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[indianabob]

Hi again Lauriellen and Alex,

We are not in old testament time. Not in the way the WWCG taught that we were.
The old covenant & its requirements of sacrifice and Temple worship have been replaced. God is no longer having ONLY the Jews to be His people and to be an example to the world of obedience to the law of God.

The new covenant leads us to make of OURSELVES a sacrifice to God, by living righteously, improving a little each day and year.
Of course that is possible ONLY with the indwelling of God's spirit. We are the temple of God's spirit, we are the place where God's spirit is working. NOT IN OTHERS we may know and love.

It is NOT our place to go about seeking who we can convert by sharing the knowledge that God has reserved to those few God is calling at this time. So do not cast your pearls of wisdom before swine that will trample them underfoot.

With the indwelling of God's spirit we each can begin to develop the talents and gifts that God has granted us. That does not include evangelizing in the early stages of our personal development.
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Actually, developing our own talents is a life long endeavor, so be patient.
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Yes, I know that it is tempting to want to share what we have been given so that others may benefit by the knowledge of God's gracious love. But that is not our choice and in fact it is a little arrogant to suppose that we know the hearts and minds of other people better than God does.

Actually a good place to start if you are a beginner and beginners can be of any age, try Matthew 5:1-48

Please read it all, but note the final verse and spend most of your personal effort in cooperating with God to make it come true.

48 Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.

That is quite enough to accomplish in one lifetime, so leave the rest to God's son to bring about at the predetermined time in God's plan.

Offered in love, Indiana Bob

[Nelson Boils]

Hi Virginia

You say, "Now I found out that Yahweh and Yahshua is a pagan name and my husband is Yahwehist and Yahshua man.This has just happened to me and I can't talk to him about, but I did ask him to read what I did about it."

I'm afraid you may just be deceiving your husband.Where on earth did you read this?I suggest you read "Solving the enigma of God" by Ray.

[lauriellen]

Thank you Bob,
I appreciate your reply and I do feel like a weight has been lifted. I in no way think I am anywhere close to perfect nor qualified to be a teacher. Most of my 'shares' are quotes of other teachers or links to articles (including here) that I found helped me in my quest to learn and grow, and thought might help others. I have given a lot of thought to my motives for sharing my beliefs so much. I tell myself that I can not tolerate the character of God being misrepresented and I just want people to know that God is NOT the monster portrayed in traditional religion.....BUT, at the back of my mind is a nagging wonder if it is all just ego and wanting to be 'right' and prove others wrong, or an argumentative nature in me that needs to be purged. I know that all of the wrong theology is working for God's purpose and it is not my place to set everyone straight, however, this brings me back to the original question about persecution.....if we are not being persecuted for our faith, as Ray said, we are probably not living right? How could we be persecuted for our faith if no one knows what we believe?

[Dave in Tenn]

Lauriellen, since facebook is a player in this...

I'm tormented by many of the things I see posted on facebook, and most things I see posted on facebook are posted by christians.  Sometimes it bothers me all day (sometimes longer) looking at/reading what somebody else just regurgitated there without thought.  Sometimes I reply, and sometimes I don't.  When I do, sometimes I 'feel better' and sometimes I don't.  When I reply, I give a lot of thought to it. Except when I don't.  When I don't reply , I process these contradictions in my own mind and faith is grown.  Except when I don't.

If there is a single 'right' thing to do, I don't always either 1) know what it is, or 2) do it (obviously).  Yet it seems to me so far that whatever I do or don't do, He works in me to help.  That's the 'fiery trials' I 'experience'.  If that's not enough, I suspect He will turn up the heat.

I've said and thought for a long time that any fool acting badly can get himself 'persecuted' in his own mind if that's the goal.  The goal (to me) is in living godly.  The way I read it, Jesus is warning them...not telling them to 'go forth and get thyself persecuted'.  That's the cart before the horse.  Live godly--get persecuted. 

It could well be that I am getting all the persecution He knows I can handle.  You know, SOMETIMES it even happens here.

[Kat]

One thing we might should consider when we "throw our pearls" out there, is can we follow that up with the answers in Scripture that might come up from what we share?

Sure we see that the Apostles went out preaching and sharing the gospel and Ray certainly put the truth out there to others. The Apostles witnessed of what they knew from personal experience and teachings from Christ Himself and I believe Ray was called to 'expose those who contradict,' and had many years of serious Bible study/training before that. The Apostles and Ray had the knowledge and Spirit to backup what they preached and did, most importantly they had a commission from God to do what they did.

What I mean is if we just toss a truth at a person and expect them to 'get it' and even desire to know more truth from us, we are kidding ourselves. The Holy Spirit must open a person's eye 'before' they can understand... it's NOT the other way around, that the Holy Spirit will come if we give somebody a scrap of truth. God works out this conversion very carefully throughout the elects life, until at last the Holy Spirit comes in and there eyes begin to open to these wonderful truths. Most certainly that person will then seek out the truth, and most certainly God will show them where to find it.

