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Should we be asking for forgiveness.

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rick:
Should we be asking for forgiveness for sin/s we commit ?


The reason I ask this is because I know the sin issue has been dealt with on the cross. However is forgiveness conditional IF one does not repent ?

Can one repent of anything outside the intentions or will of God ?  This has been on my mind, I’m always saying sorry Jesus or forgive me Jesus but lately I been asking what am I to understand from this sin/s, what is it your tying to teach me or get me to understand ?

With me, it seems the more I try not to sin the more I sin, its like I’m better off not even trying.
I must say, sin does keep me humble period, Its impossible for me to think I’m better than anyone because I see my own flaws and flawed am I.

If Christ is working in me then I understand His work in me is on going, if Christ is not working in me then I can at least understand why I sin.

   
I’m not sure if Christendom is creeping up in me, I remember in Christendom I always felt condemned more than saved or safe with God.

I remain thankful for the truths I learned here I must say, I don’t feel condemned but I now feel unsure if God is working in me now or if His plan is to work in me during the next age.

I sometimes wish I knew for sure if I’m going through the lake of fire now or if my time is in the next age. I don’t know if that would make things different.

I’m thinking there is probably other people besides myself having these same type of thoughts too.     

I know that Gods intention and will for my life will come to pass just as He declared it because my will is subjected to His will and Gods will, will be done.

What ever I think do or say has always been done from a caused choice and if its caused then I never operated with free will, or a will free from cause.

Scripture says we are either a slave to sin or a slave to righteousness, I do dislike feeling like I’m a slave to sin but then again that maybe telling me something too.


After discovering the things I have learned on this website I can never believe God is anything less than good, I know now God has everyone’s best interest at heart and that’s awesome to me.

In this age things are so difficult and mostly unpleasant at least in my life, whether I’m God’s elect or not I do pray for the return of Jesus, it seems my rowboat is sinking.

lilitalienboi16:
Hi Rick,

I do not believe that forgiveness is conditional if one does not repent. However, if you do not repent, God cannot yet save you as it is the second step in the process towards salvation.

There are many scriptures that indicate that what was done on the cross was a done deal.

1 Peter 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

Hebrews 9:11-28
11 But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building;
12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
13 For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:
14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.
18 Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.
19 For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,
20 Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.
21 Moreover he sprinkled with blood both the tabernacle, and all the vessels of the ministry.
22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
23 It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these.
24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:
25 Nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others;
26 For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.
27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

1 John 2:1-2
1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

John 3:16 For God thus loves the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

I don't think there is anything wrong with asking for forgiveness even though its already been given once and for all. The reason is that it shows YOU KNOW that what you are doing is not okay. Its a way of God working in you so that you recognize what you are. Guilt is another sign that God is working in you. It shows that you feel remorse and know that you are doing is not right. Its like ray said, eventually you get to a point where the guilt is so bad that you'd rather not feel the guilt then enjoy the momentary pleasure of sinning. All of this though is God working in you and will not come about until the time He appointed.

You will always sin so long as you are in this fleshy body but you can come to a point in your life where sin does not reign in you.

Romans 6:11-15
11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

1 Kings 8:46-52
46 If they sin against thee, (for there is no man that sinneth not,) and thou be angry with them, and deliver them to the enemy, so that they carry them away captives unto the land of the enemy, far or near;
47 Yet if they shall bethink themselves in the land whither they were carried captives, and repent, and make supplication unto thee in the land of them that carried them captives, saying, We have sinned, and have done perversely, we have committed wickedness;
48 And so return unto thee with all their heart, and with all their soul, in the land of their enemies, which led them away captive, and pray unto thee toward their land, which thou gavest unto their fathers, the city which thou hast chosen, and the house which I have built for thy name:
49 Then hear thou their prayer and their supplication in heaven thy dwelling place, and maintain their cause,
50 And forgive thy people that have sinned against thee, and all their transgressions wherein they have transgressed against thee, and give them compassion before them who carried them captive, that they may have compassion on them:
51 For they be thy people, and thine inheritance, which thou broughtest forth out of Egypt, from the midst of the furnace of iron:
52 That thine eyes may be open unto the supplication of thy servant, and unto the supplication of thy people Israel, to hearken unto them in all that they call for unto thee.

