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Matthew 9:17 bottles KJV
cheekie3:
Kat -
Thank you for your post, which is very helpful:
--- Quote from: Kat on July 25, 2016, 04:46:47 PM ---From my E-Sword
Matthew 9:17
(ASV) Neither do men put new wine into old wine-skins: else the skins burst, and the wine is spilled, and the skins perish: but they put new wine into fresh wine-skins, and both are preserved.
(BBE) And men do not put new wine into old wine-skins; or the skins will be burst and the wine will come out, and the skins are of no more use: but they put new wine into new wine-skins, and so the two will be safe.
(CLV) Neither are they draining fresh wine into old wine skins; otherwise, surely the wine skins are bursting, and the wine is spilling, and the wine skins perish. But they are draining fresh wine into new wine skins, and both are preserved."
(ERV) Also, people never pour new wine into old wineskins. They would break, the wine would spill out, and the wineskins would be ruined. People always put new wine into new wineskins, which won't break, and the wine stays good."
(ESV) Neither is new wine put into old wineskins. If it is, the skins burst and the wine is spilled and the skins are destroyed. But new wine is put into fresh wineskins, and so both are preserved."
(GNB) Nor does anyone pour new wine into used wineskins, for the skins will burst, the wine will pour out, and the skins will be ruined. Instead, new wine is poured into fresh wineskins, and both will keep in good condition."
(ISV) Nor do people pour new wine into old wineskins. If they do, the skins will burst, the wine will spill out, and the skins will be ruined. Instead, they pour new wine into fresh wineskins, and both are preserved."
(LITV) Nor do they put new wine into old skins; otherwise, the skins are burst, and the wine pours out, and the skins will be ruined. But they put new wine into fresh skins, and both are preserved together.
(Rotherham) Neither pour they new wine into old skins: otherwise at least, the skins are burst, and, the wine, runneth out, and, the skins, are spoiled,—but they pour new wine into unused skins, and, both, are together preserved.
(RV) Neither do men put new wine into old wineskins: else the skins burst, and the wine is spilled, and the skins perish: but they put new wine into fresh wineskins, and both are preserved.
(YLT) `Nor do they put new wine into old skins, and if not--the skins burst, and the wine doth run out, and the skins are destroyed, but they put new wine into new skins, and both are preserved together.'
(MKJV) Nor do men put new wine into old wineskins; else the wineskins burst, and the wine runs out, and the wineskins perish. But they put new wine into new wineskins, and both are preserved together.
(NKJV) Nor do they put new wine into old wineskins, or else the wineskins break, the wine is spilled, and the wineskins are ruined. But they put new wine into new wineskins, and both are preserved."
(KJV) Neither do men put new wine into old bottles: else the bottles break, and the wine runneth out, and the bottles perish: but they put new wine into new bottles, and both are preserved.
(KJV+) NeitherG3761 do men putG906 newG3501 wineG3631 intoG1519 oldG3820 bottles:G779 elseG1490 theG3588 bottlesG779 break,G4486 andG2532 theG3588 wineG3631 runneth out,G1632 andG2532 theG3588 bottlesG779 perish:G622 butG235 they putG906 newG3501 wineG3631 intoG1519 newG2537 bottles,G779 andG2532 bothG297 are preserved.G4933
G779
ἀσκός
askos
as-kos'
From the same as G778; a leathern (or skin) bag used as a bottle: - bottle.
--- End quote ---
The point I am making is solely to do with the KJV.
I have read and heard and watched people read out from the KJV Bible hundreds of times; and I remember it as:
Matthew 9:17 Neither do men pour new wine into old wineskins. If they do, the skins will burst, the wine will run out and the wineskins will be ruined. No, they pour new wine into new wineskins, and both are preserved.[/b]
But if you look now in a KJV Bible online or in a physical version you will find:
Matthew 9:17 Neither do men put new wine into old bottles: else the bottles break, and the wine runneth out, and the bottles perish: but they put new wine into new bottles, and both are preserved.
Do you not recollect that the KJV stated wineskins and not bottles.
Kind Regards.
George
cheekie3:
Kat -
Thank you for these Scriptures. They are verry helpful.
--- Quote from: Kat on July 25, 2016, 04:54:23 PM ---
More form E-Sword
Isaiah 65:25
(ASV) The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the ox; and dust shall be the serpent's food. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith Jehovah.
(BBE) The wolf and the lamb will take their food together, and the lion will make a meal of grass like the ox: but dust will be the snake's food. There will be no cause of pain or destruction in all my holy mountain, says the Lord.