We should be "prudent" (Amos 5:13) where or to whom we speak of these things, and we need to know there is a time to speak of these things and a time keep silent.

Ecc 3:1  To everything there is a season, A time for every purpose under heaven:

Ecc 3:7  A time to tear, And a time to sew; A time to keep silence, And a time to speak;

mercy, peace and love
Kat

[indianabob]

Hello again Lauriellen,

Your last sentence is the key to some of the problem we all face.

" "How could we be persecuted for our faith if no one knows what we believe?" "

People need to and will learn about your beliefs by the way you live and how you treat other people. It is your actions that speak for you. You don't need to preach...

This is especially true of your close relatives and friends whom you have known longest.

When you express understanding and forgiveness toward the hurtful actions of another person, you demonstrate God's love toward all sinners.
When you do this in the presence of a person who is revengeful and just wants to get even they will not (cannot) understand and will think of you as an enemy.
People who have been hurt by others naturally (carnally) seek support and agreement for their desire to get even, to see the offender punished.

When you accept people with religious beliefs different from your own or that of your relatives, it can be frustrating for those relatives who expect you to be on THEIR side no matter what.

For example, when you are able to let God strengthen you through prayer and meditation and you are then able to rise each morning with a positive attitude and face the difficult day just being nice and being forgiving of others and their differences, the change in your attitude will show. To some it may be irritating, to others a pleasant surprise.

In my own case I have had to bite my tongue while having a pleasant discussion with my wife. She often will state an opinion about another person or a situation that I find to be in error. So instead of correcting her automatically the way I used to do, I instead just smile and listen and perhaps ask her why that seems so to her. Then I listen politely while she explains. I don't interrupt, I don't correct or offer my own view, I just try to understand and put myself in her position.
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After all she just wanted someone to listen to her concerns. She didn't ask me to share my opinion, she is not ready to change or to forgive AND it is not my job to correct her.
As the husband in the partnership, my job is to lead by example. It is not my job to preach or to condescend to my better half. God does NOT require that approach!

God can and will CAUSE my wife to change, to grow in grace, when God is ready.
It may take many years. We've been married 54 years and the last ten have been the best. Because, I let go and let God do the work...in me, not in her.

She will learn righteousness in the resurrection from other saints who shall be very much better qualified than I am today and that reassurance gives me peace of mind and increases my love toward God and respect for God's wisdom.

All I need to do in this life is to express my unconditional love toward her as an example.
In that way I help her to develop more trust in me as a husband and equal partner.

The problem within families arises when only one partner is called. Because that called partner has to carry the whole burden of responsibility. So it is important to keep in mind that God does NOT judge you by your spouses actions or life style.
Of course that is a very difficult challenge, but considering what our Lord and master had to endure for us it is a small price to pay. AND God will strengthen you and grant you peace of mind through it.

Keep in mind that God is NOT teaching righteousness to the MANY in this life. Only the few are being given an experience of grace and coming to love God unconditionally.

Mark 12:30-31 (NIV)

30 Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength. 31 The second is this: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself. There is no commandment greater than these.”

Please continue to present your concerns to the forum, I am confident that all here want to help you and help themselves as well by meditating on your questions.
 
No one here is better than any other. We each have had similar difficulties in life and will have more in the future, so let us continue in God's love toward one another as we have been led to see the need with God's patient correction.

Thanks to Ray and Dennis and all the moderators for their work of love.

 

[lauriellen]

I thank Ray and Dennis too, along with all who share here. It is so good and helpful. I am  also in a difficult situation at home concerning my unorthodox  beliefs, and I am sure my family would be relieved if I would just go back to the way I was before. It can certainly be a lonely row to how, but I appreciate the example you gave of dealing with your wife, and I could learn a lot from your approach.
One more thing, and I think Ray talked or wrote about this, isn't it important to 'preach the gospel to all the world as a witness' before Christ returns, not just as a recruiting mission, but as a witness against those who oppose?

[indianabob]

Lauriellen,
Thanks for your thoughtful remarks.

Yes it is important for there to be a witness to the world at large.

However, God can take care of this by many means other than having us approach everyone we know.

Just consider Ray Smith. He was doing his level best in a small way with friends when the Internet became a viable means to share. With the essential help of Dennis and other friends Ray was able to broadcast his work for thousands and millions to see. This was the work that God had sent him to do.

But please keep in mind that there were years and decades of study, self examination and research in preparation for that task. It wasn't done quickly after he began to learn the truth. Ray first counted the cost of doing God's work and prepared himself carefully.

