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I will pour out My spirit on all flesh...
indianabob:
Friend Ian 155
Thanks for the friendly explanation, BUT...
I don't see that you answered Kat's simple question in a simple manner with additional exposition where needed.
I would have answered that we are resurrected spiritual with the ability to appear in physical form in order to function in an earthly, physical environment.
Many examples are found in scripture in addition to Jesus' appearance after his resurrection.
What is so difficult about my statement that may confuse or mislead??? ;D
Kat:
--- Quote from: Ian 155 on July 26, 2015, 03:07:39 AM ---
I believe everything is spiritual, to answer your question Id need a verse x2 to back myself..this I don't have and I don't think you will find one except for 2tim 2v18 I believe Hymenaeus and Philetus,believed in a "physical" resurrection and were blaspheming.
--- End quote ---
2Ti 2:16 But shun profane and idle babblings, for they will increase to more ungodliness.
v. 17 And their message will spread like cancer. Hymenaeus and Philetus are of this sort,
v. 18 who have strayed concerning the truth, saying that the resurrection is already past; and they overthrow the faith of some.
You do see there that Hymenaeus and Philetus' "idle babbling" was that "the resurrection is already past" and that is because the resurrection is yet future. Paul even explained that those saying there was no literal resurrection, then neither did they believe in Christ's literal resurrection back to life as the Firstfruit, His physical body was changed and raised into a glorious spiritual body... that is what the elect will experience as well.
1Cor 15:12 Now if Christ is preached that He has been raised from the dead, how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead?
v. 13 But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ is not risen.
v. 14 And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is empty and your faith is also empty.
v. 15 Yes, and we are found false witnesses of God, because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ, whom He did not raise up—if in fact the dead do not rise.
Paul went on to explain that IF there is no resurrection, then the those elect who have "fallen asleep" - died, are "perished" - lose forever.
1Cor 15:16 For if the dead do not rise, then Christ is not risen.
v. 17 And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins!
v. 18 Then also those who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished.
v. 19 If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men the most pitiable.
v. 20 But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep.
v. 21 For since by man came death, by Man also came the resurrection of the dead.
v. 22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive.
v. 23 But each one in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ’s at His coming.
Paul says to the elect that they "will receive (future, my comment) the crown of glory," and "shall be (future) made alive"... "at His coming," Paul and the other elect were already begotten with the Holy Spirit, their crown/reward was yet future.
1Pe 5:4 and when the Chief Shepherd appears, you will receive the crown of glory that does not fade away.
So yes there is a spiritual begettal for the chosen few now, in this life, but clearly Paul says that his crown is "laid up for me" waiting for him to receive in the resurrection to glory, in the future.
2Tim 4:8 Finally, there is laid up for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will give to me on that Day, and not to me only but also to all who have loved His appearing.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
rick:
--- Quote from: Ian 155 on July 26, 2015, 03:07:39 AM ---
--- Quote from: Kat on July 25, 2015, 02:52:30 PM ---
I guess a simple question to you Ian, is do you think there is a literal bodily resurrection for the elect yet to come in the future?
mercy, peace and love
Kathy
--- End quote ---
Hi Kat,you are aware I got banned for this :D...
these are my thoughts below
I believe everything is spiritual, to answer your question Id need a verse x2 to back myself..this I don't have
--- End quote ---
Hello Ian,
Without a 2nd witness of scripture one can make the word of God say anything and you admitted you cannot find a 2nd witness, so you are confronted with 2 Pe 1:20
2Pe 1:20 knowing this first, that no prophecy of scripture is of private interpretation.
Also, if everything is spiritual now how do you explain 1Co 15:46 Howbeit that is not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; then that which is spiritual.
1Co 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption ( physical ) ( spiritual )
You also mentioned Mat 23:27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which outwardly appear beautiful, but inwardly are full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.
Notice Christ said ( like ) not ( are )
These Pharisees and scribes though they could obtain life by obeying the law but the law only brings death.
Rom 7:9 And I was alive apart from the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died;
Another thing also, if the resurrection has already happen physically then we could do what Christ does I would imagine
( 1Jn 3:2 Beloved, now are we children of God, and it is not yet made manifest what we shall be. We know that, if he shall be manifested, we shall be like him; for we shall see him even as he is.
Joh 20:26 sounds like to me Christ just appeared in a room with the door shut, Christ came through where ? The door ? The door was locked , the walls ? I don’t know He just appeared in the room with them.
Joh 20:26 And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them. Jesus cometh, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you.
Can God’s elect just appear in a room in like manner as Christ did ?
Ian 155:
--- Quote from: indianabob on July 26, 2015, 07:27:48 AM ---Friend Ian 155
Thanks for the friendly explanation, BUT...
I don't see that you answered Kat's simple question in a simple manner with additional exposition where needed.
Pleasure BUT...Thats my choice, having been down this path before, would you give, what is sacred, to "dogs" ? ever hear of the word SETUP
I would have answered that we are resurrected spiritual with the ability to appear in physical form in order to function in an earthly, physical environment.
Really so there are exceptions to Your word ...one can be in the heavens and be fleshly at the same time?
Many examples are found in scripture in addition to Jesus' appearance after his resurrection.
well then you don't have to know Jesus (God) after the spirit ? Right ?and you will see the invisible God with your natural eyeball right ?
