> General Discussions

THE FIRST SIN

<< < (4/5) > >>

Kat:

It does not say they had the choice to eat of the Tree of life, they did not, it was not an option at that time.

Gen 3:22  Later, the LORD God said, "Look! The man has become like one of us in knowing good and evil. Now, so he won't reach out, also take from the tree of life, eat, and then live forever—"
v. 23  therefore the LORD God expelled the man from the garden of Eden so he would work the ground from which he had been taken.
v. 24  After he had expelled the man, the LORD God placed winged angels at the eastern end of the garden of Eden, along with a fiery whirling sword, to prevent access to the tree of life.

When you think about what is happening there, Adam was in fellowship with God in the garden, then disobeyed... seems a lot like leaving the "first love."

Rev 2:4  Nevertheless I have this against you, that you have left your first love.

As a parable this is still representative of what will happen to all people. So when they sinned they lose fellowship with God or was kicked out of the garden. That is what I think is meant in saying "so he won't reach out, also take from the tree of life, eat, and then live." They no longer had the contact with God and LIFE, they as we all do lost it, they were now dead in their trespasses.

Eph 2:1  And you He made alive (this part does not apply to them), who were dead in trespasses and sins,
v. 2  in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience,

I would say the 'determining factor' was carnality, the decision/choice to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil was inevitable.

Rom 7:18  For I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my flesh. For I have the desire to do what is right, but I cannot carry it out.

Rom 7:14  For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am merely human, sold as a slave to sin.

Rom 7:5  For while we were living according to our human nature, sinful passions were at work in our bodies by means of the Law, to bear fruit resulting in death.

mercy, peace and love
Kat

theophilus:
Hello Kat, thanks for your reply. So, as it happens with all of us, Satan stoked the first couple's carnality and left their first love. Right?

Kat:

You know theophilus, they were communing with God and it must have been so wonderful, I can see that as their 'first love.' I guess it is the similar thing to when we first come to know who Christ is while in the church, then going on and claiming to be 'born again.'  But then in comes Satan to direct their attention to what he knew their carnality desired and they were drawn away by their own desires. Remember Eve "saw that the tree was good for food, that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree desirable to make one wise..." (Gen 3:6), this was no doubt not the first time she had noticed and thought about that tree.

James 1:14  But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed.
v. 15  Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death. 

So yes they were enticed by Satan to act on their carnal desires, he is very "cunning" (Gen 3:1) and knew just how to temp them and us all. But the breaking of the law, the sin came when "she took of its fruit and ate... gave to her husband with her, and he ate." But they were not spiritual minded and so not held to the spirit of the law, the actual sin came in taking and eating. But when "the eyes of both of them were opened" (to the world around them?) this was actually their spiritual death.

Rom 5:12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned—

And they were certainly held accountable for their decision with serious consequences, as God announced curses on them and since Adam represents all mankind, these curses were directed towards all people, as all follow in their (carnal) footsteps. This is the plan for the salvation of mankind beginning it's implementation.

mercy, peace and love
Kat

Farlsborough:
I'm learning so much from this thread, thank you Kat. Has Ray ever written a full piece about the symbolism in Genesis? Or do you have any recommended reading, regarding the tree of life, good and evil etc?

I've been discussing free will, God's sovereignty and so on with a friend recently; he is still very much fixed on the idea that it was Adam/Eve's "free will" that was this disaster which ruined God's plans. It occurred to me to phrase it like this: if you plan to have a child, you know you will always love that child but you also know that, as a toddler, that child will be selfish, greedy, short-tempered and sullen - at least on occasion! You know it will go through these behaviours, and it isn't that you approve or encourage any of them - in fact you make it clear that you disapprove, and that this is against your will - but equally, you understand this painful process will result in a caring, well-mannered, balanced individual who will make good choices and who you will be proud to call your son or daughter.

This seems to happen for each of us with God, but is also the overarching plan for humanity. The garden of Eden was perhaps the newborn -  everything seems lovely and cuddly but ultimately is immature and in some ways useless! Then the "terrible two's" of the fall, which sets the tone of rebellion and hard lessons learnt for much of childhood. Perhaps the teenage years are the final rebellion, the "end times"? But the aim is that through trial and discipline we are brought to be those wise adults who God is proud to call His children.

To condemn God for our sin, then (because that is what people do if you suggest there is no such "free" will) is to condemn a parent for their toddler's tantrums. It isn't that the parent specifically wants the child to grab, to scream, to push other kids. Yet, they always knew it would happen, and they approve of the whole process of a baby growing to maturity. They planned to have that child knowing full well all of this bad behaviour would result, but more importantly, knowing what would be achieved through it.

...Perhaps?!

Dave in Tenn:
Good thoughts, Farlsborough.  I think you gave him a fine answer.

I know I've read what God said and did--particularly in the garden account--that sounds just like parents the world over talking and behaving towards kids.

Navigation

[0] Message Index

[#] Next page

[*] Previous page