Our Better Halves

[se7en]

Guys,

The Lord has had me on this journey to understand truth for about the last 8 months now. All of my adult life, my wife and I have attended mostly non-denomenational christian churchs in whichever city we've moved to. I have a beautiful and lovely wife of over 15 years now and I try to explain these truths to her (salvation of all, non existance of Hell, trinity, free will etc.) but she doesn't want to listen to most of it. The non-existence of Hell, she understands, but not the salvation of all. (why do people seem to acknowledge no hell, but not the salvation of all?)

It's getting to the point where I can't see the value of attending a local "christian" church. I feel like every time we go, we are in danger of hearing doctrines of demons, and I feel like a guardian to my family to say "enough is enough". I don't want "christiandom" taught to my family (I have a 8 year and 6 year old). I've talked to my wife about this but she doesn't see the danger of continueing to attend church. Don't get me wrong, the people are great, they genuinely want to help others, love on other people, pray for them, etc. But their core belief "spread the gospel and love of Christ" is NOT the same gospel I believe.... I can't go along with it.

My wife thinks i'm going to eventually "come back" to basic christian theology, the way we used to think. And I think, given enough time, the Lord will show her the real Truth.

After seeing the Word of God actually says, I can't go back to the traditional christian way of thought. And she tells me she's "Not moving" from traditional christian thought. I know our Father is in control and all things are possible, It's just a really tough time right now because we are so unequally yoked. I want to teach my kids (on a basic level) that Jesus will eventually save everyone, but my wife says for me to keep with the basics.... "Jesus loves them".  I've agreed, and we still attend church.

I'm sure there are some married couples that have been through this exact thing i'm going through. Any words of wisdom while we make it through this season of life? Divorce is out of the question. The salvation of all has brought a divisive "line in the sand" if you will. We are both passionate about our beliefs.

Thanks for letting me share my heart with you guys. I'm looking for wise things to do, i'm sure some of you have experienced this? And now that you have experienced this, looking back on it in your own life, what would you tell someone going through it currently?

I appreciate you all!

[Samson]

Guys,

The Lord has had me on this journey to understand truth for about the last 8 months now. All of my adult life, my wife and I have attended mostly non-denomenational christian churchs in whichever city we've moved to. I have a beautiful and lovely wife of over 15 years now and I try to explain these truths to her (salvation of all, non existance of Hell, trinity, free will etc.) but she doesn't want to listen to most of it. The non-existence of Hell, she understands, but not the salvation of all. (why do people seem to acknowledge no hell, but not the salvation of all?)

It's getting to the point where I can't see the value of attending a local "christian" church. I feel like every time we go, we are in danger of hearing doctrines of demons, and I feel like a guardian to my family to say "enough is enough". I don't want "christiandom" taught to my family (I have a 8 year and 6 year old). I've talked to my wife about this but she doesn't see the danger of continueing to attend church. Don't get me wrong, the people are great, they genuinely want to help others, love on other people, pray for them, etc. But their core belief "spread the gospel and love of Christ" is NOT the same gospel I believe.... I can't go along with it.

My wife thinks i'm going to eventually "come back" to basic christian theology, the way we used to think. And I think, given enough time, the Lord will show her the real Truth.

After seeing the Word of God actually says, I can't go back to the traditional christian way of thought. And she tells me she's "Not moving" from traditional christian thought. I know our Father is in control and all things are possible, It's just a really tough time right now because we are so unequally yoked. I want to teach my kids (on a basic level) that Jesus will eventually save everyone, but my wife says for me to keep with the basics.... "Jesus loves them".  I've agreed, and we still attend church.

I'm sure there are some married couples that have been through this exact thing i'm going through. Any words of wisdom while we make it through this season of life? Divorce is out of the question. The salvation of all has brought a divisive "line in the sand" if you will. We are both passionate about our beliefs.

Thanks for letting me share my heart with you guys. I'm looking for wise things to do, i'm sure some of you have experienced this? And now that you have experienced this, looking back on it in your own life, what would you tell someone going through it currently?

I appreciate you all!

Hi Se7en,

Not surprisingly, the scenario you describe in your above Post has been discussed by others seeking advice when conflict arises with your or the "better half," I don't profess to have the ability to know whats going on in someone Else's mind, especially your Wife, although because it's your Wife, you might have a general idea. So, what might you do ! Apply what it says at 1 Peter. 3:15: But sanctify the Christ as Lord in your hearts, always ready to make a defense before everyone that ASKS OR DEMANDS of you a reason for the hope in you, but doing so together WITH A MILD TEMPER AND DEEP RESPECT. (Caps for emphasis are mine). If She doesn't ask why you believe in the Salvation of All, don't tell Her, certainly don't ram your beliefs or differences in interpretation of Scripture down Her throat. If she asks about your belief in the Salvation of All and allows you to explain, make sure You emphasize the word EVENTUAL and that getting Saved is a process that most of Mankind don't receive the benefit of in their present Lifetime. The information that surrounds the word EVENTUAL involves the fact that no one is "saved anyway," that Chastisement or Correction(Greek-Kolasin) is involved as part of the process in eventually being saved. Forgiveness is first, followed by Repentance and finally Cleansing of the individual Sinner. When rarely given the opportunity to explain the Salvation of All, I make sure I emphasize the word EVENTUAL and the process that surrounds it, Scriptures included.

