The most sought after women in the world--

[Duane]

I always thought that the church was called "the bride of Christ" because they were always SQUABBLING!  :-)

[Gina]

Not arguing with that, Duane!

[John from Kentucky]

Gena, thanks for your kind thoughts.  I'm thrilled you are a happily married person.  Please don't let your heart hurt for me. lol

I saw a post that Dave in Tenn wrote in the last six months, and he said something to the effect of:  "I'm not a victim of anything."  I respect you a lot, Dave, but when I read that I felt the blood in the capillaries in my face pulsate.  Who knew it felt so good to feel sorry for myself and to dwell on the things I didn't have?  It was bad drama but it was at least some drama Nobody loves me, boo hoo.  (Oh, I could put on a show!!  I think I missed my calling as an actress.)  

But Dave's right.  Thank you, Dave!  

The devil loves to get me where it hurts me most:  Fear of abandonment and vanity.   Not a recipe for happiness.  lol  I've been told I've got self-control.  I may have self-control in the relative sense and I thank God for it if I do.

I have to make a conscious effort to remind myself that being single has its good points, too, because it does!  

We can either go through life feeling so lonely (which as Ray pointed out in a recent email is only a feeling and a subjective one at that), or go through life believing that God is not feeling sorry for us.

Who here hasn't fallen prey to the Hollywood Joker:  

"All alone, aren't you?  HA! Well, keep that up and you're not gonna like yourself a whole lot, I can tell ya that right now.  And I am going to help you make it to that destination."

When you're fearful and depressed, spending money on things you can't afford and don't need and / or ingesting harmful substances, etc., to make yourself feel better and, therefore, more valuable in the eyes of the world helps a lot! (I kid.)

But isn't it true that there will be no marriage in the kingdom (unless you count the church being the "bride" of Christ which doesn't count literally lol ) because we will be like the angels--asexual -- neither male, nor female, right?  Would it be ridiculous to desire that it be possible that God is teaching some of us to learn to like that idea--in the here and now?  

Angels are asexual?  How do you know?  Do you have two or three scriptures that say so?  Jesus said that we will neither marry or be given in marriage.  Jesus didn't say no sex.

God made us male and female.  Two basic models.  Scriptures seem to show that we will be male and female in the times to come.  God created sex.  Are we to assume that male and female and sexual relations between the two, are just for the present ages?  Are there two or three scriptures that prove that?

Will there be male and female and sexual relations between the two in the times to come?  Maybe not.     Then again, maybe so.      

Who knows the mind or plans of God?  I believe we know very little of what is to come.  But, I don't think it will be boring.

[Deborah-Leigh]

This is mind blowing material ~   

[Rob M]

John, your "maybe not"    "then again maybe so"     brought a smile to my face..thanks man!! Your use of the icons in this matter was priceless!!

[Kat]

Mat 22:30  For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in Heaven.

We can assume that here Jesus is speaking about the first resurrection to life in this Scripture, because to be "as the angels" would mean that one is spirit, as "flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom."

1Co 15:50  And I say this, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God,

Now the rest of mankind would be raised back in the flesh as Ray has taught, so for them it would be a different matter. But for those in the first resurrection they are to be raised to be spirit, and I do not think they would be preoccupied with fleshly matters such as sex. I don't think those in the first resurrection would have fleshly desires at all, that's what being spirit means to me, not being hampered by the weaknesses of the carnal flesh. The Elect would have enough to do being about the Father's business of ruling with Christ  

mercy, peace and love
Kat

[DougE6]

I think the scriptures that Kat brought forth, seal the deal for me. I do not believe there is sex, at least the way we understand it, for the spiritual body.  Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, because flesh is carnal, temporary, and earthly. The spiritual mind and body is NOT carnal, not temporary, not earthly.  The flesh is weak, selfish, carnal, full of hidden corrupt desires. It cannot live forever, it must die.

And just speaking straight on...Sex always has a component of lust involved. In fact, I do not believe it is possible for climax to take place without lust being involved. , Psa 51:5  Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me. This is true ON MANY LEVELS

yes this verse has higher spiritual meanings too, but I think if you ask enough people, and they are honest, they would reveal that sex at its core, does have an element of selfish desire. Even the act that pro created all of us earthly fleshly beings, even if done in a loving marraige relationship, that act included desires that are intrinsically or inherently pleasurable because of lustful desires.

