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Author Topic: The sumerian King's list  (Read 4034 times)

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lilitalienboi16

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The sumerian King's list
« on: January 12, 2015, 02:43:35 PM »

Has anyone ever heard this or seen this before? I stumbled upon it today while looking into adam's decscendants and their lifespans. Its very interesting in the similar type of pattern we see between this piece of archeology and that of Genesis pre and post flood even though the sumarian lifespan's pre flood are even more intense than those of Genesis.

http://www.ancient-origins.net/myths-legends-asia/sumerian-king-list-still-puzzles-historians-after-more-century-research-001287

Still found it fascinating to see the same pattern unfold. You really got to wonder sometimes just how much do we really understand.

God bless,
Alex
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indianabob

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Re: The sumerian King's list
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2015, 03:07:08 PM »

Hi Alex,
As you say interesting
Have to question though the life span of the kings in thousands of years.
Does the text give any reason why the Kings lived so long? How does that statement relate to the Genesis version?
Isn't a life span of 500 years scientifically reasonable compared to 36,000 years in Sumer?
36,000 divided by 360 days = 100 years.

Indiana Bob
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lilitalienboi16

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Re: The sumerian King's list
« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2015, 03:15:04 PM »

Hi Alex,
As you say interesting
Have to question though the life span of the kings in thousands of years.
Does the text give any reason why the Kings lived so long? How does that statement relate to the Genesis version?
Isn't a life span of 500 years scientifically reasonable compared to 36,000 years in Sumer?
36,000 divided by 360 days = 100 years.

Indiana Bob

Hey bob,

Well, if you notice on the tablet, we go from 36k years originally down to what we would see after the flood of a hundred years etc... so I don't think you can take the days of the year and divide it into the year. They used a different unit which translates into our units of years. So if you get down to the times of the flood and also divide that by 360 days you now have people living less than a year? I don't think that works. I think the article mentions it the type of units they used to measure years. If not, its mentioned in the Wikipedia that I read which was about this tablet too.

Let me see...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sumerian_King_List

Antediluvian rulers[edit]

"None of the following predynastic "antediluvian" rulers has been verified as historical via archaeological excavations, epigraphical inscriptions, or otherwise. It is possible that they correspond to the Early Bronze Age Jemdet Nasr period culture which ended approximately 2900 BC, immediately preceding the dynasts,[17] if they were not purely mythological inventions.

The antediluvian reigns were measured in Sumerian numerical units known as sars (units of 3600), ners (units of 600), and sosses (units of 60 )
 
Ruler

Epithet

Length of reign

Approx. dates

Comments

"After the kingship descended from heaven, the kingship was in Eridug. In Eridug, Alulim became king; he ruled for 28800 years."
Alulim  8 sars (28,800 years) Between 35th and 30th century BC 
Alalngar  10 sars (36,000 years)   
"Then Eridug fell and the kingship was taken to Bad-tibira."
En-men-lu-ana  12 sars (43,200 years)   
En-men-gal-ana  8 sars (28,800 years)   
Dumuzid, the Shepherd  "the shepherd" 10 sars (36,000 years)   
"Then Bad-tibira fell and the kingship was taken to Larag."
En-sipad-zid-ana  8 sars (28,800 years)   
"Then Larag fell and the kingship was taken to Zimbir."
En-men-dur-ana  5 sars and 5 ners (21,000 years)   
"Then Zimbir fell and the kingship was taken to Shuruppag."
Ubara-Tutu  5 sars and 1 ner (18,600 years)   
"Then the flood swept over."[citation needed]Excavations in Iraq have revealed evidence of localized flooding at Shuruppak (modern Tell Fara, Iraq) and various other Sumerian cities. A layer of riverine sediments, radiocarbon dated to ca. 2900 BC, interrupts the continuity of settlement, extending as far north as the city of Kish. Polychrome pottery from the Jemdet Nasr period (3000-2900 BC) was discovered immediately below the Shuruppak flood stratum.[19] "

See wiki for more!

Hope that helps answer your question bob.

God bless,
Alex

P.S. Adam lived to be roughly a thousand years and many of his early descendants were close to that age as well.
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1 Cor 1:10 "Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment."

Kat

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Re: The sumerian King's list
« Reply #3 on: January 12, 2015, 06:22:37 PM »


Hi Alex,

I have read many accounts that try to explain away the longevity in Scripture of the generations from Adam down to Noah's. People just cannot believe this could be true. But I certainly believe it.

I've thought about this many times and something occurred to me that might possibly explain why God would have made those generations after Adam live so long. Thinking that God was indeed starting a whole new class of people on earth, a more advanced civilization, because I believe there were already people on earth at the time of Adam. Those first people, from science research, may have taken many hundreds of thousands of years to develop into a sizable population, a very long time whatever it was.

