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Jesus: "the CREATED of the Father"
santgem:
Hello Kat,
Greetings!
It is very clear in Psa 22:10 saying that "thou art my God from the time I was born" or "thou art my God from my mother's belly"
What does it say, from my mother's belly / from the time i was born or from eternity?
The prophecy stated that Jesus has a God from the time he was born from, in the Scripture say from his mother's belly or he has a God from the time he was born on the earth not when the time when Jesus comes out from the Father.
even;
We cannot see in the OT when Jesus is still the Yahweh/Jehovah that he has a God but always saying "there is no God beside me".
I believe that the plan or drama started when Jesus sent by the Father to become human in order to save mankind.
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.The same was in the beginning with God. John 1:1-2
Dave in Tenn:
--- Quote from: Dennis Vogel on August 23, 2014, 11:00:58 AM ---
--- Quote from: Dennis Vogel on August 20, 2014, 11:56:11 AM ---Maybe listen to all of this:
http://bible-truths.com/audio/9-2-06MobileConf.4.mp3
--- End quote ---
I was off by one video. Try this one:
http://bible-truths.com/audio/9-2-06MobileConf.5.mp3
--- End quote ---
Thanks, Dennis. They both were very helpful, and I worshiped Him.
Kat:
Hi santgem,
Just because Psalms 22 says "thou art my God from the time I was born" it does not exclude that the Father was His God before that. Now when God is spoken of in the OT it includes the Father and Son... THEY are one - God from the beginning when the Son came forth.
Gen 1:26 Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness;
Gen 3:22 Then the LORD God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of Us,
Gen 11:7 Come, let Us go down and there confuse their language, that they may not understand one another's speech."
Compare that to this next verse that is speaking of the very same thing as Gen 1:26 where God is used instead of the plural pronoun, WE/OUR.
Gen 5:1 This is the book of the genealogy of Adam. In the day that God created man, He made him in the likeness of God.
It was not until the Son came in the flesh that the Father is "revealed" to us.
Luke 10:22 All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, and who the Father is except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him."
mercy, peace and love
Kat
santgem:
--- Quote from: Kat on August 23, 2014, 01:53:45 PM ---
Hi santgem,
Just because Psalms 22 says "thou art my God from the time I was born" it does not exclude that the Father was His God before that. Now when God is spoken of in the OT it includes the Father and Son... THEY are one - God from the beginning when the Son came forth.
Gen 1:26 Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness;
Gen 3:22 Then the LORD God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of Us,
Gen 11:7 Come, let Us go down and there confuse their language, that they may not understand one another's speech."
Compare that to this next verse that is speaking of the very same thing as Gen 1:26 where God is used instead of the plural pronoun, WE/OUR.
Gen 5:1 This is the book of the genealogy of Adam. In the day that God created man, He made him in the likeness of God.
It was not until the Son came in the flesh that the Father is "revealed" to us.
Luke 10:22 All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, and who the Father is except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him."
mercy, peace and love
Kat
--- End quote ---
Hello Kat,
Greetings!
Again as i said that Jesus has a God when that certain time that Jesus sent to have a human form.
When Jesus made flesh, then at the time he has a God so speak with Psalm 22.
Can you not comprehend that when God created a God then you have two Gods?
but, when that God comes out with God that God will be one with that God so to speak in John 1
You said;
It was not until the Son came in the flesh that the Father is "revealed" to us.
I said;
It was when the Son came in the flesh that the Father is "revealed" to us.
Behold, I am the LORD, the God of all flesh: is there any thing too hard for me? Jer 32:27
It was when Jesus came in the flesh that the Father became Jesus God.
Jesus is God and with God.
Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever you had formed the earth and the world, from everlasting to everlasting you are God. Psalm 90:2
For in Christ lives all the fullness of God in a human body. Col 2:9
Kat:
--- Quote from: santgem on August 23, 2014, 02:22:24 PM ---
Can you not comprehend that when God created a God then you have two Gods?
but, when that God comes out with God that God will be one with that God so to speak in John 1
--- End quote ---
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
I am having a little bit of a hard time following what you are saying... When the Father brought forth the Son/Word in the beginning, they were not separated into 2 Gods, because I believe the Father brought the Son forth as an extended part of Himself. The Father is not a being, so He made/created a part of Himself to be a Being just for this creation. But that part is not disconnected from the Father, He is in His bosom and the Father has complete control over the Son.
John 1:18 No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.
John 5:30 I can of Myself do nothing. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own will but the will of the Father who sent Me.
John 8:28 Then Jesus said to them, "When you lift up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am He, and that I do nothing of Myself; but as My Father taught Me, I speak these things.
I believe They are one, the Son has always been total and completely God... a way to look at it, it's sort of like looking at a part of our body, say the arm, it's a part of me and functions for certain purposes, it's not considered everything that I am just part of me, but not separate at all. But I control it and it is totally mine/me. Not a perfect analogy, but maybe it will help you see where I'm coming from.
When the Son came into the flesh He did not separate from the Father then either. His physical existence did not break that bond of oneness, He was still God (Matt 1:23) and retained the Spirit without measure (John 3:34).
John 10:30 I and My Father are one."
The elect will also join into that unity of Their oneness and will be perfected as sons of God at the first resurrection.
Luke 20:35 But those who are counted worthy to attain that age, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry nor are given in marriage;
v. 36 nor can they die anymore, for they are equal to the angels and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection.
John 17:21 that they all may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me.
v. 22 And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be one just as We are one:
mercy, peace and love
Kat
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