I think most of us, the great majority, are still basking in our first love of God's truth, still learning. I don't think that we are anywhere close to ready to represent God's word and God's plan to the general public.

So then if we are genuinely desiring of doing this work for God then we should spend the time and the effort with prayer and fasting to prepare. Keeping in mind that we may do more harm than good if we try to teach only our friends or those who will listen to us because they know us.

If a person is genuinely interested they will be begging for the opportunity to share their interest with you.
If they only listen politely and don't bring up the subject again, then it is not their time.

God's truth does not need to be promoted like a sales pitch. When a person is being called they are eager to learn more and to study all the information that they can find. Isn't that how we found this site??

So please be patient with yourself, God will make it plain and obvious when it is time for you to share these pearls of great price with people who will appreciate them.

Warm regards, Indiana Bob

I thank Ray and Dennis too, along with all who share here. It is so good and helpful. I am  also in a difficult situation at home concerning my unorthodox  beliefs, and I am sure my family would be relieved if I would just go back to the way I was before. It can certainly be a lonely row to how, but I appreciate the example you gave of dealing with your wife, and I could learn a lot from your approach.
One more thing, and I think Ray talked or wrote about this, isn't it important to 'preach the gospel to all the world as a witness' before Christ returns, not just as a recruiting mission, but as a witness against those who oppose?

[Nelson Boils]

Nice one, Indiana!

Just to add.Let us educate ourselves with what Ray has left for us,read and re-read and re-read until you fully understand so that you don't stand behind Ray all the time and when asked a question you say:"Yah well there is this guy on the internet..."So lets educate ourselves guys and put in the effort.

What i like about Ray's method of teaching is that he taught us how to fish.

[virginiabm]

Hi Nelson, First I would like to say I am sorry for posting that in here and I would like for everyone to forgive me. Second I want you to know I would never try to deceive my husband. I share everything with him and if he agrees or not, I am good with it. I started thinking about this when Ray said in his article about the name Yahshua was not in the Old or New Testament. That is what got me on this study.
I can't speak about where I got this from, so I want. I am very sorry I brought it up in here. Please forgive me.

 with love, virginia

[judy]

Santgem, I am not worthy to walk in your shoes, seriously. When it comes (persecution) from one's own family it is hard. When I was much younger I was called, "the nun, whacko, seriously disturbed and avoided and today my husband doesn't even want to hear the word, God. But, you know what, it hurt and I felt like I didn't belong but now many yrs. later these same people ask for prayers from me. Once i took the attitude of, 'they know not what thy do"  I started to grow. Now, I even correct their lack of knowledge of scripture but in a way that is not offensive, more like an apologetic. And with love of course. An Atheist took me apart limb from limb once(not literally) and did I ever want to throw the book at him but i didn't but it took me a long time not to hate him for what he said. I feel cowardly at times because I don't speak up but when you know it is just going to cause an argument I shut up.Only if I am asked anymore. it can be very lonely sometimes.

[santgem]

Santgem, I am not worthy to walk in your shoes, seriously. When it comes (persecution) from one's own family it is hard. When I was much younger I was called, "the nun, whacko, seriously disturbed and avoided and today my husband doesn't even want to hear the word, God. But, you know what, it hurt and I felt like I didn't belong but now many yrs. later these same people ask for prayers from me. Once i took the attitude of, 'they know not what thy do"  I started to grow. Now, I even correct their lack of knowledge of scripture but in a way that is not offensive, more like an apologetic. And with love of course. An Atheist took me apart limb from limb once(not literally) and did I ever want to throw the book at him but i didn't but it took me a long time not to hate him for what he said. I feel cowardly at times because I don't speak up but when you know it is just going to cause an argument I shut up.Only if I am asked anymore. it can be very lonely sometimes.

Hello Judy,
Greetings!

I feel your loneliness, Just the way i feel it everyday except when i had my one month yearly vacation. You do not have a way to speak for yourself the way i do.

But at the end of the day, I thank our Lord that i am experiencing these things, it really humbles me. I am nothing in this world without him and i endured the days that is why i am still alive and kicking.

Did you feel the satisfaction even we are lack of something? If you ask me, i feel safe in the night even i was surrounded by unbelievers and evil. As i said before and will say it again, God works in mysterious ways. We are very lucky indeed Sister Judy.....All things may come to pass. I pray that we will endure all these things in our life.....

[judy]

Santgem, I know one thing for sure at this old age. We win (not in the sense of being arrogant) but through every battle whether a quiet one or a situation I come out with peace where those who have tormented me do not. I wish they knew of this peace!!  People think i am strong but not really, I just know God loves me and made me smart through His Holy Spirit. The grace of perseverance has always been given to me.  My life is a gift and it is a fact God calls those whom the world never gives a second glance. I am alive because He is alive and holds me up. He is my life, my first love forever. Thank God for you. judy