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How to explain God's role in tradgedy
Kat:
Hi Octoberose,
--- Quote --- I wrestle with Luke 13:34 where Jesus says he longs to gather Jerusalem as a mother hen, but they were not willing. And then there's Cain and God's pleading (for lack of a better word) with him and Cain goes on to kill his brother. How to look at those scriptures in the light of all the others you've shown here?
I heard Ray say that we don't accuse God of sin, that is Not what He does and that's not what we're saying here. But he does use evil (ra) for our benefit.
--- End quote ---
I will give you my view and maybe it will help a bit. We know that God is sovereign and that He not only knows, but ultimately causes everything, even evil, that happens. But we can be certain that He has no pleasure in His heart of the wickedness that we willingly volunteer to do and the evils that happens. So as there is the necessary evils in this world for now, as God's plan does require it, but God will continually states what is in His heart for what will eventually come to be. God will always state what is righteous and what is good, even when He intends that we go against His will for now. One day He will gather up all of Jerusalem in His arms and one day He will wipe away all tears.
Here is an excerpt from 'Twelve Truths to Understanding His Word.'
http://bible-truths.com/twelve.htm --------------------------------------------------
God’s plan and purpose for humanity consists of many, many things which are not after God’s own heart, but that are, nonetheless, absolutely essential for the completion of His plan:
"Say unto them, As I live, says the Lord God, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?" (Ezek. 33:11).
This is God’s HEART speaking in this verse. But in the MIND of God, the death of the wicked was absolutely necessary, and a prophesied fact that could not be avoided:
"For I will lay the land most desolate, and the pomp of her strength shall cease, and the mountains of Israel shall be desolate, that none shall pass through" (Ver. 28).
This is but another of countless examples in Scripture that show God’s mind and His heart. God takes no pleasure or delight in His heart over the horrible things that continually happen to humanity, but nonetheless, these things are absolutely essential to the fulfillment of the plan that God has devised in His mind.
It is absolute blasphemy to think or teach that God is the Creator of all that is, but then takes zero responsibility for all the evils of that creation—ALL is of God.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is an email.
http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,2885.0.html --------
People go against God's will ALL DAY LONG. That's what most
peoples' lives consist of--going against God's will. It is God's purpose, plan, and
intentions that absolutely no one has ever or ever will go against. Listen: It is
God's purpose and plan that people GO AGAINST HIS WILL. He purposes for
people to go against His will. It is God's will that we all become PERFECT as He
is perfect, but it is in His sovereign plan that we all live very imperfect lives before
God begins to change us into perfecion.
God be with you,
Ray
octoberose:
Thank you all so much- that helps me sort through things.
And yes, I've had that experience where I seem prohibited- good word-from expressing the Truth. I wonder, Kat, if you ever feel that way too since you always seem to have a timely Word?
Kat:
Octoberose funny you should ask. Just last night I was on the phone with my sister... I'm not around her much, but have spoken a few things to her in the past and I got the deer in the headlight look, she could not begin to grasp what I was saying. So last night on the phone with her the topic of death came up and I thought real hard trying to think of something to say that would help her understanding, and I could not really come up with anything that could disrupt her Baptist beliefs. So I do think that sometimes we are prohibited, as we realize we should not cast our pearls before the blind/swine.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
octoberose:
That is something-thank you for sharing it. Perhaps in time God will open her eyes-bless her heart, she has no idea what a treasure she has in her own family. :)
dogcombat:
Tis true OR,
We find in Daniel 4 (KJV)
29 At the end of twelve months he walked in the palace of the kingdom of Babylon.
30 The king spake, and said, Is not this great Babylon, that I have built for the house of the kingdom by the might of my power, and for the honour of my majesty?
31 While the word was in the king's mouth, there fell a voice from heaven, saying, O king Nebuchadnezzar, to thee it is spoken; The kingdom is departed from thee.
32 And they shall drive thee from men, and thy dwelling shall be with the beasts of the field: they shall make thee to eat grass as oxen, and seven times shall pass over thee, until thou know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will.
33 The same hour was the thing fulfilled upon Nebuchadnezzar: and he was driven from men, and did eat grass as oxen, and his body was wet with the dew of heaven, till his hairs were grown like eagles' feathers, and his nails like birds' claws.
34 And at the end of the days I Nebuchadnezzar lifted up mine eyes unto heaven, and mine understanding returned unto me, and I blessed the most High, and I praised and honoured him that liveth for ever, whose dominion is an everlasting dominion, and his kingdom is from generation to generation:
35 And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?
36 At the same time my reason returned unto me; and for the glory of my kingdom, mine honour and brightness returned unto me; and my counsellors and my lords sought unto me; and I was established in my kingdom, and excellent majesty was added unto me.
37 Now I Nebuchadnezzar praise and extol and honour the King of heaven, all whose works are truth, and his ways judgment: and those that walk in pride he is able to abase.[/b]
We can see how God was the one who CAUSED Nebuhanezzar's fall from ruling Babylon. And God RESTORED him there. None can stop God's hand nor question his ultimate plan. Well, we ALL question it, but God is NOT accountable to us. Perhaps a second read of "Why Does God Love You" might bring you a little more grace to know that God is in control. If it be His will, you'll "understand it better by and by".
God be with you
Ches
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