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Author Topic: Preterism  (Read 4053 times)

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Craig

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Preterism
« on: September 27, 2012, 10:03:19 AM »

Dear Geoff:  I too do not have the time to go through all this stuff, statement by statement, but I will not
subject you to read whole web sites to get an answer. The Preterist you communicated with chose to not
answer you because he couldn't.  He only knows how to put you into contact with those whom he believes
have the truth.  I receive countless such web sites, articles, and whole books that people tell me to read,
and THEN I WILL SEE THE FALLACY OF MY TEACHINGS. I will answer just the first statement at the bottom
of your e-mail regarding the Preterist's interpretation of Satan being bound for a thousand years:



----- Original Message -----
Subject: Preterism

Dear Ray,

I hope and pray that you are as well as can be under your trying circumstances.

The last time I wrote to you was about 4 months ago when I asked you if I could translate your articles into French, but you graciously declined as you believed that my French was not good enough.

I still felt that God wanted me to reach the French people with His truth of salvation for all, and other things like the mistranslation of certain words, as French bibles have the same errors as our English versions. Anyway, I started to post on a French-speaking forum at http://www.forum-chretien.com/, where I found a whole range of people believing a variety of different doctrines and, of course each person believes that they are right and everybody else is wrong.

I found one particular person hard to understand, not because of his French, but because he wrote as though the resurrection had already happened, and most of his posts would include something about the destruction of the temple in AD 70. When I pointed out to him that the resurrection is in the future he avoided a direct argument but wanted to talk about the meaning of the word “redemption”.  I decided to try another tack and posted a question asking if there were any preterists on the forum and if so could they explain the meaning of certain verses in Scripture. The verses  I posted were the ones you referred to in an email reply:

“Dear Jim:  Oh really?  And just when was Satan bound for a thousand years, and when was he loosed?  And when was he cast into the Lake of Fire? When was the former resurrection of the saints to reign with Jesus a thousand years?  When was the great and terrible "Day of the Lord?"  And just when did all the nation "learn war no more," and beat their spears into pruning hooks?  Seems they killed five US soldiers in Iraq just today. Did they kill them with "pruning hooks?"  And just when did the knowledge of the Lord cover the world as the water covers the seas?  When were God's judgments in the earth and "the inhabitants of the world learned righteousness?"  I have more than a little problem with Preterism.
God be with you,
Ray”

The verses with questions were:

Rev 20:2 And he lays hold of the dragon, the ancient serpent, who is the Adversary and Satan, and binds him a thousand years."


Question: When was Satan bound for a thousand years?

Rev 20:3 And he casts him into the submerged chaos and locks it, and seals it over him (lest he should still be deceiving the nations) until the thousand years should be finished. After these things he must be loosed a little time."

Question: When was Satan thrown into the lake of fire? When was he loosed for a little time?

Rev 20:6 Happy and holy is he who is having part in the former resurrection! Over these the second death has no jurisdiction, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will be reigning with Him the thousand years."

Question: When have the priests reigned with Christ the thousand years?

Isa 2:4 And He judges between the nations, and corrects many peoples. And they pound their swords into mattocks, and their spears into pruners. And nation is not lifting the sword against nation, nor learning still further to fight."

Question: When have people made their spears into pruners and learned not to fight?

Hab 2:14 For the earth shall be filled with the knowledge of Yahweh's glory, as the waters are covering over the sea."

When has the earth been filled with the knowledge of the LORD’s glory?

Isa 26:9 With my soul I yearn for You in the night. Indeed, with my spirit within me I will seek You early. For as a light are Your judgments to the earth, the dwellers of the habitance learn righteousness."

Question: When have the inhabitants of the earth learned righteousness?

