> Introductions, Announcements, and More of Ray's Teachings
Jesus--God's first creation--HOW/WHO?
thewatchman:
Good points Kat.
We know the scriptures point to this current version of creation that we dwell in was created By and through Jesus Christ, but who knows how many creations there have been before this one. Especially if it is in God's nature to create. I certainly aren't prepared to limit God by my own imaginations or speculations.
theophilus:
--- Quote from: John from Kentucky on November 12, 2012, 11:52:53 PM ---
--- Quote from: Duane on November 12, 2012, 11:01:23 PM ---Much of my time and writing is taken up on other Christian web-sites expounding truths that I have learned from this web-site, Ray and the "B-T" administrators. I then, direct them to this site/home page.
In doing so, I was teaching about the fact that Jesus is the "only begotten" created "first fruit" of God and that God doesn't create but through Jesus, who carries out His Father's will.
A question was asked of me that I need your help in answering/directing me to the answer:
Question: As Jesus created everything via the direction of His Father, and God the Father created nothing of/by Himself.
How did God the Father create/birth Jesus? Is it that God COULD create things but CHOOSES NOT TO but rather gives honor to Jesus by instructing Him to created it and get praised for it; or God, "Who can do anything", but being a SPIRIT can't self-create Jesus. Who helped Him? (sounds silly as no one else was around (?).
I know Ray addressed this somewhere but I can't find it.
--- End quote ---
Jesus explained it in John 10:30 when He said, "I and the Father are one." Very few believe Jesus.
Ray mentioned it in his article about his Creed, where he stated Jesus is God's autobiography. But that requires some thinking with the help of God's Spirit. Those who you converse with on the internet will not "get" it. Don't throw your pearls before those who are not capable of understanding.
--- End quote ---
Hello everyone! I'm new to the forum. I read Ray's Creed and for the life of me, I can't stop thinking about it. I think I understand what Ray wrote. Can someone here go into more detail? Thank you in advance and God bless.
John from Kentucky:
--- Quote from: theophilus on January 03, 2013, 11:28:18 AM ---
--- Quote from: John from Kentucky on November 12, 2012, 11:52:53 PM ---
--- Quote from: Duane on November 12, 2012, 11:01:23 PM ---Much of my time and writing is taken up on other Christian web-sites expounding truths that I have learned from this web-site, Ray and the "B-T" administrators. I then, direct them to this site/home page.
In doing so, I was teaching about the fact that Jesus is the "only begotten" created "first fruit" of God and that God doesn't create but through Jesus, who carries out His Father's will.
A question was asked of me that I need your help in answering/directing me to the answer:
Question: As Jesus created everything via the direction of His Father, and God the Father created nothing of/by Himself.
How did God the Father create/birth Jesus? Is it that God COULD create things but CHOOSES NOT TO but rather gives honor to Jesus by instructing Him to created it and get praised for it; or God, "Who can do anything", but being a SPIRIT can't self-create Jesus. Who helped Him? (sounds silly as no one else was around (?).
I know Ray addressed this somewhere but I can't find it.
--- End quote ---
Jesus explained it in John 10:30 when He said, "I and the Father are one." Very few believe Jesus.
Ray mentioned it in his article about his Creed, where he stated Jesus is God's autobiography. But that requires some thinking with the help of God's Spirit. Those who you converse with on the internet will not "get" it. Don't throw your pearls before those who are not capable of understanding.
--- End quote ---
Hello everyone! I'm new to the forum. I read Ray's Creed and for the life of me, I can't stop thinking about it. I think I understand what Ray wrote. Can someone here go into more detail? Thank you in advance and God bless.
--- End quote ---
Hello friend,
This is a very, very controversial topic on the Forum, and we would not be allowed to discuss this topic here.
Ray brought it to my attention about a year before he died. Read his last emails during the year before his death.
Understand truly what an autobiography is. There is a classic piece of American literature called The Autobiography of Benjamin Franklin. Did Franklin write about John Adams or Thomas Jefferson? Or, did he write about------himself.
Jesus is the Word of God. Did God write about another? Or, did He write about------Himself.
Paul and John understood, but Paul wrote that only a few understood. This understanding is not for the young. It will take you where only a few have gone before. I study many things, but I keep coming back to this topic in awe and amazement.
