds figure prominently in one of Christ's parables. There must be a reason why ;)
--- End quote ---
Totally agree Jong, and I hope you can agree God's Will for Divine Health in the OT, Jesus healing the physically sick, raising the dead, are all types/shadows and parables that point to spiritual life and health, which is more important and greater than all that.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,6142.0.html
GREATER WORKS
But just like when God said to Israel, I’m choosing you, it was a shadow. Now Christ came and we say, at last now we have the real thing. That was right, He was the real thing. He was the Seed!
But part of this gospel involves judging, right. Peter said it involves judging the quick and the dead. Did Jesus Christ judge the quick and the dead when He was here? Some of this remains and has yet to a fulfillment and it has to. I will tell you why it has to. Jesus Christ told His disciples…
John 14:12 Truly, truly, I say to you, He who believes on Me, the works that I do he shall do also, and greater works than these he shall do, because I go to My Father.
He healed the sick, gave vision to the blind, caused the lame to walk, caused the dead to live… you’re going to do greater things than that. Oh really? And what might that be Lord?
I’ve had people ask me numerous times, ‘Ray can you walk on water, have you raised the dead, have you…?’ As a matter of fact I have. Which is greater, to raise somebody back to physical life, so that they can physically die again or to raise someone who is spiritually dead to spiritual life? God is doing greater things through the called, chosen, Elect few of His church, than He did in His own ministry, when He fed 5000, walked on the water, calmed the storm, healed the sick and raised the dead. He said we would do… “greater things,” they are greater. They are not greater if you’ve got a carnal mind, they are not greater then, it sounds like foolishness. That’s what it will sound like to you, unless you have the spiritual mind to see it.
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Peace,
G.Driggs
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