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Did Jesus use the words Gehenna and Hades?
Samson:
--- Quote from: wasco55 on May 28, 2012, 08:59:00 AM ---Thanks a lot Samson for your information. I was not aware that Septuginta was in use in Israel at the time of Jesus. I know it was This was new information to me. I know it was written 200 years BC, but just thought it was used among the Jews in diaspora.
I agree with you on that onelovedread
This is another point that contradicts that Jesus talks about "hell" in the Sermon on the Mount. If he really wanted to warn people against an eternal damnation, why should he not tell this to all the people
--- End quote ---
Actually Wasco55, My apologies, I gave you the wrong Email of Ray's regarding Gehenna, Read Below ! That's what happens when I rush trying to get many things done with 1 3/4 of a Leg, ;).
Dear Dan:
I am sure that you are completely convinced that what I am saying in my material is wrong, evil, and of the devil. You are primarily basing all of that on a few mistranslation and false teachings of Christendom.
Your knowledge of the word "hell" is quite lacking. Hell has NOTHING to do with fire. "Hell fire" mentioned in the KJV is from the Greek word "Gehenna." It is a valley south of Jerusalem. It used to be the city garbage dump. As such it was on fire. As garbage and organic materials were constantly thrown into this fire, the worms there did not die out, but kept on multiplying until there was nothing left to eat. The valley is STILL in Jerusalem, Dan, but the fire is OUT and there are no WORMS there.
The word "hell" in the KJV is translated from the Greek word "Hades" which means the UNSEEN or etymologically, UN=PERCEIVE or IMPERCEPTIBLE. There can NOT be feelings, torture, pain, etc., in a place that by its very name means to have NO PERCEPTION OF ANYTHING!! People must first be resurrected from Hades before they will have perception again.
Are you interested enough in the Word of God to study this word and see if I am correct?
In Luke 8, the demons did not fear going to "hell." Read it, Dan, they feared being put back into the "deep" as it is in KJV or more properly the "submerged chaos." It is the SAME word translated "bottomless pit" in Rev. where Satan is held for a thousand years, and THEN he is put into the "lake of fire" (Ver. 10). (He is held in the pit because God has one more dirty work for Satan to perform before he begins his purification in the lake of fire (not the pit).
There is NO WORD in either the Hebrew or Greek scriptures that means "eternal" or "everlasting" or "for ever and ever." Since there is NO SUCH WORD IN THE BIBLE, all such translations are WRONG and misleading. See the first ten pages of my letter to John Hagee for absolute proof of this. If you don't agree, prove me wrong SCRIPTURALLY!
Dan, on a personal note. I know you feel very smug and comfortable in calling me OF THE DEVIL and that the DEVIL HAS ME and that I AM OF MY FATHER THE DEVIL, etc., etc. However, a word of warning: The one time that the Pharisees accused Jesus of doing something of the devil or the prince of demons, He warned them that if something really is of THE HOLY SPIRIT OF GOD and one says that that is really THE SPIRIT OF THE DEVIL, then they have committed a sin that will NOT be pardoned in this life (or age or world) or in the age to come. Such people WILL have to suffer the punishments of the lake of fire to be purified of such evil sins.
Sincerely,
Ray
wasco55:
Thank's a lot Gina for sharing these thoughts with me
Thank's once again to Samson also
I enjoyed Ray's explanation of Hades. This is the best interpretation of this word I've ever seen
whyisthatso:
Does anyone here remember what things where like in say....the year 1800 ? No, of course not. And that is because we had not been born yet, we did not exist. This is what hades ("hell") is like. Before we are born we do not exist (except maybe in the mind of God ). Then when we are born (given life), we experience "death" and return to that same sate of being, and that state being "dead" ( no life ).
Gina:
"Does anyone remember what things were like in the year 1800"? Bad example, David. We can't go back there, but we have some records, David. Even pictures/paintings. But I see what you're trying to say. It's just not quite right. Not to argue.
When people die they don't know they're dead. But they're loved ones do! Do you know and feel the emptiness of someone that was there and now isn't? Maybe, maybe not. But my memory isn't erased of them simply because they are now dead.
So no, it's not like the year 1800.
Not to be pushy, but have you had an opportunity to study any of Ray's papers, David?
Gina:
A better example, if we absolutely have to use one that Ray hasn't already used or isn't in the bible, might be to ask
"Do you remember what you were thinking when you were put under anesthesia when you had your gallbladder removed?"
I remember nothing when my wisdom teeth were removed. I was out for 45 minutes at least and when I woke up, it felt like I closed my eyes for a few seconds and then woke right back up. That's what death is like.
David, your example is like saying, "You can't possibly know what Abraham Lincoln was like at all because you weren't born yet -- you weren't there."
But that's not right because we have records and pictures so we can kind of know.
But death is like sleep, it is not like "not being alive in the 1800."
And not being born yet is not the same thing as having been alive and now being dead. But I see what you're saying.
Again, I don't mean to be argumentative. Just paying attention to all the words. :)
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