The forum member that I spoke of earlier replied that it would take too long to answer each question individually, but suggested I visit the following sites : (They are in English)
 
http://en.preterism.com/index.php?title=What_is_Preterism#The_Second_Coming

http://www.preteristcosmos.com/questionsandanswers.html

http://preterism.ning.com/

He also suggested I watch this video :

You've Got to be Kidding http://vimeo.com/6815887

To be fair to him I read a lot on two of the sites and I watched the video. I thought if I did that I would be able to post back “et alors, what about the questions?” But what actually happened was that the more I read on the sites, and studied the Word from a preterist perspective, the more convinced I became that Jesus did return in AD 70. I am also convinced that when Jesus spoke of “this generation” in Matthew 24 He meant exactly that, and when He spoke of “some standing here not tasting death until they see the kingdom of God” in Luke 9:27 that is exactly what He meant, pure and simple.

Anyway, back to the questions; when I looked at them from a preterist viewpoint they were easy to answer:

MY COMMENT:  So from a Preterist's viewpoint these questions "were EASY to answer" were they?
Geoff--their "easy answers" are totally, unscriptural foolishness!  I will now comment on your first
assertion that Preterism is true, and that the thousand year binding of Satan took place between
Christ's resurrection and the destruction of the temple in Jerusalem in 70 AD:


You stated:  "Satan was bound for a thousand years starting with Christ’s resurrection,(Rev 20:1-5) and ending just before the destruction of the temple, (Rev 20:8) but the thousand years was symbolic of an unknown period of time"

MY COMMENTS:

Oh really:  So Satan was bound and out of the deceiving and destruction business from Christ's Resurrection until just prior to the destruction of Jerusalem.  And just how many Scriptures do you suppose this stupid interpretation of God's Word contradicts?

Peter's ministry took place between Christ's resurrection and the destruction of the temple in 70 AD, but notice what the Scriptures tell us:
 
Act 5:3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Spirit, and to keep back part of the price of the land?

How could Satan have been already bound (at Christ's resurrection, according to you and Preterism) if Satan was still deceiving people decades AFTER

Christ's resurrection (as in this example with Peter and Ananias), but BEFORE the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD?  If Satan was bound during this "35 year/thousand year" period, how could he have "filled Ananias' heart to lie to the Holy Spirit?"  Just a minor technicality, I guess, for the died-in-the-wool Preterists!

1Pe 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:

Oops!  I though Satan was "bound" during this "35-year/thousand-year" period?  But no, here he is during Peter's ministry (right in the middle of Satan's bound period), "roaring, walking, seeking, and devour" whom he will.

Paul's ministry also took place roughtly between 34 AD and 60 AD (Certainly not before 34 AD and certainly not after 70 AD, which makes the Preterists interpretation of this period totally false).

Act 26:18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

Why would Jesus tell Paul that his ministry was for the purpose: "to turn them from darkness to light, and from the POWER OF SATAN unto God..." if Satan was bound during the period from Christ's resurrection until the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD.

Oops again!

1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

How could Paul deliver this fornicator to "Satan for the destruction of the flesh," if Satan himself was bound and could neither deceive nor destroy anyone?
 
1Co 7:5 Defraud ye not one the other, except it be with consent for a time, that ye may give yourselves to fasting and prayer; and come together again, that Satan tempt you not for your incontinency.

How could Satan tempt these Corinthians at this time if he were already bound, and not able to tempt anyone during this bound period?

2Co 12:7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

How could Satan be sending a messenger to buffet Paul during his ministry if Satan was out of commission during this "thousand year" period?  (This "35-year/thousand year period" of Preterism doesn't really work with the Scriptures, does it?

1Th 2:18 Wherefore we would have come unto you, even I Paul, once and again; but Satan hindered us.

Funny how Satan keeps popping up during Paul's ministry and exercising all of his evil and deceitful ways, when he is supposed to be "bound for a thousand years" with chains in a pit (Rev. 20:3).  Maybe he sneaks out at night and God doesn't see him?

1Ti 1:20 Of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander; whom I have delivered unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme.

What?  Paul delivered Hymenaeus and Alexander to the pit where Satan was chained during this period so that they would learn not to blaspheme?

