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Author Topic: The graves were opened...and many bodies of the saints were raised.  (Read 2853 times)

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Mbongiseni

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Hi All

I have some difficulty trying to figure out whether this part of the story is indeed inspired, which is given by Matthew in chapter 27 v50-53  "And Jesus cried out again with a loud voice, and yielded up His spirit. 51 Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, 52 and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; 53 and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many.Matthew seems to be the only one who witnessed such an event. Who did these 'sants' appear to and where did they disappear to?

Mbo
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mharrell08

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Re: The graves were opened...and many bodies of the saints were raised.
« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2012, 07:30:30 AM »

Who did these 'sants' appear to and where did they disappear to?


This is no different than the accounts of Jesus resurrecting Lazarus [John 11:38-44] or Paul resurrecting young Eutychus [Acts 20:7-12]. All these instances were to be a witness of God's power to resurrect the dead. They all lived as long as they did and later died.


Hope this helps,

Marques
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Samson

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Re: The graves were opened...and many bodies of the saints were raised.
« Reply #2 on: January 24, 2012, 09:28:51 AM »

Hi All

I have some difficulty trying to figure out whether this part of the story is indeed inspired, which is given by Matthew in chapter 27 v50-53  "And Jesus cried out again with a loud voice, and yielded up His spirit. 51 Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, 52 and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; 53 and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many.Matthew seems to be the only one who witnessed such an event. Who did these 'sants' appear to and where did they disappear to?

Mbo


Hi MBO,

In My JW past, this was a tough one for Me, Well their explanation made it tough for me. They tried to say that these were just bodies thrown up from overturned graves from an Earthquake resulting from Jesus death & downplayed the Saints walking downtown to stop at Mcdonalds for everyone to see them, only kidding about the fast food poison joint,  ;D. Read an Email from Ray found below in Blue that pretty much sums it up.

Hi Ray'
> I am very much impressed about your research and
> revelations of the scriptures and I wish you can
> enlighten me on this scripture that has baffled me for
> ages. Matt.27:50-53.
> 1 Did a first resurrection happen before Christ's as
> this scripture suggest?
> 2 Does this contradict Heb. 11 especially 39,40
> 3 Where are these people who appeared to many in the
> holy city. Did they ascend with Jesus to the Father?
> Did they live and die agaian? Where are these Many
> Holy People who has been resurrected?
> I am a lover of the Truth and always want to know the
> Truth. This is DEEP!!! Talk to me Ray.
> Regards
> Reynolds.


Dear Reynolds:  You have to learn to read more carefully. Notice it says: "And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, and came out of the graves AFTER HIS [Jesus'] resurrection..."

These were saints that had recently died, and who could be easily recognized by many, hence proving that God can not only raise His Son from the dead, but anyone He wishes.  These saints were resurrected back to mortal life (they were not "vivified" as is used in reference to life of immortality). They died again as did Lazarus and all others that were resurrected from the dead by Jesus and the apostles. And no, this this not contradict Heb. 11:39 or any other Scripture of the Bible.

God be with you,

Ray

Boy, that was allot simpler to understand than the JW'S trying find another translation that made it look like the Saints really weren't raised,  ;).

Hope this Helps, Samson.
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Rob M

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Re: The graves were opened...and many bodies of the saints were raised.
« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2012, 10:39:53 AM »

Hi All

I have some difficulty trying to figure out whether this part of the story is indeed inspired, which is given by Matthew in chapter 27 v50-53  "And Jesus cried out again with a loud voice, and yielded up His spirit. 51 Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, 52 and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; 53 and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many.Matthew seems to be the only one who witnessed such an event. Who did these 'sants' appear to and where did they disappear to?

Mbo
A friend of mine who is a non believer, always cites this passage when arguing  if events of the Bible actually happened. From his point of view, how come no one but Matthew bothered to record this event...here are previous dead people walking around the city, appeared to many, yet the only evidence this happened is from the Bible. I can see his point of view. My point of view is, if this event did not take place, then my faith is in vain..which of course to him is a weak argument.
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Mbongiseni

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Re: The graves were opened...and many bodies of the saints were raised.
« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2012, 10:57:55 AM »

Thanks Samson, thanks all!

Let me admit these bodies were resurrected together with Jesus Christ...But why is it cited as an event that took place at Jesus's death when he gave his spirit? Verse 51 start thus ' Then,...the veil of the temple was torn in two ...and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, 52 and the graves were opened...and many bodies ...

If I get it the earthquake Matthew is describing happened during Christ's resurrection yet he combies these events as if they all happened simulteneously whils he is watching.

Yes the explanation is quite the best one can find so far.

Thanks
Mbo

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Samson

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Re: The graves were opened...and many bodies of the saints were raised.
« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2012, 11:05:04 AM »

Hi All

I have some difficulty trying to figure out whether this part of the story is indeed inspired, which is given by Matthew in chapter 27 v50-53  "And Jesus cried out again with a loud voice, and yielded up His spirit. 51 Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, 52 and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised; 53 and coming out of the graves after His resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many.Matthew seems to be the only one who witnessed such an event. Who did these 'sants' appear to and where did they disappear to?