So if God wanted to start this new class and not take tens or even hundreds of thousands of years for them to get established, well just increase their lifespan for a while. There would have been many generations living at the same time, hard to imagine. But this would have brought about an exponential growth in their numbers rather quickly.

Just a thought.

mercy, peace and love
Kat
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John from Kentucky

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Re: The sumerian King's list
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2015, 06:33:55 PM »

I do not trust Sumerians.  Sumerians are men.  Men lie.

As for the genealogies in Genesis, they are possibly all symbolic, not literal.

I do not think any man can live to be 900 years old.  I will need proof to believe such a tall tale.  The way God designed the human body negates against such a long term life.  The oxidation of the blood is a controlled chemical burn, which is why we have a temperature.  We are burning our cells up over time.  I know health nuts believe by eating a handful of blueberries and hickory nuts one can live long, but there is a reason we have health nuts; they're nuts!

A period of 1,000 years is symbolic in the Scriptures of a perfect complete age.  The age of the men in Genesis of 900 years represents the age of mankind; one hundred years short of perfection.  Just like the number 6-6-6 also is a number for mankind; one number short of the perfect number of 7.

One of the most righteous men between Adam and Noah was Enoch.  Enoch lived 365 years.  Why was the life of the most righteous man only about 1/3 of the others?  Maybe his years were also symbolic.  365 days in a year; a perfect period of time for a righteous man.

The Septuagint was the Greek translation of the Old Testament, translated about 250 years or so before Jesus' birth.  The Septuagint was the primary text used by Jesus and the Apostles when they quoted the Old Testament in the New Testament.  The Septuagint has different numbers in the Genesis genealogies than the text used in most of our English translations.  Why the difference?

Could that be why Paul several times admonishes us not to argue about genealogies?  That they are symbolic rather than literal?  Or the different versions could have had copying errors?

Paul was extremely intelligent and educated.  He was taught in person by Jesus.  Which is why we should get off the subject of genealogies; our understanding is not complete in this area.
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lilitalienboi16

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Re: The sumerian King's list
« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2015, 07:33:20 PM »

I do not trust Sumerians.  Sumerians are men.  Men lie.

As for the genealogies in Genesis, they are possibly all symbolic, not literal.

I do not think any man can live to be 900 years old.  I will need proof to believe such a tall tale.  The way God designed the human body negates against such a long term life.  The oxidation of the blood is a controlled chemical burn, which is why we have a temperature.  We are burning our cells up over time.  I know health nuts believe by eating a handful of blueberries and hickory nuts one can live long, but there is a reason we have health nuts; they're nuts!

A period of 1,000 years is symbolic in the Scriptures of a perfect complete age.  The age of the men in Genesis of 900 years represents the age of mankind; one hundred years short of perfection.  Just like the number 6-6-6 also is a number for mankind; one number short of the perfect number of 7.

One of the most righteous men between Adam and Noah was Enoch.  Enoch lived 365 years.  Why was the life of the most righteous man only about 1/3 of the others?  Maybe his years were also symbolic.  365 days in a year; a perfect period of time for a righteous man.

The Septuagint was the Greek translation of the Old Testament, translated about 250 years or so before Jesus' birth.  The Septuagint was the primary text used by Jesus and the Apostles when they quoted the Old Testament in the New Testament.  The Septuagint has different numbers in the Genesis genealogies than the text used in most of our English translations.  Why the difference?

Could that be why Paul several times admonishes us not to argue about genealogies?  That they are symbolic rather than literal?  Or the different versions could have had copying errors?

Paul was extremely intelligent and educated.  He was taught in person by Jesus.  Which is why we should get off the subject of genealogies; our understanding is not complete in this area.

Paul also said this:

1 Corinthians 15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural [Literal, physical]; and afterward that which is spiritual.

1 Corinthians 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for examples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

The natural is first. While you glean great spiritual insight from what happened and they are the most important things for us in this day and age, no doubt about it, they were also first historical events that happened and were recorded. Paul says they happened.

Paul also talks about Adam and shares the spiritual insight he was privileged to known which came AFTER the natural history that happened.

I'm not trying to cause controversy about geneologies or even debate it.

God bless,
Alex
« Last Edit: January 12, 2015, 07:50:13 PM by lilitalienboi16 »
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Joel

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Re: The sumerian King's list
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2015, 02:22:19 AM »

The longer I live, the more I marvel at the wondrous works of our God, that has no beginning or ending of life.
Makes me curious as to what has been going on for so long, and just how much we don't know.
We have the Biblical record that God in his great wisdom has given us, and it is to the end that we may know more about our Lord, and Savior Jesus Christ, the Son of God that takes away the sins of the world.
It makes sense to me that the longer amount of years that people lived as recorded in the scriptures gave the people living then more time to gain knowledge, and a witness from various people.

