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Trusting by faith

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mharrell08:
Great comments JFK

Deborah-Leigh:

This brings up another very important subject.  When many believers find themselves in trials and hardships, they often feel that they
must be doing something wrong, and that God is not please with them--maybe you believe God is even punishing you for your sins.
Let me tell you something:  in all these trials that I am personally going though the last couple of years, I have never once felt that God
is punishing me for my sins. Let's not forget the lesson of Job.  God did not assign Satan to crush Job with horrible diseases because
God wanted to get Job to repent of his sins. God was not punishing Job, He was TESTING Job, and guess what?  Job passed the
test.  God did not tell Eliphaz to sacrifice seven bullocks and seven rams for Job's sins, or for Job's short-comings, no, God told him
to sacrifice them for the sins of himself and his two friends.  The three of them condemned Job for doing wrong, when they could not
point to one single wrong that Job committed.  Job said to God: "Thou knowest that I am NOT WICKED; and there is none that can
deliver out of Thine hand" (Job 10:7).  Furthermore, God Himself stated that Job was "...a perfect and an upright man, one that fears
God and suns evil" (Job 1:.

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,9330.0.html

John from Kentucky:

--- Quote from: Arcturus on December 12, 2011, 01:31:45 PM ---
This brings up another very important subject.  When many believers find themselves in trials and hardships, they often feel that they
must be doing something wrong, and that God is not please with them--maybe you believe God is even punishing you for your sins.
Let me tell you something:  in all these trials that I am personally going though the last couple of years, I have never once felt that God
is punishing me for my sins. Let's not forget the lesson of Job.  God did not assign Satan to crush Job with horrible diseases because
God wanted to get Job to repent of his sins. God was not punishing Job, He was TESTING Job, and guess what?  Job passed the
test.  God did not tell Eliphaz to sacrifice seven bullocks and seven rams for Job's sins, or for Job's short-comings, no, God told him
to sacrifice them for the sins of himself and his two friends.  The three of them condemned Job for doing wrong, when they could not
point to one single wrong that Job committed.  Job said to God: "Thou knowest that I am NOT WICKED; and there is none that can
deliver out of Thine hand" (Job 10:7).  Furthermore, God Himself stated that Job was "...a perfect and an upright man, one that fears
God and suns evil" (Job 1:.

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,9330.0.html

--- End quote ---

Hi Arc,

One must understand the difference between relative truth and absolute truth to understand the Book of Job and all scriptures.  Ray discusses this topic of relative versus absolute in his Lake of Fire articles.

When God said that Job was a "perfect and upright man" that was true since God does not lie.  Job was a good and upright man relative to other men.  Even Satan couldn't find anything wrong with Job.  Satan is an expert on sin and evil.  If he can't find something wrong with you, then you must be good, relatively speaking.

But, in terms of absolute good, God saw this huge beam in Job's eye.  Job was self-righteous.  Job was good; Job knew he was good; and he wasn't shy about saying so.  Even when God took everything from Job (except for a nagging wife who wouldn't shut up  :D), Job still maintained his integrity, his sense of being right and good.

In the scriptures, God teaches that all men have sinned (including Job); that none are good.

Job disagreed.  Job thought he was good.

What does God think about Job or any man?  "..for dust you are, and unto dust you shall return." Gen 3:19

So since God and Job disagreed, God straightened Job out on this point.  In chapter 42 of the Book, Job repented and acknowledged his sin.  After all, if you are without sin, what do you repent of?

The Book of Job is a profound lesson for all of us.  Beware the sin of self righteousness.  If the Spirit of God is in us, then we will do the good works of Jesus.  We have to take care and acknowledge that the good comes from God and not from us.

John

Deborah-Leigh:
Hey John~ :)

As I am given to understand the insight and teaching Ray presents in his letter to the Forum, which is the insight and teaching with which you may be disagreeing John,  I am reminded of the posture I have heard falsely taught in Christendom. That is, self righteousness is the be all and end all meaning for Job's experience with meeting God. Talk about putting the cart before the horse. LOL!

Christendom doesn’t teach Truth nor shows the Majesty of God’s thoughts and mind and the all-encompassing liberty we have in Christ.

It is laughable that Christendom has to see a sin... ROFL  Their focus is sin, shame, suffering, punishment, death and hell...LOL...ROFL...

Like concluding that Isaiah had his lips burned by the coals lifted from the alter by the Seraphim NOT because he was iniquitous and sin filled but because Isaiah SAW THE KING, the Lord of Hosts, is to give glory to God for opening Isaiah’s eyes and not glory to the sin that kept them closed....LOL

Seeing the King in you John, and looking away from that sin that so easily and deftly clings, to Jesus the author and finisher of Faith, for JOY....

God is Love and I love God's Kindness and Mercy, and that's, no laughing matter!

Arc

Joel:
Job lived and died in faith, he cursed the day he was born, but not God, as Satan had predicted.

Joel

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