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[Gina]

Hey, Gang

Is anyone familiar with the "Drama Triangle"  of persecutor/victim/rescuer? 

I heard about it from a woman at my work building on a break one day about 8 years ago and it really intrigued me.  I've never forgotten it. 

She told me the only way another person can enter a "drama triangle" is by becoming the rescuer who in turn "persecutes" the persecutor in an effort to rescue the "victim." 

And then she said the only way to get out of it is to...  ... not enter it, or something?  That's the part I can't remember.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

[acomplishedartis]

Hi

You can find the 'drama triangle' on wikipedia. I didn't know about it, then I checked it out.

It is like a mental game that people tent to play with out noticing, where the persecutor/victim/rescuer change positions as long as the show keeps running.

It is interesting how subtle it is for us to fall into vanity. specially when we pretend to be doing something good for others. I have missed the mark on these so many times...

I suppose that the best way to get out of those 'mental games' is stop reacting fast and stop judging easily. It takes practice I guess...

[Revilonivek]

Yeah- that's what happens when we partake in the tree of knowledge of  Good and evil. It's bad for us. That is why God said, Don't eat it. He's just trying to teach us.  like we would learn from touching a hot skillet. Our parents would say to us, don't touch it, it's hot. we dont' listen and touch anyway, out of curiosity.  we learn from touching the hot skillet that find that it burns... It is the same thing. God is telling us not to eat that tree of knowledge of good and evil, and when we ate, we began to die inside because we were so focused on what is good and evil to us than what is more important. Love.

With partaking of that tree,  it's so easy to judge what we perceive is good or evil instead of focusing on love itself and whatever sets us apart from one another.

We just need to vomit what was ingested from the tree of good and evil. It's bad for us. it changed our perception, It broke our relationship with God.

That is why it is so easy to judge because of that darn tree.

Just have to change the perception and focus on it one day at a time.

[Kat]

Hi Gina, I've never heard of this 'drama triangle.' Interesting and I'm sure there is a lot of this going on in the world.

But I would like to post concerning the tree of good and evil that Denise is speaking about, I do not believe that God did not want us to partake of the tree of good and evil. This whole thing of the tree of good and evil is an allegory that represents life. I think when He said "you shall not eat of it" was because of the warning that came after He said that, "for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die." We are always warned what will happen, even if it is inevitable to happen. Life is not all bad/evil, there is good in that tree as well. And if you think about it, to eat of the tree of good and evil is the only way to get to the Tree of Life.

Here is an excerpt from one of Ray article concerning this.

http://bible-truths.com/kennedy2.htm ----------------------------

Religion and theologians have so clouded men's minds that many can't even think straight anymore. Most do not meditate at any length or depth on what they read in God's Word. If Adam and Eve had NOT eaten of the tree of the knowledge of "GOOD and evil," would they have had a realization that they had done a good thing by being obedient? No. They wouldn't. Why? Because they didn't have a knowledge of "good and evil." That knowledge is in the fruit of a tree that they wouldn't have eaten from. If Adam and Eve never obtained a "knowledge of GOOD and evil," how could they ever know ("knowledge") good?

Since this tree contained not only the knowledge of evil, but of good also, why did God forbid them from eating it in the first place? Or, why didn't He plant another tree in the garden that contained ONLY the knowledge of "good?" Why not two trees: (1) the tree of the knowledge of good, and (2) the tree of the knowledge of evil. They could have eaten of the tree of the knowledge of good only, and rejected the tree of the knowledge of evil, and all of the suffering of the human race would have never came about, and we would all be living in a garden of happiness and bliss to this very day. Or would we? Why didn't God do it this way? Because God is intelligent and wise, not stupid and foolish like the people who come up with questions as these.

God is good (Mark 10:18). God possesses a knowledge of "good and evil" (Gen. 3:22). God wants Sons (Eph. 1:5). Sons possess the attributes of their Father. There it is. One cannot know good without a knowledge of evil. That's why they are both in the same tree, in the same fruit. We cannot know one without a knowledge of the other.
---------------------------------------------------------------

mercy, peace and love
Kat

[Revilonivek]

 
How do you explain why there are many people in the world so  divided against each other ?Is it because of everyone's different perception of good and evil? is it why we end up judging one another- I think it is the perception of good and evil that keeps us divided.

The tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil is not just any tree.  It was good for food, a delight to the eyes, could make one wise, and can cause altered consciousness?

The question is Why did God command Adam to NOT  eat from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil in the first place then? If he wanted us to keep the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil in the end?

From reading Ray's explanation. While most of it makes sense but one thing bugs me. In a sense he said that God is trying to teach us to mature  while we maintain the knowledge of Good and evil, 

My question is why did he "WARN" in the first place not to eat from the tree? Why the need to warn? He said as soon as we did, we would die.