Writings and records that we are so accustomed to, didn't exist or were few and far between.
The way I see it genealogy does have it's place, after all there are numerous places where God goes in to great detail to show a particular lineage. The birth of Jesus, and the connections as recorded in both Matthew, and Luke.
During Paul's day there were no doubt people that tried to impress others by showing how they were someone important because they were born of one tribe or another.
At that time the temple workers had to have lineage from Aaron, or Levi.
Paul placed, and rightly so, more emphasis on the Lord, and how the scriptures testified of his coming, and his death , burial, and resurrection.

Joel


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Ricky

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Re: The sumerian King's list
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2015, 04:04:05 PM »

Does man have any 100% solid proof today, that anybody ever existed in the bible, If God does not change, how could he change the age of all men to live. I have lots of questions on this one.    Ricky
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John from Kentucky

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Re: The sumerian King's list
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2015, 06:42:43 PM »

Does man have any 100% solid proof today, that anybody ever existed in the bible, If God does not change, how could he change the age of all men to live. I have lots of questions on this one.    Ricky

Do not doubt.  Paramount truths are that God lives and He does not lie and His Word does not lie.

By two or three witnesses let every word be established.

It is human understanding of God that could be wrong.

Could the 900 year lives of the early biblical figures have alternate explanations?

Could the last digit be a fraction of a year and the 1st two digits represent whole years?

Could the numbers be symbolic that man's years are less than the symbolic 1,000 years of a perfect age?

Or could men actually live to be over 900 years old?

I do not have the answer, just speculation.

But I do know that if God wanted men to live to be over 900 years old, that God could do that.  Nothing is impossible with God.  His Power is beyond our comprehension.  That is why the study of God is the most fascinating adventure there is.  Everything else pales into insignificance.

So take heart, all will be understood at the appointed times.
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lilitalienboi16

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Re: The sumerian King's list
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2015, 07:02:16 PM »

Does man have any 100% solid proof today, that anybody ever existed in the bible, If God does not change, how could he change the age of all men to live. I have lots of questions on this one.    Ricky

Do not doubt.  Paramount truths are that God lives and He does not lie and His Word does not lie.

By two or three witnesses let every word be established.

It is human understanding of God that could be wrong.

Could the 900 year lives of the early biblical figures have alternate explanations?

Could the last digit be a fraction of a year and the 1st two digits represent whole years?

Could the numbers be symbolic that man's years are less than the symbolic 1,000 years of a perfect age?

Or could men actually live to be over 900 years old?

I do not have the answer, just speculation.

But I do know that if God wanted men to live to be over 900 years old, that God could do that.  Nothing is impossible with God.  His Power is beyond our comprehension.  That is why the study of God is the most fascinating adventure there is.  Everything else pales into insignificance.

So take heart, all will be understood at the appointed times.

Amen, Amen!

God bless,
Alex
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1 Cor 1:10 "Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment."

Kat

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Re: The sumerian King's list
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2015, 09:16:34 PM »


Does man have any 100% solid proof today, that anybody ever existed in the bible, If God does not change, how could he change the age of all men to live. I have lots of questions on this one.    Ricky

Hi Ricky, you reference the Scripture that says God does not change.

Mal 3:6  "For I am the LORD, I do not change...

I think the pertinent word there is "I," God is referring to Himself here that does not change and will not, because He is perfect.

Mat 5:48  Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.

His nature - personality - His Holy character is perfect and that is a certainty that we can trust will never change.

Heb 13:8  Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.

It is an absolute truth that God is perfect and does not change and His plan for this creation is perfect as well. Now that would not mean there is never any changes in this creation, because that is the nature of this creation to progress forward through change. But that is only relative from where we are, as we are involved in the progression of things happening all the time. But to God all things are as they need to be. So this is the necessary process for this creation to move forward and it seems that change is a certainty in that.

And one very important change must come in us, as we must turn from our carnal nature and be converted - this is change.

Mat 18:3  and said, "Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.

Acts 3:19  Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, so that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord,

But you see what I'm saying. As for Adam's descendants living so long, there have been numerous attempts to explain away these incredible statements of fact in Scripture about their longevity, but to no avail. It's not just a single random or vague mention or two, there are many references to the descendants of Adam living many hundreds of years.

So maybe we don't have understanding at this time, but that does not may me doubt the accounts at all. I am certain that the truth of this will make perfect sense when revealed, as many other mysteries will as well.

mercy, peace and love
Kat
 
« Last Edit: January 13, 2015, 11:44:42 PM by Kat »
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