Mbo
A friend of mine who is a non believer, always cites this passage when arguing  if events of the Bible actually happened. From his point of view, how come no one but Matthew bothered to record this event...here are previous dead people walking around the city, appeared to many, yet the only evidence this happened is from the Bible. I can see his point of view. My point of view is, if this event did not take place, then my faith is in vain..which of course to him is a weak argument.

Hi Rob,

I guess your friend doesn't realize that all of the Gospel Accounts don't have to mention every detail that other ones don't mention for the actual event to have taken place. The Key to believing this passage is believing in The Resurrection, as mentioned in Marques Post, some recorded Resurrections took place prior to that event. If God doesn't open up your Friend's eyes to Spiritually see, He ain't gonna believe it, as you probably already know, it's just the way it is.

Kind Regards, Samson.
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Rob M

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Re: The graves were opened...and many bodies of the saints were raised.
« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2012, 12:11:10 PM »

I agree with you Samson...he is always looking for sources outside of the Bible that these events occured. Not to say that he doesen't believe in some events that are recorded in the Bible, but he's more apt to believe if there is more than one source for a particular claim.
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Craig

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Re: The graves were opened...and many bodies of the saints were raised.
« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2012, 12:21:41 PM »

It seems to me that if dead people came into a city and started walking around then it would have made pretty big news in those days.  But as far as I know the only account is Mathew.  When I consider the words of scripture I look for another scriptural witness of a truth and I don't see one in this account. 

It doesn't bother me one way or the other but I consider it spurious or a mistranslation.  If someone wants to only consider one verse to be able to completely throw away scripture then so be it, there are plenty enough in our translations for them to hang their hats on.

Craig
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John from Kentucky

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Re: The graves were opened...and many bodies of the saints were raised.
« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2012, 04:08:33 PM »

Much information was lost and destroyed with the destruction of Jerusalem and adjacent lands.

Titus destroyed the city and Temple in 70 A.D.  Sixty-five years later in 135 A.D. the Emperor Hadrian destroyed the city again, which was possibly even a greater destruction.

The destruction was so great that even the exact location of the Temple is unknown.  The Temple was the central structure in Jerusalem; however, even today no human knows the location of the Temple.  Even the Jews lost this information.

In fact, it is a good possibility, that what everyone calls the Temple Mount today is actually the site of Fortress Antonia, the headquarters of the Roman government and legion.  The actual location of the Temple may be slightly south of the "Temple Mount", built directly over the Gihon Spring.  No one (except God) can prove beyond doubt the exact location of the Temple.

This could be an excellent joke from God.  Three major religions think the Temple Mount is a holy place and it could have been the location of the Roman government.   ;D ;D ;D

The point is---much, much historical information was lost.  The only completely reliable information we have is preserved in the scriptures, which was kept for us by the Power of God.
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Kat

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Re: The graves were opened...and many bodies of the saints were raised.
« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2012, 06:45:02 PM »


Good point John.

Mbo about your comment;

Quote
Let me admit these bodies were resurrected together with Jesus Christ...But why is it cited as an event that took place at Jesus's death when he gave his spirit? Verse 51 start thus ' Then,...the veil of the temple was torn in two ...and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split, 52 and the graves were opened...and many bodies ...

If I get it the earthquake Matthew is describing happened during Christ's resurrection yet he combies these events as if they all happened simulteneously whils he is watching.

All punctuation was put in by the translator and as I have transcribed some of Ray's audios I can tell you, where punctuation is placed can make a huge difference. So in these verses I think that mainly it is just the order of events that happened.

Mat 27:51-53 And lo! the curtain of the temple is rent in two from above to the bottom, and the earth quaked, and the rocks are rent,  and the tombs were opened. And many bodies of the reposing saints were roused, and, coming out of the tombs after His rousing, they entered into the holy city and are disclosed to many." (CLV)

So the curtain and graves were rent/opened by this earthquake, this is understood to be when Jesus died. But I noticed that at least the Concordant did put a period after that, so in that translation it is the start of the next sentence that the dead did rise. Now since I believe this is giving the order of events, it certainly could have been a period of time between when the graves wer rent opened by the earthquake and then, a little later, they actually were raised "after" His resurrection, which they Scripture does plainly state.
Just thought I would mention what I thought about this concerning your comment.

mercy, peace and love
Kat

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Mbongiseni

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Re: The graves were opened...and many bodies of the saints were raised.
« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2012, 05:25:24 AM »


Again I would like to thank all  contributions in this thread.
I think Craig hit the nail on the head! It's been my suspicions all along
Quote
...When I consider the words of scripture I look for another scriptural witness of a truth and I don't see one in this account. It doesn't bother me one way or the other but I consider it spurious or a mistranslation
Contrary to some the suggestion that ..
Quote
Not to say that he doesen't believe in some events that are recorded in the Bible
I do believe in the resurrection of the dead ..."As God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus..."[Ephesians 2:6] will always "set my heart on things above, where Christ is seated at the right hand of God.'

Thanks also John your historical backround is quite helpful.

God bless
Mbo
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