Let your conduct & how you react to your wife when She brings up these differences be the most important focal point when dealing with the above issue. Read some Scriptures found below that might assist you.

1) 1Pe 3:7  Likewise, ye husbands, dwell with them according to knowledge, giving honour unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life; that your prayers be not hindered.

2) Rom 12:18  If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live PEACEABLY WITH ALL MEN. (including your Wife)

Do everything you can in all other areas to show Love to your Wife, even if She appears to be a Spiritual Enemy at this time.

3)Eph 5:25  Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

4) Eph 5:28  So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.
Eph 5:29  For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:

5) Col 3:19  Husbands, love your wives, and be not bitter against them.

Make sure you "attempt" to apply the next Scripture cited when dealing with your wife, this applies especially when Husbands deal with Wives.

6) Jas 1:19  Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath:

7) Jas 3:6  And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.
Jas 3:7  For every kind of beasts, and of birds, and of serpents, and of things in the sea, is tamed, and hath been tamed of mankind:
Jas 3:8  But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison. ( Yes, be careful of your responses to your Wife, because YOUR TONGUE might get you in a heap amount of trouble & make matters worse than before.)

Below are some Emails of Rays that might help in Blue color. just His answers provided.

Dear Ryan:  I'm afraid we have all learned the hard way that most people have no interest in the Truths of God WHATSOEVER.  They love religion, but not the Truths of God. There has to have been a good reason for Peter to admonish:

        1Pe 3:15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man THAT ASKS Y-O-U  a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:

        There's the key: only give an answer to those who ask YOU, or are definitely interested.

        God be with you,

        Ray

Dear Bill:
If you don't understand the mind of a Christian you will never understand why people like me do not usually debate them.  Let's say that they bring up a point (about anything) and you have Scripture that speaks directly to this point. Can you quote that Scripture to a Christian to make your point? NO, no you can't. Why is that? Because the second you quote it (according to them) you TOOK IT OUT OF CONTEXT. And to them, no Scripture is true "out of context."  "God is love" (I John 4:, but ONLY IN THE CONTEXT OF I John 4:8. You cannot just quote a Scripture and believe that it is a statement of fact or statement of eternal truth. They won't hear of it.  But don't they quote Scripture to support their views. Yes, of course they do, but they use them IN CONTEXT.  Who determines whether their use is in context and your use is not in context?  Why THEY DO, of course, and that is because they understand hermeneutics and you don't. See the difference?  I don't either, but that's just the way it is. If you can corner a snake in a briar patch, then you can debate a Christian with the Scriptures.
God be with you,
Ray

Dear Beth:
Don't try to convert anyone. Be the best wife, mother, and friend that anyone could have, and THAT is the best thing that you and everyone else can do (unless you are a man, then, of course, the best husband, etc.,).  You will never, ever, ever win someone over by a clever argument with the Scriptures. There are two reason why I do this and you shouldn't:  [1] I am being a witness AGAINST all the heretics that attack me and the Truths of God, and [2] my answers to their foolish and unscriptural arguments are a great teaching tool for all those who read our site and who visit our Forum.

But in my private life, I do not try to convert, convince, change, etc., my neighbors and acquaintences.  I will tell them the truth about God and the Scriptures, but I do not make a pest of myself. If and when people ask you, give them only as much as then need and are willing to accept. If they desire more, they will come back.

I would suggest you buy a Emphasized Bible by Joseph Rotherham. It is on a par with the Concordant Version, and it is Old and New in one volume, plus you can find it at any large Bible Book Store, and it will probably be considerably less expensive.

Don't study to be a scholar. Just learn what you need to know. Learn it until you know it and believe it, not so that you can win a debate in a room full of theologians.  Things like "aion/aionios" will become clear after much study. "Free will" may also take awhile. Some fight it for years before they accept it. I personally immediately accepted it when I saw it and I was delighted to know it, as I was when I learned of the salvation of all.  I find it hard to understand why so many hundreds email me and still think that they find Scriptures that contradict the free will/free choice heresy. Anyway, don't become discouraged.

You can certainly accomodate your husband's desire as much as is possible without partaking of his religion with him. I can certainly sit in a church and listen to a minister teach his heresy, without sinning. I would have no reason, however, to do this on a regular basis.  Just give it time. "Don't be righteous over much" (Ecc. 7:16).  God will direct your path. And who knows whether God will not begin to open your husband's mind in the future.
God be with you,
Ray 


If you haven't already, you might want to get yourself acquainted with Ray's articles: How Hard Is Getting Saved, Parts 1&2, that would fully explain the process, sometimes long, in getting saved.