You can say "hey" I see Jesus in him, he has long hair and is rather handsome,with a slightly longer nose ?
friend... here are some "crumbs"...Jesus often appears to me and many others, he tells me many things and explains himself/his word, yet...,
I don't see anything ? get the picture?
What is so difficult about my statement that may confuse or mislead??? ;D
what statement ? ;D
--- End quote ---
So you recon we climb back into our mama's womb and come out again only this time half spiritual and half physical
ye are yet carnal...
don't panic though,all in Gods time, perhaps you are being raised from the dead, right now...
Ian 155:
--- Quote from: Kat on July 26, 2015, 08:41:00 AM ---
--- Quote from: Ian 155 on July 26, 2015, 03:07:39 AM ---
I believe everything is spiritual, to answer your question Id need a verse x2 to back myself..this I don't have and I don't think you will find one except for 2tim 2v18 I believe Hymenaeus and Philetus,believed in a "physical" resurrection and were blaspheming.
--- End quote ---
2Ti 2:16 But shun profane and idle babblings, for they will increase to more ungodliness.
v. 17 And their message will spread like cancer. Hymenaeus and Philetus are of this sort,
v. 18 who have strayed concerning the truth, saying that the resurrection is already past; and they overthrow the faith of some.
You do see there that Hymenaeus and Philetus' "idle babbling" was that "the resurrection is already past" and that is because the resurrection is yet future.
NO I DON'T SEE IT LIKE THAT
PAST,Well literally... that then takes care of the "lie" that Christ was resurrected, ya think ?There is more to this verse than meets the eye,go and study it before your one and only verse, which to YOU means there is only a PHYSICAL RESURRECTION OF "DUST" PEOPLE AFTER YOU DIE LITERALLY
Perhaps the title of this ladies thread, may waken you.
Would be good to see how the Spirit returns To God Who gave it.. LITERALLY
"then man's dust will go back to the earth, returning to what it was, and the spirit will return to the God who gave it"
Paul even explained that those saying there was no literal resurrection, then neither did they believe in Christ's literal resurrection back to life as the Firstfruit, His physical body was changed and raised into a glorious spiritual body... that is what the elect will experience as well.
What would you want this old tent for ? and Paul did not say anything about a "literal" resurrection
THE RENEWAL OF YOUR MIND BY THE WASHING OF THE WORD
1Cor 15:12 Now if Christ is preached that He has been raised from the dead, how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead?
yes Id like to know too we are resurrected,BORN AGAIN,NOT WITH HANDS, BY HIS SPIRIT.
The way you are interpreting the scriptures, surely this verse above directly contradicts your fav verse 2 Tim 2v18 ?
v. 13 But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ is not risen.
EXACTLY
v. 14 And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is empty and your faith is also empty.
PRECISELY
v. 15 Yes, and we are found false witnesses of God, because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ, whom He did not raise up—if in fact the dead do not rise.
YEBO
Paul went on to explain that IF there is no resurrection, then the those elect who have "fallen asleep" - died, are "perished" - lose forever.
Who Said there is no resurrection ??
BTW CAN YOU SEE A MIND, A RENEWED ONE ?
1Cor 15:16 For if the dead do not rise, then Christ is not risen.
v. 17 And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins!
v. 18 Then also those who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished.
v. 19 If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men the most pitiable.
v. 20 But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep.
v. 21 For since by man came death, by Man also came the resurrection of the dead.
v. 22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive.(alive to what)human status ?
v. 23 But each one in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ’s at His coming.
AND THESE VERSES ABOVE MEAN THAT YOU MUST BE RESURRECTED PHYSICALLY ?
Paul says to the elect that they "will receive (future, my comment) the crown of glory," and "shall be (future) made alive"... "at His coming," Paul and the other elect were already begotten with the Holy Spirit, their crown/reward was yet future.
1Pe 5:4 and when the Chief Shepherd appears, you will receive the crown of glory that does not fade away.
ALL PHYSICAL THINGS FADE AWAY, SO WE AGREE, THIS IS A SPIRITUAL CROWN OF GLORY.
So yes there is a spiritual begettal for the chosen few now, in this life, but clearly Paul says that his crown is "laid up for me" waiting for him to receive in the resurrection to glory, in the future.
(this crown is it physical ?) what does "crown" have to do with appearance ?
YA CANT SEE SPIRIT WITH THE NATURAL EYEBALL
2Tim 4:8 Finally, there is laid up for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will give to me on that Day, and not to me only but also to all who have loved His appearing.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
--- End quote ---
Flesh Cannot contain the kingdom... in the Flesh one is restricted... is God Restricted ?You will never convince me that we who are going to be like HIM, are raised flesh or fleshly or half and half only PURE fits the Kingdom all else dies.
If you believe we will be as HE is then eating all the "big macs" in America will not come close to stretching your body to fit the kingdom of GOD into IT -
FLESH AND BLOOD CANNOT ENTER THE KINGDOM - SPIRIT BEGETS SPIRIT,WE ARE RAISED INCORRUPTIBLE,NO "HINT" OF CARNALITY,ANY REMOTE SIGN OF FLESH/CARNALITY WILL ROT,DIE, THE SPIRIT ONLY, BRINGS LIFE .
IT may carnal to assume the walls of Jericho were physical I pray that the Walls and Doors will come down and be opened in your and my mind .
The adversary would not have it so, it appears
1Co 15:26 The last enemy is being abolished: death
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