Hi Loretta,
You know it amazes me now how much I used to blindly accept that those 'learned' men of the church taught. When Ray brought up the idea that there were people before Adam, I remember thinking, wow that does make sense. It was at his 2008 Nashville conference when he was discussing a lot of scientific evidence that shows there was no worldwide flood that he mentioned this. Now he just briefly spoke about there were people long before Adam and did not get into any of the proof archaeologist has uncovered. But here is a few sections where he mentioned it.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,9130.msg76395.html#msg76395 -----
Now I talked a little, not during the conference so much, but in some of the bull sessions in the evening we had. Where it was said, ‘were Adam and Eve the first humans?’ Well, I said, not necessarily and I gave numerous reasons for that. I thought of another one here just yesterday, so I’ll throw this out just for fun and just to think about. I’m not making some big stand on this.
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Now when we come to Adam and Eve, He gives them a name and we know it’s just one. Are they the first ones though? Maybe not. Because we later have Cain, that says his sentence is too great, wherever I go, they will kill me (Gen. 4:13-14). Who will kill him? Who? There was only Abel and he killed Abel. So if there’s only Adam and Eve and their two sons, Cain and Abel… well Cain killed Abel, so now there’s only one man left, and his mother and father. He says to God, wherever I go, “anyone who finds me will kill me." Who? He killed the only other man alive on earth. Well if we interpret it that way, there are problems. Then Cain took a wife… so there’d be all these other things to contend with and so on. Alright.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,8385.msg76394.html#msg76394 ------------
So He made the fowl of the air and the fish in the sea and on the next day before He made the first humans… I’m not sure that was Adam and Eve, because Adam comes along in chapter 2. But God said in verse 25, “And God made the wild-beast of the land after its kind, and the tame-beast after its kind, and every creeping thing of the ground, after its kind.”
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Ray was saying that he believes there is a significant amount of time between God creating male & female in Genesis chapter 1 and God making Adam & Eve in Genesis chapter 2. He also showed the Hebrew has different words to describe God 'creating' males & females in Genesis 1, compared to God 'making' Adam & Eve in Genesis 2.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,9502.msg80842.html#msg80842--------In Genesis it says, “in the beginning God created,“ the word is bara and it means to bring in something new, something really new. In Exodus 20, it says “for in six days God made…” First of all, even the translators knew not to put create. They put “created” in Genesis 1:1, but not in Exodus 20:11. Why didn’t they put, for in six days God created the heavens and the earth? Because He didn’t do that in six days. Then what did He do in six days? He “made” the heavens and the earth. What’s the difference? All the difference in the world.
In Genesis 1:1, He brought into existence everything that exists in the universe. From day one through day six He formed all of that into everything as we now see it in the universe. Two totally different operations. Totally, totally different, they are not synonymous.
The word bara (created) and the word asah (made) are two different words and they mean two different things. In the beginning He created it all, it was all there. But it wasn’t until certain things transpired before He began His work of asah.
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So anyway that does give you a lot to think about.
Hi Pierdut,
The sovereignty of God is a very hard thing to grasp on to and really believe. If you believe that God is sovereign than you know He is in control of everything "knowing the end from the beginning," and that what is happening is this world is according to HIS plan and we really have no say in the matter.
We can stand down here is all our self determined righteousness and tell Him how wrong He has gotten it, how messed up things are and if He would just listen to us we could tell Him what needs to be done to fix it... Can't you see how arrogant that attitude is, think about how He answered Job out of the whirlwind.
Job 38:1 Then the LORD answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said:
v. 2 "Who is this who darkens counsel
By words without knowledge?
v. 3 Now prepare yourself like a man;
I will question you, and you shall answer Me.
v. 4 "Where were you when I laid the foundations of the earth?
Tell Me, if you have understanding.
v. 5 Who determined its measurements?
Surely you know!
Or who stretched the line upon it?
What I'm trying to say is until you really let go of the idea that YOU can do anything right; in your life, for this society or anything at all, you will never be at peace. We are absolutely carnal minded, arrogant, ignorant beast, pure and simple, there is nothing good in us.
God has a plan... IT'S PERFECT! It doesn't matter if we can't understand it now or cannot comprehend why things must be as they are now, He is not going to deviate off course because we don't accept His sovereignty and wisdom in this.
The beast must be recognizing that you are getting close to the truth, because it sure is putting up a fight, it will not go down easily. Now I believe Ray said something about how hard getting saved is.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3849.0.html -----------
“getting saved” is the hardest most difficult thing that any human being in the history of the universe will ever do. There is nothing harder than “getting saved.” Are you hearing me? It is the hardest thing any human being will ever do in all of eternity. It’s the ultimate hard task. But, when you read the scriptures, it doesn’t sound that way.
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mercy, peace and love
Kat