[Gina]

Thanks, Kat and Doug.

JFK:  You're a crack-up.  Please enjoy the "hold" music while I formulate my response?    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEtcoyeM3_k&feature=related
:-D

[Rob M]

Not to turm this into sex education class or anything, but God created the human orgasm as one of the most pleasurable things we as humanbeings can experience. It's such an intence feeling of pleasure that we can only stand it for mere seconds, almost an out of body experience..very spirtual.  I'm single, and if I am for the rest of my life I'll be missing out on this experience.   Wonder what God will replace it with.

I hope you guys to see this post as being crass..just thinking out loud!!

[Gina]

Hi, Rob

I'm not easily offended.  I see what you're saying.  I beg to differ slightly; I believe you mean it is THE most pleasurable thing anyone can experience.  

Mind if I ask you some questions, JFK?  (By the way, John, thanks so much for the challenge.  I find looking up scripture to your questions most, um....stimulating, lol, and not boring AT ALL!  I hope you and I will be in agreement when we're finished!   )

1.  Why would men then choose to make themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom?  

SCRIPTURAL BACKING:  Matthew 19:12 For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

2.  Why is that verse of scripture I gave you insufficient?  I mean, why would it be truer to you if I'd supplied you with two or three more?  But I respect your right to question and so I will give you what you require.

Mark 12:25 For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.

Luke 20:35 But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage

Luke 20:36 for neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection.

3.  How can we be having sex outside of marriage?

4.  Have you not read that it is only when we are emotionally intertwined (not physically intertwined) that we become one?  

(Comment:  I've heard more than one man tell me (three, to be exact) that they can have sex with a woman and experience the "happy ending," if you will, and not even have to LIKE her.  No emotional intertwining goin' on there.  Yes, there are women out there who've done the same thing.)  

You said,

scripture seems to indicate that we will be male and female in the times to come.  

5.  How then do we explain this:  Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.  When it says there is NEITHER male nor female, am I supposed to conclude that there IS male and female?  I'm seriously asking.

6.  I would call having our tears wiped away and having no more sorrow--ECSTASY; what would you call it:  Boring?  

7.  Nome sayin?

Anyway, I love you John, and trust me, I've FELT your grief.  And I'll bet you a million dollars it won't be boring.  

Gina
p.s.  This was fun!!

[jong]

Hi All,

Some further thoughts/questions....

1.  If marriage is a holy institution by God for physical humans on Earth, maybe there is a spiritual equivalent existing in Heaven for spiritual beings ? (probably excepting angels who are asexual.)   1Peter 3:7 hints that husband & wife will be heirs together of the grace of life (in the resurrection.)

2.  If there is a Father God, could there a female companion or equivalent who is always in the background ?  Prov 8: 22-23 & 30-31 hints of a companion who was at the Lord's side from the very beginning.

As above, so below?
Jong

[Gina]

I believe there's not an equivalent to what we know as the "marriage bed."

Jesus said, by three different accounts, there will be no marriage or giving in marriage.

No marriage.  No sex.

John 17:3 Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.

I always think of the song:  "To know, know, know him is to love, love, love him" when I read that.

It's going to be ecstasy.  But NOT the ecstasy you find in a bedroom or on the street.  Much, much purer.  Infinitesimally purer.

John 20:20 So saying, He showed them His hands and His side. And when the disciples saw the Lord, they were filled with joy (delight, exultation, ecstasy, rapture).

Imagine what it will be like then!
Good questions.



Gina

[jong]

Hi Gina,

Christ said there will be no "marriage" because all marriages in the bible as well as today are "until death do you part" 

Romans 7:2  For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of husband.

In the resurrection life, there will be no more death.

Of course, God will be the center of our lives, but we probably will have our own little circles of holy relationships also ??

[JohnMichael]

I wonder if "the marriage bed" (to put it delicately) isn't just God's "escape" for the lust of the flesh. It's the fulfillment of 1 Cor 10:13 in the avenue of "burning passions." It's the permissible outlet for those lustful desires. It's the only orgasm that doesn't have guilt or shame attached to it. I could put it in plain language, but that would border on vulgarity.

