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angels
dave:
Perhaps this has been brought up before.
It has been made known that “hell” is not a place/location of eternal torment…. it is the “unseen” or the “grave.” I understand that now when I read the Bible it is a great weight lifted. I understand “judgment” and “damnation” and the lake of fire better. Now we have the word “angel” and from OT through the NT the word is defined and means “messenger.” Many translations use the word “messenger.”
As far as I know the word “celestial” is used once (1Cor. 15:40) and means sky, heaven, lofty, elevation, high up etc. Gen 2:1 And finished are the heavens and the earth and all their host. “Host” is defined as a “mass, force, encampment, innkeeper.” I just wonder if the translators didn’t have reasons for using the word “angel” just as they may have had reasons for using “hell, forever, everlasting. “ My reasoning is that the word “angel” has created an entirely different meaning to what we read. Man/human has imagination. Just my thoughts, I am open for understanding…….thank you.
lilitalienboi16:
--- Quote from: micah7:9 on January 15, 2015, 10:46:26 AM ---Perhaps this has been brought up before.
It has been made known that “hell” is not a place/location of eternal torment…. it is the “unseen” or the “grave.” I understand that now when I read the Bible it is a great weight lifted. I understand “judgment” and “damnation” and the lake of fire better. Now we have the word “angel” and from OT through the NT the word is defined and means “messenger.” Many translations use the word “messenger.”
As far as I know the word “celestial” is used once (1Cor. 15:40) and means sky, heaven, lofty, elevation, high up etc. Gen 2:1 And finished are the heavens and the earth and all their host. “Host” is defined as a “mass, force, encampment, innkeeper.” I just wonder if the translators didn’t have reasons for using the word “angel” just as they may have had reasons for using “hell, forever, everlasting. “ My reasoning is that the word “angel” has created an entirely different meaning to what we read. Man/human has imagination. Just my thoughts, I am open for understanding…….thank you.
--- End quote ---
Hi Micah,
There are verses that indicate there is a heavenly host of spiritual beings, some which will be judged at a future time. Here are some verses that came to my mind that I think are talking about spiritual beings and not humanly messengers.
Luke 2:13 And suddenly there was with the angel a multitude of the heavenly host praising God, and saying,
Luke 2:14 Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men.
Job 38:6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
Job 38:7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?
Jude 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.
2 Peter 2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;
Paul here makes separate reference to the angels making them distinct from the world. This would seem to me to be a confirmation of a heavenly host, sons of God, that are not human but rather spirit in their being.
1 Corinthians 6:2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
1 Corinthians 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
Ezekiel 28:16 In the abundance of your trade, you were filled with violence, and you sinned; so I cast you as a profane thing from the mountain of God, and the guardian cherub drove you out from the midst of the stones of fire.
These seem to be good references to angels or other spiritual beings that are not just human messengers though I suppose some could be interpreted as being human in nature too but then some others must be interpreted as spiritual beings such as the "covering Cherub."
Hope this helps a little!
God bless,
Alex
Dave in Tenn:
Setting aside what angels ARE, Micah I think you are correct in saying that man has an 'imagination' about these things, just as he does about Satan, hell, heaven, etc. So much of what people 'know' about all of these is purely imaginary and has no basis of truth in scripture.
I'll turn you to:
http://bible-truths.com/lake2.html
http://bible-truths.com/lake9.html
I don't know if they will answer you directly, but there is wisdom in them both that may help.
acomplishedartis:
If anyone can explain more in Jude 1:6 and 2Peter 2:4, I would appreciate it a lot...
dave:
Thanks for the replies Dave and Moises G. this was already wrote
Luk 2:13 And suddenly with the messenger there came to be a multitude of the heavenly host, praising God and saying,
Job 38:6 On what were its sockets sunk? Or who directed its cornerstone in place,
Job 38:7 When the stars of the morning jubilated together, And all the sons of Elohim shouted with joy?
Gen 6:2 and sons of God see the daughters of men that they are fair, and they take to themselves women of all whom they have chosen.
These verses in Job and Genesis do raise questions, “sons of God” “sons of Elohim.” Also we know that Elohim is plural, so it is “sons of Gods or sons of elohims.”
Jud 1:6 messengers also, those who did not keep their own principality, but did leave their proper dwelling, to a judgment of a great day, in bonds everlasting, under darkness He hath kept,
2Pe 2:4 For if God spares not sinning messengers, but thrusting them into the gloomy caverns of Tartarus, gives them up to be kept for chastening judging;"
“Paul here makes separate reference to the angels making them distinct from the world. This would seem to me to be a confirmation of a heavenly host, sons of God, that are not human but rather spirit in their being.”
1Co 6:2 Or are you not aware that the saints shall judge the world? And if the world is being judged by you, are you unworthy of the least tribunals?
1Co 6:3 Are you not aware that we shall be judging messengers, not to mention life's affairs?
Ezekiel 28:16 In the abundance of your trade, you were filled with violence, and you sinned; so I cast you as a profane thing from the mountain of God, and the guardian cherub drove you out from the midst of the stones of fire.
a cherub or imaginary figure. I do not see that cherub translates to “angel.”
Just what is a cherub?
Yes, I see a distinction from the world certainly. I do believe there is a “heavenly host” whether they are sons of God I would question (but that’s just me.) We are dealing with spirit, but I am in a place where I really do not understand just what “spirit” is, other than spirit is energy (that again is just me.)
It just seems to me the word that has become common in use because of translation as “angels” if it were written “messenger” much of what we speak about “angels” would be understood differently or at least not something with wings. I’m just asking and I thank you Alex for your response.
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