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evil is not sin
Kat:
Hi Alex,
Here are a few more emails.
http://bible-truths.com/email2.htm#freewill2 -----
[Ray Replies]
Dear Matthew:
Matthew, you have got to stop talking about God as if He were a mere mortal MAN! God is NOT A MAN! God IS GOD! God is Holy and Righteous and Good and LOVING. He is not evil, neither is He LIMITED IN ANY WAY.
There are MANY things that God does that we as mortals are NOT TO IMITATE! God "makes war in righteousness"--we cannot. God KILLS and brings back to life again--we cannot.
Because God has chosen to create and USE evil for a divine purpose, we have no right to judge God as BEING evil. He is not. Neither is it a SIN on God's part to make mortals WHO DO SIN. A sin is a mistake, a lack, lawlessness. God is NONE OF THESE!
Your suggestion that because God chooses to NOT DO or NOT BE certain things, that that somehow LIMITS Him is ludicrous. Listen carefully to what I am about to say: A Being (God) Who has the POWER AND ABILITY to be and do ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING HE WISHES, IS NOT LIMITED!!! The fact that God chooses to not only tell the truth, but is, in fact, the embodiment of TRUTH, and never lies, in no way diminishes God or limits God. I am surprised that you cannot see and understand this? God IS AND DOES everything that He wishes--that, my friend, is TOTAL SOVEREIGNTY!!!
The idea that if God were both truthful AND A LIAR at the same time, that then He would be sovereign in that area is nonsense, Matthew.
It is also helpful to understand the Scriptural use of the "relative" and the "absolute". I cover this in my paper. Your example of God being "forgetful" is just such a case. God condescends many times in the Scriptures to interact with man as if God Himself were a man. He likens Himself to one having "eyes" and "hands" and "hair", etc. God DOES NOT possess these physical organs of a physical body. If God had only two eyes in the front of His head as a man, then He wouldn't even be able to SEE BEHIND HIMSELF WITHOUT TURNING HIS HEAD! It is foolishness to attribute mortal, fleshly, inequalities to the CREATOR OF THE UNIVERSE!
When God says He will remember our sins NO MORE, He is not telling us that He is forgetful or has a poor memory. He is telling us that He will NEVER BRING UP OUR SINS to charge us with them. They have all been forgiven at the Cross of Jesus.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,4460.0.html ---------------
I have said repeatedly that "evil has no moral bias." It is the motive behind the use of evil that determines whether it is "morally" right or wrong. So you be sure to remember this next time you hear of an earthquake killing ten thousand men, women, children, and infants. Are you seriously trying to tell me that when the translators change "evil" to "disaster or calamity," that there is therefore no "EVIL" involved in either? A "pure" God DID CREATE EVIL, and that is something you will have to learn to live with and die with. Death itself is an evil and an enemy which Jesus will abolish. You have spiritually and morally accomplished absolutely nothing by changing evil into calamity.
http://bible-truths.com/emails.html#evil -------------------------------
Why did God create ANYTHING? THE EARTH? THE HEAVENS? US? ANGELS? ANIMALS?
God has always existed--He is ETERNAL. He is SPIRIT. He is LOVE. He is LONELY. GOD WANTS SONS AND DAUGHTERS.
Since God is good and God is love, He naturally wants His sons and daughters to be good and love also.
Goodness, righteousness, virtue, character, and love AND INANIMATE things cannot be created as a rock, or water, or a star, etc. By the very nature of goodness, virtue, etc., it requires TIME AND CIRCUMSTANCE to develop (or create, if you will) these things. And so God CREATES all that is needed to develop these virtuous traits of character and love.
Since any and every virtue that you can think of is the result of overcoming some for of evil, EVIL therefore becomes a very important ingredient in the development of virtue, character and love.
As God does not DIRECTLY try anyone, He had to create adversaries to do this "dirty work." And so, God created His OWN ADVERSARY, Satan, the devil. There are lesser adversaries in the form of demons.
God gives man the illusion of having "free" will, which exalts his pride and vanity and causes him to think he can operate independently from God. This then brings about SIN. SIN is so bad that it needs to be atoned for. God sent His Son Jesus Christ to be this Atonement.
Only a few are presently called to understand ANY OF THESE THINGS. The rest of humanity will be called at the great white throne judging.
There was NO evil present with God before Satan, for God UNDERSTANDS all of the ramifications of good and evil. When all enemies and powers are brought under Christ's subjection, then evil, sin, and even death itself will be abolished.