1 John 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

Ecclesiastes 7:20 For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not.

Proverbs 20:9 Who can say, "I have kept my heart pure; I am clean and without sin"?

Romans 3:10-12
10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

That's as good as it gets for now but I'd say to get to that point where sin does not reign in our bodies is probably quite a journey and no easy feat. Ray said that being saved is the hardest thing any human being will ever do. I agree with him.

God bless,
Alex

rick:

--- Quote from: lilitalienboi16 on August 02, 2015, 01:49:39 PM ---

I do not believe that forgiveness is conditional if one does not repent. However, if you do not repent, God cannot yet save you as it is the second step in the process towards salvation.


--- End quote ---

Hi Alex,

Thanks for your input as I always appreciate it.

This is also my belief too as you stated above, I understand Gods plan for all humanity which is to save all, no one will be lost. Although God is calling some now He shall call the rest in the next age.

My thoughts are or understanding is which I received from Rays papers would be that it is presumptuous for anyone to think or say to themselves whatever sin they are involved with can control or outright make it disappear.

My understanding of repentance is to repent of whatever sin one is committing or doing and do it no more, but the problem I have with this belief that one has this ability is to believe one operate with free will.

I like how Ray put it in an article of his when he stated that you would think if we had free will you would think of all the people who ever lived someone would of used their free will to not sin.

I also remember Ray said that one will stop sinning when God says one will stop sinning. As I look towards Gods plan for all humanity an what He’s doing I can’t help to think that part of Gods plan involves us to sin as bad as it is it’s a part of Gods plan also.

I remember Ray also saying that if ( not a direct quote ) someone reads his papers an does not believe what he is saying especially with the scriptures he uses to show these marvelous truths its only because God is not calling that one. 

My problem is I believe everything Ray says in his papers I cannot be number among his detractors because I cannot go against the truth as I understand it nor do I care to.


God is truly the potter, the clay cannot form itself, can the clay say this I will no longer do ? If there is something in the clay that is not right it can only be God the potter who will fix it.

Isa 64:8  But now, O LORD, thou art our father; we are the clay, and thou our potter; and we all are the work of thy hand.




God bless all.

Dave in Tenn:
When the Potter has set up all the conditions necessary for you to 'repent', you will repent.  Sometimes those conditions are easy, and sometimes they are very, very hard.  I try not to forget that paramount in all of these "workings of His will" is that He died for us. 

In the meantime, here's three big "IF's".

1Jn 1:8  If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9  If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10  If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

And this from the Lord Jesus:

Luk 18:10  Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
Luk 18:11  The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
Luk 18:12  I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
Luk 18:13  And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
Luk 18:14  I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

rick:

--- Quote from: lilitalienboi16 on August 02, 2015, 01:49:39 PM ---

I don't think there is anything wrong with asking for forgiveness even though its already been given once and for all.



--- End quote ---



Hi Alex,

I totally agree with this statement, one should at least say I apologize for this I have done if this I have done is not right, but I believe its God who brings anyone to this point rather than the person themselves coming to this point without God bringing one to this point.

I find or believe this is more about ones life, why do we do the things we do ? Why do we make the decisions we make or not make ?

No mater how one weighs it , it always goes back to the potter, I remember Ray saying more than once throughout his papers he would ask, do you believe the scriptures ?


I’m coming to terms with the fact I am not operating my life according to free will but only with a will that is completely subject to Gods will, I don’t believe I have any say, I may feel I have some say in what I do but its only because God is spirit and I cannot detect God with my senses He has created me with. God can come and go but His movements are undetectable to me.

God has me box in, there is no place inwardly or outwardly one can escape Gods intentions for ones life, God is completely sovereign but again as Ray would say, do we believe the scriptures ?


God bless all.  :)

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