May God's Spirit guide your studies if you are meant to understand this at this time.
theophilus:
--- Quote from: John from Kentucky on January 03, 2013, 03:50:32 PM ---
--- Quote from: theophilus on January 03, 2013, 11:28:18 AM ---
--- Quote from: John from Kentucky on November 12, 2012, 11:52:53 PM ---
--- Quote from: Duane on November 12, 2012, 11:01:23 PM ---Much of my time and writing is taken up on other Christian web-sites expounding truths that I have learned from this web-site, Ray and the "B-T" administrators. I then, direct them to this site/home page.
In doing so, I was teaching about the fact that Jesus is the "only begotten" created "first fruit" of God and that God doesn't create but through Jesus, who carries out His Father's will.
A question was asked of me that I need your help in answering/directing me to the answer:
Question: As Jesus created everything via the direction of His Father, and God the Father created nothing of/by Himself.
How did God the Father create/birth Jesus? Is it that God COULD create things but CHOOSES NOT TO but rather gives honor to Jesus by instructing Him to created it and get praised for it; or God, "Who can do anything", but being a SPIRIT can't self-create Jesus. Who helped Him? (sounds silly as no one else was around (?).
I know Ray addressed this somewhere but I can't find it.
--- End quote ---
Jesus explained it in John 10:30 when He said, "I and the Father are one." Very few believe Jesus.
Ray mentioned it in his article about his Creed, where he stated Jesus is God's autobiography. But that requires some thinking with the help of God's Spirit. Those who you converse with on the internet will not "get" it. Don't throw your pearls before those who are not capable of understanding.
--- End quote ---
Hello everyone! I'm new to the forum. I read Ray's Creed and for the life of me, I can't stop thinking about it. I think I understand what Ray wrote. Can someone here go into more detail? Thank you in advance and God bless.
--- End quote ---
Hello friend,
This is a very, very controversial topic on the Forum, and we would not be allowed to discuss this topic here.
Ray brought it to my attention about a year before he died. Read his last emails during the year before his death.
Understand truly what an autobiography is. There is a classic piece of American literature called The Autobiography of Benjamin Franklin. Did Franklin write about John Adams or Thomas Jefferson? Or, did he write about------himself.
Jesus is the Word of God. Did God write about another? Or, did He write about------Himself.
Paul and John understood, but Paul wrote that only a few understood. This understanding is not for the young. It will take you where only a few have gone before. I study many things, but I keep coming back to this topic in awe and amazement.
May God's Spirit guide your studies if you are meant to understand this at this time.
--- End quote ---
Thanks for your reply John. I didn't know it is controversial. I venture to say then that if a poll were taken of all members of this forum as to what this creed means, we'd get varied answers. I haven't read the autobiography that you mentioned.
The reason I now believe as I do is because God led me to Ray's website. Certainly, the belief in Hell is a controversial one too. I used to subscribe to it, first as a catholic and then as an evangelical. I used to subscribe to the Trinity too (very controversial!). What I am trying to say is that Ray explained things with scripture, not just leave things for people to figure out. His creed is the only thing that I know of that I think he left as a riddle.
But I kinda have an idea of what Ray was hinting at. I just wanted to pursue this point with somebody (if preferred, in private messages), as I pursued others that Ray posted about and backed up with scripture. I don't want to cause any controversy at all. I just want to know more of God. If this creed has gotten in my head is for a good reason.
Gina:
Hey Theophilus,
Welcome.
That creed is difficult to understand because it's difficult to believe. I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer, so here's my two cents:
I Believe that the Holy Scriptures are God's Authorized Biography, and
What's the definition of biography: An account of someone's life written by someone else.
Best I can figure, this simply means God inspired people to write the old or the new testament scriptures. God didn't come down himself and write them. I'm not sure who chiseled the ten commandments on stone tablets, or the writing on the wall, though. I'm sure someone did it; I just don't know who actually did the chiseling/writing.
I Believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is God's Authorized Autobiography
What's the definition of autobiography: An account of a person's life written by that person.
Jesus Christ didn't personally write the scriptures. So what does that mean? He was given authority to tell the whole world what God the Father is all about. He did that in the life that he personally lived here on earth 2000 years ago, and continues to, as He does the works of the Father through the hearts of all believers.
Ray said, you won't understand anything until you begin to obey God. Just obey Him, follow Him, and it will become abundantly clear what Ray means.
I hope that helps.
Gina
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