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[snorky]

This is my first post aside from Bobby's welcome reply.

Testimony: I was doing research on political connections of religious right figures when I saw a google adwords thing advertizing Bible-Truths.org, and I clicked on it and FINALLY found a Christian site that wasn't full of heresy, rapture nonsense, hell-fire and damnation, and "buy this book" stuff. I am convinced God had a reason for leading me here. I was beginning to think I'd never find another forum to get with the truth about.

Question: When the "state of Israel" is mentioned in the news or in "prophecy", this refers to "the flesh Israel"? Or the "spiritual" "chosen people" Israel (as opposed to the May 1948 state of Israel), or are they both the same? I think this confusion (or maybe it's just me) may have a lot to do with why so many people have allowed themselves (or God has allowed them) to be deluded by all that rapture nonsense. I know the politics of the world is NOT supposed to be very important as opposed to the spiritual truths, but even though we are not of the world we are in it, nevertheless. Plus, my husband believes a lot of that rapture stuff and Hal-Lindsey-esque prophecy, and I'd like to have y'all's opinions and insights so maybe I can help him see it isn't Biblically correct.

So, if you all could clear up this Israel stuff... He really thinks all this stuff going on with Israel & Lebanon is prophetic, and I don't know how to deal with it for certain. So, if God has it to put into anyone's mind, enlighten me.

snorky

Matthew 20..."it ain't how you start but how you finish"

[orion77]

Hello snorky,

Welcome to the forum.  The questions you asked are hard to answer, yet I would consider you to look at what is going on in the world now.  Are we to be a part of it?  Or are we called out of this world?  And is not His kingdom not of this world?  Relligious leaders have used these things that happen in this world to keep people under their control. 

We, the true believers are no longer of this world.  So, why should we be like those of the world and take such stock on what happens.  Those people who sell books and have huge ministries are making money and making huge money feeding from the fear of others.  Perfect love casts out fear, we must put faith that He gave us and put it towards His kingdom, and not of the world.

The political system of this world, who have always professed that they are of God, no matter what relligion they believe, when and if you read the word of God, truly are not of God.  They do not love God, they do not love their neighbor, and they sure don't forgive their enemies.  We must be careful not to get drawn into their lies, and that is exactly what they are, lies. 

Yet, it is a strange thing, this life, I have known many good intented people drawn into the ways of this world.  We all have done it, we are all guilty.  Thank God, He is a God of love, mercy, and forgiveness.  Think about it, does the world follow these aspects, I think not.  And if they do not follow these things, then they  do not follow Christ.  Simple math, to me.  So, why listen to those who continually speak of worldly things.

Hope this helps a little anyway, I sure dont know much on this subject.  But anyways welcome to the forum.

God bless,

Gary

[MG]

Hi Snorky,

Ray wrote a lot about Israel and the rapture here

http://bible-truths.com/rapture.htm

I haven't read it all myself, but there is a lot of information.

[snorky]

All y'all's posts are great...thanks!

Anyway, all you folks know I shouldn't worry about politics or world events since God's in control anyway. I shouldn't worry or be concerned in the slightest, I know that intellectually but, the way I lived my life the past several years (horrified, for instance, that we actually invaded the cradle of civilization...I'm a history buff) giving up being concerned about the world has been the hardest thing I have had to do. And I guess what y'all are saying is God will open up my hubby's eyes when He chooses (I just hope and pray He does...you know that part in Matthew 24 about spouses turning against each other).

So that really helped with your posts. And all that stuff about preachers spouting fear and falsehood...I guess God chooses not to open the hearts of people caught up with all the fear and hate (of antiwar types like me, of Arabs, of Muslims, of the thrid world, etc., in the name of God). I am just so glad that this is seemingly a place of Christian SANITY!

snorky

[buddyjc]

Thank God those days are over!!!All is done according to God's will. The media,pastors of various denominations,theologeans,etc.. think they know all the answers. They have no clue as to what is going on. I will have to admit that I am a bit clueless myself but one thing I can be sure of and that is the peace of God. Knowing that God is in full control!

You know Bobby, these clergy use these teachings to scare us.  I completely read nine of the 'Left Behind' books that are so popular.  The funny thing is though, I found Ray's site sometime in the middle of book 7.  When I got to 'The Glorious Return,' book ten, I was so disgusted, I couldn't even finish it.  You may not know this, but I work as a janitor in the church I grew up in.  I do not attend services, but I am usually there when they have a weekly revival.  There is always one night that they give their Second Coming sermon.  There is always a large number of people that walk the aisles that night, and it is all because they are afraid that they will be 'left behind.' 

I too am glad those days of always wondering if I'm 'saved' are gone.  It is such a wonderful thing to finally be over the fear. 

Brian Wilson

[mongoose]

Amen Brian.  Scaring people into heaven just doesn't make sense with our loving Father.  Didn't read the books, but watched the movie.  Ugh.  They should mark that stuff as horror films.  Thank God He has taught you not to fear that horrible doctrine of men.

mongoose

[buddyjc]

Phi 4:7  And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.

'Peace' is such a wonderful word, isn't it?  It amazes me that even through all the tribulation, adversity, chastisement, etc. we can still have peace.  Amen to you too Bobby.  You have been a great spirit here in the forum, and your posts always bless me. 

Your Brother in Christ,
Brian