I mean, Parents out there will understand the meaning of warning your child when they're about to do something that will cause harm to them. You know when you warn your child, you know it's for their good. to protect them.  Why did God see it as something that is dangerous to Adam? Why did he warn Adam? Warning means the parent percieve it as harmful to the child. Make sense? see where i'm coming from?  He said as soon as we partook, we would die. Scripture say  relationship was broken as soon as they partook.


I think he put it there to teach us something. We are learning it the hard way. right now. here in this life. we are so divided because we have the perception of good and evil. we are always fighting, throughout history- religions after religions-they kill in the name that they perceive as good.   Our perceptions are built from what we perceive as good and evil growing up. We have our own standards of what we perceive as good and evil. You and me, and everyone else don't have the same standard of good and evil.

 I see God Like a parent would teach his child. we tend to learn things best  the hard way. This is one example. We are experiencing the consequences of having an altered consciousness. All this division in the world. All the fighting.. all the divisions, which perception is correct, which one is wrong, which one is right, all the fighting.  We are experiencing the consequences of eating that tree. We are learning the reasons why God said not to partake of that tree.

 As soon as Adam and Eve partook that apple- their eyes were opened- they began to believe that being naked was evil and they started covering themselves up. They didn't before. it was Natural to them but now it isnt. It is the beginning of altered consciousness. It is the altered consciousness that kept us apart from being close to God. God never saw anything wrong with being naked. They did. It is their altered consciousness that divided us from God.

It is when Jesus came, He showed God's grace for us, grace covers muiltitide of sins. Love covers a mulititide of sins. He is trying to teach us how to get back to before we partook the tree. we need the mind of Christ to do that. In a sense God promised Adam and Eve that one of their seed will  Rescue us.

God put it there because he had a purpose. He is teaching us and we are learning it the hard way.

[Craig]

Why the need to warn?

"I Believe that the Holy Scriptures are God's Authorized Biography."

What does it matter why the warning?  If you are a child and I say don't put that key in a electric socket or you will get shocked, if you have never been shocked before I guarantee you will put something in the socket.  After you get shocked you will not likely do it again.  I warned you but the only way to learn or even understand my warning you would need to experience it.  That is part of our creation process.

God put it there because he had a purpose.

Absolutely it was put there purposely, to create us in His image.

He is teaching us and we are learning it the hard way.

Yes we are learning, is it possible to learn any other way but the hard way?

Reminds me of a thread Dave started concerning Rev. 10.  and the little book.  John see's the cover of the book (let's call it The Reconcilliation of God and All Men) and he eats it and it was the sweetest thing.  But then after digesting it, the realization of how hard the process was set in and it became bitter in his belly.

Craig

[blissfulkitten]

I gotta confess, I've been guilty of being a rescuer/victim at times.  I had a low self esteem, and have often felt like a victim of life circumstances.  Attitude and life perspective can stop it.  Anyway, I never gave it much thought until seeing this.  I just did a little research, and found this on breaking the triangle:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Empowerment_Dynamic

[Kat]

Denise your response really has nothing to do with this topic and now responding to your answer could very well take over this thread. So please start your own topic on this matter, if you want to further discuss it.

Sorry your thread got side tracked a bit Gina.

mercy, peace and love
Kat

[Revilonivek]

Im sorry Gina.  I have posted this under the wrong place. i wasnt thinking. I was reading your post and it bought up thoughts of good and evil issue of persecutor/ victims and Rescuer triangle. It flooded thoughts and I forgot this isn't the right topic for it. I can relate to the victim/rescuer. ive been there plenty of time. in any sense, it is the perception of good and evil. it hurts people all around whether one is a persecutor, victim or rescuer.


Denise

[Gina]

No, no, Kat -- TAKE OVER THE THREAD! haha  I'm enjoying this....

As Samson says,

Carry on...   

Denise your response really has nothing to do with this topic and now responding to your answer could very well take over this thread. So please start your own topic on this matter, if you want to further discuss it.

Sorry your thread got side tracked a bit Gina.

mercy, peace and love
Kat

[Samson]

Hey, Gang

Is anyone familiar with the "Drama Triangle"  of persecutor/victim/rescuer? 

I heard about it from a woman at my work building on a break one day about 8 years ago and it really intrigued me.  I've never forgotten it. 

She told me the only way another person can enter a "drama triangle" is by becoming the rescuer who in turn "persecutes" the persecutor in an effort to rescue the "victim." 

And then she said the only way to get out of it is to...  ... not enter it, or something?  That's the part I can't remember.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

Never heard of it Gina,

Moises seemed to explain this scenario, reminds Me a little of the Manipulator/Enabler or the Alcoholic/Codependent combinations often prevalent in Family relationships. I know, a different subject, but it popped into my head. We find these two combinations mentioned above in Marriages, it's Dysfunctional, but often happens.

Carry On, Samson,  ,