It does have the added benefit of producing more children for Him at the same time - good purpose

Just throwing my two mites into the conversation

In Him,
John

[Kat]

We have to separate the needs/desires that are wrapped up in our physical/fleshly bodies, and realize it will not be the same in the spiritual realm. That is a higher realm and state of being and we will no longer have the pulls of the carnal flesh that cause us so much misery, pain and suffering. Even if there is a degree of pleasure to be found in this flesh, to try and say or think that that is anywhere near as good as one second of the glory of being spiritually alive seems to be ridiculous to me.

Jong, yes Christ (God) does have a bride that He is very much committed to and the Elect is that bride being prepared in this life. When we finally go to the marriage supper, which represents the kingdom we will then be united with Christ and not be subject to the needs/pulls of the flesh any longer.

Rev 21:2  And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

now we are being prepared and still are subject to the flesh, but as the bride of Christ that shows where the Elect will be spiritually commitment in every way. I believe that is a different love than the physical love we have here, a much deeper all consumming perfect kind of love that we just can have in the flesh.

Rev 19:6  And I heard as the sound of a great multitude, and as the sound of many waters, and as the sound of strong thunders, saying, Hallelujah! For the Lord God omnipotent reigns!
v. 7  Let us be glad and rejoice and we will give glory to Him. For the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has prepared herself.
v. 8  And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white. For the fine linen is the righteousness of the saints.
v. 9  And he said to me, Write, Blessed are those who have been called to the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he said to me, These are the true sayings of God.

1Co 2:9  But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
v. 10  But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

mercy, peace and love
Kat

[DougE6]

John Michael...I think you hit it right on the head. Kat..very nice, as always.

Just by using a natural analogy that I think is appropriate...whatever pleasures the caterpillar has, in his blind terrestrial confined space on the food plant he munches on and loves so much...he hasn't a clue what the freedom and arboreal existence of the butterfly which he will someday be, he has no clue as to how much different and better life is on a much higher plane.

You cannot even compare what we are to what we will be. Sex will be absolutely unimportant and frankly, not missed. I don't think the butterfly misses chewing leaves compared to drinking nectar and the freedom of flight, and the beauty of what they are now...

[Gina]

Hi Gina,

Christ said there will be no "marriage" because all marriages in the bible as well as today are "until death do you part" 

Romans 7:2  For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of husband.

In the resurrection life, there will be no more death.

Of course, God will be the center of our lives, but we probably will have our own little circles of holy relationships also ??

haha!  No.  Because think about it.  Babies have died and never had gotten married.  When they are resurrected, they will not marry or be given in marriage.  Sex is not everything there is, and besides, it's a shadow of something much grander and much purer.    Do we want the shadow or the One who casts the shadow?  (And, no, I don't mean we'll be having sex with Christ.  But whatever Paul saw in the trance he fell into must have been NO match for sex, otherwise Paul would have never said, it would be better if you didn't marry (not that you couldn't marry).  How about Jesus?  He obviously knows there's something grander than sex / marriage.  He went to His death never having had it.  Not having sex is not what killed Him.   

[Gina]

I don't think the butterfly misses chewing leaves compared to drinking nectar and the freedom of flight, and the beauty of what they are now...

Whoa!!! Now you're talkin!

[DougE6]

1Co 15:28  When all things are subjected to him, then the Son himself will also be subjected to him who put all things in subjection under him, that God may be all in all.

To me, those 6 words in bold sum it all up. What need of sex would we have when all of God is in all of us? How much closer communion would/could there be, than complete union with God and with each other? If I am filled to the fullness with Him, would I really need anything else? If I am completely satisfied with Him, do I need something like sex?

Sex, for all its pleasures, is intinsically carnal, earthly, physical, and selfish; it was a good way that God could illustrate to carnal loving minds the POTENTIAL oneness and the closeness of love. It is merely a shadow of the much deeper and greater oneness that will be between God and man and everyone with each other. And this oneness will not have jealousy, not have any selfishness associated with it at all.

[mharrell08]

Looks like this topic has run its course. Let's move on.