Sin and evil are absolutely necessary in the development of human character, virtue, and love.
http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3570.0.html --------
There are many things that God has created that are not a part of His "heart." Evil is not a part of God's heart. The death of the wicked is not something God cherishes in His heart. Sin is not something that God endorses, yet He created all the circumstances for its use.
http://bible-truths.com/email3.htm#evil ---------------------------------
God created evil for a purpose. So naturally He will not make evil inoperative at every turn in the road or there would have been no purpose in creating it in the first place.
Evil serves many noble purposes. One of which is a back drop for good. Good cannot be understood or certainly not appreciated without a backdrop of evil. Evil makes good appear even better and is certainly much more appreciated.
Evil is necessary for the production or development of good. You cannot name one virtue that is not in some way produced by the resistance to some form of evil.
All knowledge is a matter of contrast and relativity. One cannot know what light is unless he has been acquainted with darkness. One has no conception of large unless he also knows of things that are small. Up is only up in relation to down. Life is the opposite of death, etc. To understand and fully appreciate all of these things, there are many necessary experiences to go through. God creates and puts us through these many things in the development of godly character.
All of these evils can be likened to the creation of a beautiful building. Ugly scaffolding is necessary in the construction of this building. It is ugly and serves no purpose other than in the actual construction of the building. When the building is completed, the scaffolding is torn down and discarded. It serves no further purpose. All evil will be discarded one day. And the last enemy, DEATH, will likewise be ABOLISHED FOR EVER (I Cor. 15:26) and God will "ALL in All"!!!
May God be with you and grant you wisdom and understanding.
Sincerely,
Ray
lilitalienboi16:
Dave and Jesse, thank you both for the edifying replies. I see now why I was having a difficult time grasping this. Its a simple idea but the words usage is complicated. I think I understand it a little better now!
Kat, I havn't gotten around to reading your reply yet but I will soon!
Thanks all,
Alex
Nathan:
This may not be the perfect analogy, but I think it's a good one: we've all heard the saying, "guns don't kill people, people kill people." The gun has no moral bias. There has been an attempt as of late to demonize guns as if the gun itself is "sin" or "immoral", when in actuality the root cause is always the intentions of mans' heart that uses the gun in immoral or sinful ways. Ban the guns and man will use knives, fists, rocks, etc to do what man always does - sin.
Evil doesn't have a mind of its own, but man does have a mind of its own (the heart/carnal mind) that commits evil and thus mans' heart is immoral, sins or is sinful. Whether or not "evil" is used as a noun or adjective in Scripture is irrelevant - in all cases it is always the intentions of the heart that are sinful, not evil itself. Man does evil because man is sinful, but evil is not sin.
lilitalienboi16:
Thank you kat for those many great excerpts from ray! I appreciate it.
I understand many of the things you are all saying to me.. I suppose is the "evil is not sin" which is always hard to wrap my mind around since the vast majority of times, sin is evil.
This scripture always comes to mind for me;
Gen 50:20 "But as for you, ye thought evil against me; but God meant it unto good, to bring to pass, as it is this day, to save much people alive."
Its just an interesting flip on things... what was done in evil by men, God was able to bring forth as good.
thoughts?
Kat:
Hi Alex,
--- Quote ---Gen 50:20 "But as for you, ye thought evil against me; but God meant it unto good, to bring to pass, as it is this day, to save much people alive."
Its just an interesting flip on things... what was done in evil by men, God was able to bring forth as good.
--- End quote ---
That is an interesting verse, I just used it in a conversation the other day. It seems when we see a loved one doing something that we think is wrong, we naturally rush to their aid to stop them. Well what if they don't see it the way we do and want to continue with what they are doing, so we fret and worry about them.
Even if somebody we know is making a serious error and doing something we will lead to chastisement... don't we all need to learn from our mistakes? We need first hand experience with something to have a really good understanding of it, just think of all the years we spent in church, we certainly understand exactly what it's about now. So I think it's the same with other things as well. God gives us personal first hand experience with something and yes He will show us the error of our way and that is not a pleasant thing. But one day He could then use what we learned from that experience to help others that are caught up in the same type thing. Yes God has a way of taking something that is evil and turning it into something for the good...
Just think how God will have all these elect at His serve on day that have experienced all kinds of differing life situations, that He can then use to send out and help others that have difficulties with the same thing. Maybe that is part of the preparation, that He is building up a people that have all the life experiences that He will need to serve Him in the kingdom.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
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