Kind Regards, Samson.

[G. Driggs]

Actions speak louder then words. Here's one of my favorite quotes from one of Ray's papers. Something I need to remind myself of constantly.

http://www.bible-truths.com/souls.htm

                                                                                          LIGHT AND SALT DON'T ARGUE OR MAKE NOISE

    "Ye are the salt of the earth... Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid... Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works and glorify your Father which is in heaven" (Matt. 5:1,14,16).

Salt does not make any noise, and light does not argue Scriptures. Neither salt nor light makes any sound whatsoever. Maybe there is a lesson in there.

Too many people learn a few truths of God and think that they are ready to take on the world. They usually start by trying to embarrass their Pastor with their new-gained knowledge. Usually they fall flat on their face on the very first try. It's all about motivation. If your motivation is carnal, God will not back you. Yes, I know, all of you are saying: "But my motivation is to show them God's truths." Yes, sure, I understand, but THEY DON'T WANT TO HEAR GOD'S TRUTHS, and you already know this, so what is your point? Leave them alone and let them taste your salt and see your light and admire your good works, and perchance they will even praise God for your new-found humility,

You will never argue anyone into accepting the truths of God's Word. As salesmen are often taught: "You might win the argument, but loose the sale," so don't argue. And this: "He who is persuaded against his will; is of the same opinion still."

I receive a lot of emails from people who beg me to come to their rescue because they are about to have a second session with their pastor or friend, but have failed miserably on the first go-round. Now they want me to give them the ammunition they need to do a slam-dunk on their second attempt to embarrass their pastor or friend. Give it up—that attitude is wrong. Such a carnal exhibition of prideful flesh is akin to someone looking for a street fight merely because he has just acquired a black belt in karate.

HOW TO DEMONSTRATE YOUR KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUTH

I personally know a man who has his little wife working two jobs to support their family so that he can study the Scriptures and enter into doctrinal debates with other Christians at the local Caf� as a perpetual hobby. Notice the admonition of the Apostle Peter:

    "Dearly beloved, I beseech you as strangers and pilgrims, abstain from fleshly lusts, which war against the soul; having your conversation [Gk: 'conduct'] honest [Gk: 'honorable'] among the Gentiles: that, whereas they speak against you as evildoers, they may BY YOUR GOOD WORKS, [Not your clever Bible arguments], which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation" (I Pet. 2:11-12).

Your good works and righteous character will pay dividends to others eventually—if not in this life, then in the Judgment.

[Kenneth Clark]

Actions speak louder then words. Here's one of my favorite quotes from one of Ray's papers. Something I need to remind myself of constantly.

http://www.bible-truths.com/souls.htm

                                                                                          LIGHT AND SALT DON'T ARGUE OR MAKE NOISE

    "Ye are the salt of the earth... Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid... Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works and glorify your Father which is in heaven" (Matt. 5:1,14,16).

Salt does not make any noise, and light does not argue Scriptures. Neither salt nor light makes any sound whatsoever. Maybe there is a lesson in there.

Too many people learn a few truths of God and think that they are ready to take on the world. They usually start by trying to embarrass their Pastor with their new-gained knowledge. Usually they fall flat on their face on the very first try. It's all about motivation. If your motivation is carnal, God will not back you. Yes, I know, all of you are saying: "But my motivation is to show them God's truths." Yes, sure, I understand, but THEY DON'T WANT TO HEAR GOD'S TRUTHS, and you already know this, so what is your point? Leave them alone and let them taste your salt and see your light and admire your good works, and perchance they will even praise God for your new-found humility,

You will never argue anyone into accepting the truths of God's Word. As salesmen are often taught: "You might win the argument, but loose the sale," so don't argue. And this: "He who is persuaded against his will; is of the same opinion still."

I receive a lot of emails from people who beg me to come to their rescue because they are about to have a second session with their pastor or friend, but have failed miserably on the first go-round. Now they want me to give them the ammunition they need to do a slam-dunk on their second attempt to embarrass their pastor or friend. Give it up—that attitude is wrong. Such a carnal exhibition of prideful flesh is akin to someone looking for a street fight merely because he has just acquired a black belt in karate.

HOW TO DEMONSTRATE YOUR KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUTH

I personally know a man who has his little wife working two jobs to support their family so that he can study the Scriptures and enter into doctrinal debates with other Christians at the local Caf� as a perpetual hobby. Notice the admonition of the Apostle Peter:

    "Dearly beloved, I beseech you as strangers and pilgrims, abstain from fleshly lusts, which war against the soul; having your conversation [Gk: 'conduct'] honest [Gk: 'honorable'] among the Gentiles: that, whereas they speak against you as evildoers, they may BY YOUR GOOD WORKS, [Not your clever Bible arguments], which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation" (I Pet. 2:11-12).

Your good works and righteous character will pay dividends to others eventually—if not in this life, then in the Judgment.

thanks for that post...if anyone needs to hear this it is me.

[se7en]

Thanks guys, this is great! I appreciate y'all!