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The Cross
repottinger:
Dear Jeff,
The only thing I can add to all of the fantastic comments that you’ve already received is a few things that we read in the scriptures. First, as Ray said so many times, ALL is of God.
Romans 11:36, AKJV
36 For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.
I Corinthians 8:5-6, AKJV
5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,) 6 but to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
I Corinthians 11:12, AKJV
12 For as the woman is of the man, even so is the man also by the woman; but all things of God.
II Corinthians 5:18, AKJV
18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
Hebrews 2:10, AKJV
10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.
Second, all things work together for good to those who are predestined to salvation by God.
Romans 8:28, AKJV
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
Ephesians 1:11, AKJV
11 in whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
Third, Christ is the Saviour of all the world and God will have all to be saved, and so all are predestined to eventually be called to salvation.
I Timothy 2:3-4, AKJV
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; 4 who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
I Timothy 4:10, AKJV
10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.
I John 4:14, AKJV
14 And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world.
However, we do not know or understand all of God’s means of achieving these ends, and will never be able to do so in this life, because we are not God:
Job 38:4-7, AKJV
4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth?
declare, if thou hast understanding.
5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest?
or who hath stretched the line upon it?
6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened?
or who laid the corner stone thereof;
7 when the morning stars sang together,
and all the sons of God shouted for joy?
Isaiah 55:8-9, AKJV
8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts,
neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth,
so are my ways higher than your ways,
and my thoughts than your thoughts.
Romans 9:14-23, AKJV
14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid. 15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. 16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. 17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. 18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? 20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? 21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? 22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: 23 and that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, 24 even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
I hope that this might be helpful to you.
Your brother in Christ,
Randy
Jeff:
Colin,
What you wrote was well said and thoughtful. The message, if I understand, is that we are all buffeted from every direction, and are completely dependent on God to deliver us. I find myself thinking that Jesus had a benefit that we don't yet have. He was completely dependent on the Father, just as we are, but we lack the faith that Christ had (I do). Jesus knew who He was, where He came from, and where He was going. He knew. And while He had the same human experience that we have, we are like the disciples in the boat. We have the faith with which God has blessed us, but we don't have the insight or vision of Christ. Jesus knew He was the Lamb of God.
1 Corinthians 13:12King James Version (KJV)
12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
I lack the vision that would give me confidence in my place in God's Kingdom. I know that and accept it, and pray for more faith, understanding and wisdom, but Jesus is God. Yeshua Ben Elohim.
Colossians 2:17
KJV
Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
Jesus was able to see and understand the bigger picture, while we languish in the shadows, gleaning what can from God, Christ, and faithful teachers, and I'm grateful beyond measure for that, but long for God's Kingdom on earth. We all do.
I'm so thankful for what I have in the body of Christ, and whatever part I might have, if any, in God's plan for the salvation of mankind - in my spirit I long for so much more understanding, here and now.
You have a good and godly heart Colin, and I thank God for you, and everyone here. The belief in the Scriptures is, in this place of worship, strong beyond measure in all the world. I believe that.
Peace,
Jeff
Jeff:
--- Quote from: repottinger on October 09, 2015, 10:19:43 PM ---Dear Jeff,
The only thing I can add to all of the fantastic comments that you’ve already received is a few things that we read in the scriptures. First, as Ray said so many times, ALL is of God.
II Corinthians 5:18, AKJV:
18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
Second, all things work together for good to those who are predestined to salvation by God.
Romans 8:28, AKJV:
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
Third, God is the Saviour of all men and will have all to be saved, and so all will be called to salvation.
I Timothy 2:3-4, AKJV
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; 4 who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
I Timothy 4:10, AKJV
10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.
However, we do not know or understand all of God’s means of achieving these ends, and will never be able to do so in this life, because we are not God:
Job 38:4-7, AKJV
4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth?
declare, if thou hast understanding.
5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest?
or who hath stretched the line upon it?
6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened?
or who laid the corner stone thereof;
7 when the morning stars sang together,
and all the sons of God shouted for joy?
Isaiah 55:8-9, AKJV
8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts,
neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth,
so are my ways higher than your ways,
and my thoughts than your thoughts.
I hope that this might be helpful to you.
Your brother in Christ,
Randy
--- End quote ---
Thank you Randy. I take the Scripture you shared to heart and it gives me confidence to keep moving forward. Everything here, the Truths that God gave to Ray, the insight that continues to multiply as we pray, study, and grow, is a testament to the goodness of God, and His plan of salvation for all.
Jeff
repottinger:
You're very welcome, Jeff; I'm truly happy to hear that. I will pray for the peace of God to keep your heart and mind through Christ Jesus.
Sincerely,
Randy
octoberose:
The beginning of this thread was Jeff asking if Paul and others knew more suffering than Christ. What i want to add is that in the history of the workd there has never been a more evil thing than the creator of the universe dying for the sins of the created. Jesus not only died, but he died with the weight of all these sins you speak about on him. He was separated from his Father for the first time in his existence- for us. He sweat drops of blood before subjecting himself to this terrible thing. When Paul died, when anyone dies, they deserve death. They actually do becase the wages sin is death. But jesus did not deserve any of it. L
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