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Job
Ian 155:
I have gathered from Rays understanding and believe the whole "book" we call the "bible" is Gods testimony of his Son, it is also a parable which needs an intervention in order to understand.... and since he, Jesus, is our elder brother this giant parable applies to you and I.
But as far as the testimony of Ray or Ian or John or anyone else goes, ...
the testimony of God is greater, because this (what we call bible) is the testimony of God that He hath testified concerning His Son.
1Jn 5:10 He who is believing in the Son of God, hath the testimony in himself; he who is not believing God, a liar hath made Him, because he hath not believed in the testimony that God hath testified concerning His Son;
We have Heb 13 v 8, enforcing no change in how Jesus is represented spiritually throughout the word.
AS FAR AS THE WORD OF GOD
Pharoah at stages was in the place of God or represented God
Moses In the place of Christ
David in the place of God
Solomon in the place of Christ
Isaac,jacob,Joseph,Sampson,job,Boaz,Ruth and ALL the other characters testify to Christ in terms of the parable
Charlie Brown certainly was written on 2 levels some see Christ as all in all and some don't ,yet
No one is saying these characters (vessels) God is using are saved ....It does not make a difference ,the testimony alludes to process... the apostles found the truth in the old "book" they saw the "fulfilment" in the prophecies - if one cant see how all these "characters" are restored to God then I guess thats another topic, for another day
One can speak LIFE from the Grave, all these vessels ignoble and noble, that are "dead" AWAITING SALVATION including Job are still testifying today.And although "DEAD" they speak .
These 1st "examples" all point to Christ and we all know the 1st shall be last and the last 1st except .....in the case of our elder brother as he is not only the 1st he is also the last
Is Job "in the place" of Christ from the parable? And do his friends represent the scribe and Pharisee and carnal thinking creatures?. "Saved" or "unsaved"
Kat:
Hi Bob,
The resurrection and ascension of Christ was the pivotal point from which the Holy Spirit of Christ was given.
John 16:7 But I tell you the truth, it is expedient for you that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Comforter will not come to you. But if I depart, I will send Him to you.
John 15:26 "But when the Helper comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify of Me.
John 14:25 "These things I have spoken to you while being present with you.
v. 26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
As JFK said not even John the Baptist will be in the first resurrection.
Luke 7:28 For I say to you, Among those who are born of woman there is not a greater prophet than John the Baptist. But he who is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he.
--- Quote from: Ian 155 on December 05, 2014, 03:05:14 AM ---No one is saying these characters (vessels) God is using are saved ....It does not make a difference ,the testimony alludes to process... the apostles found the truth in the old "book" they saw the "fulfilment" in the prophecies - if one cant see how all these "characters" are restored to God then I guess thats another topic, for another day
--- End quote ---
I guess it's comments like that in bold that are confusing in what you are saying. How can they be "restored to God," as in already? They served the OT God the best they could to their grave, they never left God. They will be raised up and brought to know and serve Christ Jesus and that aspect of God only came to be when He was born in the flesh... that was way after they were dead, they never knew Him. When they are raised up in the resurrection of the dead they will be very willing and ready to come to know and serve the Messiah they never knew.
The book of Job is a poem where God addresses the suffering of the righteous... it seems likely that Job's story, like the story of the beggar and the rich man are parables and not about real people.
--- Quote from: lilitalienboi16 on December 05, 2014, 12:42:41 AM ---Also, I take contention with the "there will be no physical kingdom." While Christ and the elect will be spiritual, the rest of the dead will not be. They will be raised to physical bodies
Ezekiel 37:3 And he said to me, “Son of man, can these bones live?” And I answered, “O Lord God, you know.”
Ezekiel 37:7-10 "So I prophesied as I was commanded. And as I prophesied, there was a sound, and behold, a rattling, and the bones came together, bone to its bone. And I looked, and behold, there were sinews on them, and flesh had come upon them, and skin had covered them. But there was no breath in them. 9 Then he said to me, “Prophesy to the breath; prophesy, son of man, and say to the breath, Thus says the Lord God: Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe on these slain, that they may live.” o I prophesied as he commanded me, and the breath came into them, and they lived and stood on their feet, an exceedingly great army."
I don't think bob was saying that there will be a "phsyical kingdom" in the sense that it will be a kingdom of men, run by men, etc... there will only be Jesus who will eventually give up all authority to His father. Yes there will be no opposition.
--- End quote ---
Yes the kingdom will come "down out of heaven from God" (Rev 21:2), it will rule over the world/earth... but surely we don't think the elect will be doing all the daily mundane tasks required in ruling? There have been numerous people throughout history that have been noble, as far as a carnal person can be, but the Scripture does speaks of some of them... they won't be just sitting around twiddling their thumbs after they have been raised back up. These were great men/women of God in their time and they will be put to good use. A couple more Scripture to go along with what Alex is saying here.
Mat 8:11 And I say to you that many will come from east and west, and sit down with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven.
Luke 13:25 When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, 'Lord, Lord, open for us,' and He will answer and say to you, 'I do not know you, where you are from,'
v. 26 then you will begin to say, 'We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets.'
v. 27 But He will say, 'I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.'
v. 28 There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, and yourselves thrust out.
v. 29 They will come from the east and the west, from the north and the south, and sit down in the kingdom of God.
v. 30 And indeed there are last who will be first, and there are first who will be last."
mercy, peace and love
Kat
John from Kentucky:
"The book of Job is a poem where God addresses the suffering of the righteous... it seems likely that Job's story, like the story of the beggar and the rich man are parables and not about real people."
Cool Kat. I'm not the only one! God gave me the understanding a couple of years ago regarding your above comment.
Most likely the Book of Job is a parable. It is just not in the New Testament that God used parables to hide His teachings from the Many and reveal them to the few.
The first clue I had that the Book of Job was not literal was the description of the animals he owned. They are listed to the nearest thousand and hundred. That is not literal because animals do not reproduce to the nearest thousand or hundred.
Also the Book of Job starts off similar to the parable of Lazarus.
Also the Hebrew in that book is very, very old. It could possibly be the first book of the Old Testament in terms of age, possibly written before Moses.
Ian 155:
I should take lessons in writing perhaps....
What is meant is
This is the process leading to salvation or a simile of how one is saved,these characters are used to show us in the form of a parable.
So the way the 'character' Job, is eventually saved and exalted is what will happen to everyone,no favourites no exceptions
lilitalienboi16:
Kat and John,
Ray mentions in "How we got the bible" that Job might have been a pharoe. Yet you both are saying Job is nothing more than a parable and therefor not literal? Do you both believe then that Job never really literally existed as taught by the scriptures?
What about "that which is first is not spiritual but natural" and "all these things happened unto them for our esample?"
Couldnt job literally have existed and exeperiencdd whhat he did yet also his story be a parable with great spiritual significance?
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