(CLV) Then a wolf and a lambkin will graze alike, and the lion, as the beeve, will eat crushed straw, and the serpent has soil for its bread. They will not do evil, nor ruin in all My holy mountain,says Yahweh."
(ERV) Wolves and little lambs will eat together. Lions will eat hay like cattle, and snakes will eat only dust. They will not hurt or destroy each other on my holy mountain." This is what the LORD said.
(ESV) The wolf and the lamb shall graze together; the lion shall eat straw like the ox, and dust shall be the serpent's food. They shall not hurt or destroy in all my holy mountain," says the LORD.
(GNB) Wolves and lambs will eat together; lions will eat straw, as cattle do, and snakes will no longer be dangerous. On Zion, my sacred hill, there will be nothing harmful or evil."
(ISV) "The wolf and the lamb will feed together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox; but as for the serpent—its food will be dust! They won't harm or destroy on my entire holy mountain," says the LORD.
(KJV) The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD.
(KJV+) The wolfH2061 and the lambH2924 shall feedH7462 together,H259 and the lionH738 shall eatH398 strawH8401 like the bullock:H1241 and dustH6083 shall be the serpent'sH5175 meat.H3899 They shall notH3808 hurtH7489 norH3808 destroyH7843 in allH3605 my holyH6944 mountain,H2022 saithH559 the LORD.H3068
(LITV) The wolf and the lamb shall feed as one; and the lion shall eat straw like the ox. And dust is the food of the snake. They shall not do evil nor destroy in all My holy mountain, says Jehovah.
(MKJV) The wolf and the lamb will feed together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox; and dust will be the food of the snake. They will not hurt nor destroy in all My holy mountain, says Jehovah.
(NKJV) The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, The lion shall eat straw like the ox, And dust shall be the serpent's food. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all My holy mountain," Says the LORD.
(Rotherham) The wolf and the lamb, shall feed, in unity, And, the lion, as an ox, shall eat straw; But as for the serpent, dust, shall be his food: They shall not harm—Nor shall they destroy, In all my holy mountain, saith Yahweh.
(RV) The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the ox: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD.
(YLT) Wolf and lamb do feed as one, And a lion as an ox eateth straw, As to the serpent--dust is its food, They do no evil, nor destroy, In all My holy mountain, said Jehovah!
--- End quote ---
I am purely stating about the KJV only.
I have read the KJV hundreds of times, and it was always 'the lion shall lie down with the lamb'.
Do you not recollect this.
Why are there loads of images on Google (Images) search showing the Lion with the lamb - as well as the fox with the lamb. If the KJV scriptures did not originally state the lion, why are there so many pictures of the lion lieing peacefully with the lamb.
Kind Regards.
George
Kat:
Yes George, that is the way I remember that it was wineskins, but not so much about the lion and the lamb, yes that is the way it's usually depicted in pictures, probably because it gives a more extreme example. That's one reason that I use a variety of translations, and Strong's to go into the meaning of the word translated... the translators did the best they could, but in some instances probably because they did not have knowledge of spiritual truth so they did/could not get it right. The word bottle really does not bother me, as I do not think it changes the meaning and I see "wolf and lamb" in all the translations so that's what I would go with.
Though translations do have errors, the Bibles we have been given can be used effectively and with help like what Ray gave about how to correct the errors, so we can come to the real meaning. I do not try to stick with one translation, even the modern English word translations (GNB) I use and find helpful. It's really about the spiritual understanding that's behind the Word on the page.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
Joel:
Hi George,
I have a KJV New Testament that the Gideon's gave me in 1961, and a 1972 KJV, Thomas Nelson center column reference, both say bottles for that verse.
The T.N., CCR also says "Or, wineskins" in the center column.
Joel
zvezda:
--- Quote from: cheekie3 on July 25, 2016, 04:49:30 PM ---
The best example I can think of is:
--- Quote ---Isaiah 65:25: (KJV):
The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the Lord.
Should this not read 'The Lion and the lamb shall lie together'.
If you Google (Images) this, you will see an anomaly, in that there are both images of the lamb with either a Fox, or a Lion.
--- End quote ---
--- End quote ---
George, I believe "the lion and the lamb" is a common misquotation. I don't think the three verses you mentioned have been altered in KJV, as you can see them in the original 1611 KJV (the three links I provided in my previous post). Even Ray wrote "old bottles [wineskins]" in the LOF 11 http://bible-truths.com/lake11.html
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