Preterism can not answer my first questions I sent to you and they certainly cannot answer these questions and Scriptures I presented either.

Give up this Preterism nonsense, Geoff.  It is the work of the same Satan whom they claim was already chained and imprisoned two thousand

years ago at the very time that Peter, Paul, and others were warning those very people to be on guard against "the wiles of the devil" (Eph. 6:19-17).

Those admonitions (and there are many more than I presented) from the apostles would have been useless to the people they wrote to if Satan

was not even around during this period of time.  This IS "SPIRITUAL WARFARE," Geoff, and you are loosing the battle as long as you allow yourself

to be deceived by the arch deceiver, Satan the Devil!!

God be with you,

Ray


The rest of your Preterist arguments is just more of the same--unscriptural nonsense, so I will not take any more time on this.  If you wish to answer me, Geoff,

answer what I presented above to you, DO NOT GO INTO MORE AND MORE ARGUMENTS of Preterism--answer what I have presently above regarding Satan

being bound and out of commission and not allowed to deceive anyone during the period from Christ's resurrection until 70 AD, ONLY!


----------------------------------------------------

Mat 24:35 Heaven and earth shall be passing by, yet My words may by no means be passing by."

Mat 24:36 Now, concerning that day and hour no one is aware, neither the messengers of the heavens, nor the Son; except the Father only."

Jesus did not know when heaven and earth (the Old Covenant) would be passing away and so He used  a thousand years to express this period of time that Satan would be bound.

2Pe 3:8 Now of this one thing you are not to be oblivious, beloved, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years and a thousand years as one day."

The heaven and earth in the  above verses refers to the Old Covenant. It was the Old Covenant that passed away in AD70 with the destruction of the temple.

Satan was loosed for a little while, just long enough to convince Rome that Jerusalem must be attacked:

Rev 20:7  And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

Rev 20:8  And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

Rev 20:9  And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
 
This fire that came down from God was the fire that razed Jerusalem to the ground. This was also the day of the Lord spoken of in 2 Peter 3:10 and by so many Old Testament prophets.

Isa 11:9 They will not do evil, nor will they ruin, in all My holy mountain, for full is the earth of the knowledge of Yahweh. As water for the sea floor is a covering."

Isa 11:10 And there comes, in that day, the Root of Jesse, Who will stand for a Banner of the peoples; of Him will the nations inquire, and His rest will come to be glorious."

According to verse 10 it was when Jesus came in the flesh that the earth was full of the knowledge of the LORD.

Chapter 26 of Isaiah speaks of the coming destruction of Jerusalem and it is then that the inhabitants of the world  learn righteousness.
 
The first five verses of Isaiah 2 are describing the time before the destruction of the temple when the Roman army were massing around Jerusalem but the Jews thought were safe because false prophets had told them that God was going to protect them and keep them safe. That’s why they beat their spears into pruners and the nations did not learn war anymore. That’s what the false prophets told them, but of course it wasn’t true. This is what Josephus wrote:

"Now, there was then a great number of false prophets suborned by the tyrants to impose upon the people, who denounced this to them, that they should wait for deliverance from God: and this was in order to keep them from deserting, and that they might be buoyed up above fear and care by such hopes." (Wars of the Jews 6.5.2)

Another objection that is often raised is that the gospel must be preached in all the world before Jesus returns. Well here are a few verses that answer that objection:

Rom 1:8  First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world.

Col 1:5  For the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, whereof ye heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel;

Col 1:6  Which is come unto you, as it is in all the world; and bringeth forth fruit, as it doth also in you, since the day ye heard of it, and knew the grace of God in truth:

Col 1:23  If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

I hope that this is helpful to you, Ray. If so there is a whole lot more to learn about the consequences of Christ’s return in AD 70.

The first Israel, the Jews, missed Jesus’ first coming, and the second Israel, the Church, missed Jesus’ second coming, but there has always been a remnant.

Best regards,

Geoff
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