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Author Topic: The Mind Of Christ.  (Read 7971 times)

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Pini56

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The Mind Of Christ.
« on: October 06, 2016, 07:10:47 AM »

Hello All,

1Co 1:10  Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

1Co 2:16  For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

2Co 13:11  Finally, brethren, farewell. Be perfect, be of good comfort, be of one mind, live in peace; and the God of love and peace shall be with you.

Php 1:27  Only let your conversation be as it becometh the gospel of Christ: that whether I come and see you, or else be absent, I may hear of your affairs, that ye stand fast in one spirit, with one mind striving together for the faith of the gospel;

Php 2:2  Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind.

Php 2:3  Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem the other better than themselves.

Php 2:5  Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

Col 3:12  Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;

2Ti 1:7  For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

1Pe 3:8  Finally, be ye all of one mind, having compassion one of another, love as brethren, be pitiful, be courteous:

1Pe 4:1  Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;

1Pe 5:2  Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;

Rom 12:16  Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.

Eph 4:23  And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;

My Question: If this is what we must do, then how do we; how do we attain the Mind of Christ or what is the process we must go through to bring this about.
I look forward to, each his own, answer according to their own experiences. Maybe some of you don’t know and would like to know. I my self am not really sure, but do have some idea. Please keep to the Scriptures or better yet try and relate your experiences to Scripture. I look forward to a good Discussion and that we may all learn from it.

Love to you all, Regards Geoff.
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Dennis Vogel

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2016, 10:44:56 AM »

For one thing we need to be vigilant.

Mat 7:15  Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Mat 7:16  Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

Mat 7:20  Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

Act 20:28  Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

Act 20:29  For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.

Rom 16:17  Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.



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cheekie3

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2016, 11:09:50 AM »

Geoff -

Hello All,

1Co 1:10  Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

1Co 2:16  For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

2Co 13:11  Finally, brethren, farewell. Be perfect, be of good comfort, be of one mind, live in peace; and the God of love and peace shall be with you.

Php 1:27  Only let your conversation be as it becometh the gospel of Christ: that whether I come and see you, or else be absent, I may hear of your affairs, that ye stand fast in one spirit, with one mind striving together for the faith of the gospel;

Php 2:2  Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind.

Php 2:3  Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem the other better than themselves.

Php 2:5  Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

Col 3:12  Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;

2Ti 1:7  For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

1Pe 3:8  Finally, be ye all of one mind, having compassion one of another, love as brethren, be pitiful, be courteous:

1Pe 4:1  Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;

1Pe 5:2  Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;

Rom 12:16  Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.

Eph 4:23  And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;

My Question: If this is what we must do, then how do we; how do we attain the Mind of Christ or what is the process we must go through to bring this about.
I look forward to, each his own, answer according to their own experiences. Maybe some of you don’t know and would like to know. I my self am not really sure, but do have some idea. Please keep to the Scriptures or better yet try and relate your experiences to Scripture. I look forward to a good Discussion and that we may all learn from it.

Love to you all, Regards Geoff.

To me, to have the mind of Christ (by the renewing of our mind) is to think like Our Heavenly Father.

Jesus is our best example, and the Scriptures that quote His Words are our best evidence.

Jesus taught that His Words were not His own, and The Father does The Works.

Jesus said that The Holy Spirit will teach us all Truth.

Our Father said that He will write His Laws on our Hearts and Minds.

Once Our Father drags us out - He starts to show us things.

Once we prove any of His Truths, that particular Truth becomes a part of us - and nothing can remove that Truth - not even Death.

It is a process of learning to be 'Like Him'. One step at a time, through 'suffering'.

In my own experience, I have suffered to get segments of 'His Truth'; and then when that part of 'His truth' was part of me, I lived it, and suffered accordingly.

When you understand that the whole world system works contrary to 'His Laws', and is the exact opposite of His nine-fold Fruit (which are His Spirit and Character); and you start to live your life as He would want you to, then you will prove His Truths more and more - and 'The Mind of Christ' (in you) will continue to change more and more into 'His Image'.

One good example is that we are not to seek vengeance, nor fight evil with evil (but with good).

Only if 'He is within you' can you prove 'His Love' and fulfill 'His Spiritual and Royal Law'.

An easy way to remember this is to 'Love Him with all that you are' and 'Love everyone else as yourself'. Impossible by our means - but it is 'His Commandment for us to obey at all times'.

If I were to summarise what this means, I would put it like this:

"Father, by Your Holy Spirit, please put this Mind of Christ in me -so that in all that I am and do, from the intents and desires of my heart, to my thoughts, and my speech and conduct, I will honour and please you."

I hope this helps you in your search for this particular Truth of Our Almighty Father.

Kind Regards.

George


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Dennis Vogel

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2016, 12:17:19 PM »

Quote
It is a process of learning to be 'Like Him'. One step at a time, through 'suffering'.

I think this is the most meaningful thing you said George. None of us received everything in an instant. It takes time.
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Joel

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2016, 02:05:59 PM »

Being a overcomer takes time for sure.

Hebrews 8:10-For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them their God, and they shall be to me a people:
11-And they shall not teach every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

Hebrews 9:How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

Joel
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Dave in Tenn

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2016, 03:58:15 PM »

I'll just add some underscores and let these stand as they might.

Php 2:5-8  For, let this mind be in you that is also in Christ Jesus, who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal to God, but did empty himself, the form of a servant having taken, in the likeness of men having been made, and in fashion having been found as a man, he humbled himself, having become obedient unto death--death even of a cross...

This is the mind of Christ in the shortest and clearest terms.

Geoff, I've found that we have to understand and do many things at the same time.  Often they seem contradictory, and there is no shortage of "folks" who can and will hurl scripture to let us know we're failing to do one thing or the other.  And sometimes we are.  Jesus whipping the money-changers out of the temple doesn't seem "humble" on the surface, nor does his contention with the Scribes and Pharisees--indeed, even with His own disciples.  Yet He still humbled Himself in the greatest humiliation possible.  And that's what is "required" of us.  First.

Php 2:10,11  ...that in the name of Jesus every knee may bow--of heavenlies, and earthlies, and what are under the earth--and every tongue may confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

...For there is ONE LORD...

That's really the only "unity" I seek, though other "unities" are very precious to find.

 
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Heb 10:32  But you must continue to remember those earlier days, how after you were enlightened you endured a hard and painful struggle.

Colin

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2016, 11:24:34 PM »

Hello Everybody

Before I set out to drive around Australia, 50 years ago, I consulted detailed maps to plan our journey.   Detailed maps often have lots of symbols which are explained in what is termed a legend that provides explanation of the symbols used, such as to denote tracks, camping grounds, scenic lookouts, caravan parks, railway crossings etc.

By analogy, the scriptures are the map, a guide, for our walk through life….our “path”.    David was inspired to describe it this way:-
Ps 119:103  How sweet are thy words unto my taste! yea, sweeter than honey to my mouth!
Ps 119:104  Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way.
Ps 119:105   Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.

There are many other scriptures we can find, which include the term “feet” to denote our conduct, or misconduct ...and understanding which way we should live.     Proverbs is filled with them, for instance.

Ray’s numerous papers provide us with many explanations of the symbols used in our “scriptural map”, in that he elaborated and showed us how to avoid misinterpreting symbols, which we had done unknowingly. 
We had been brought up and taught to think that a “boggy bit of ground” was reliably safe to drive/walk on, by believing the doctrines of former false ministers.  One of the important clues which Ray gave us was to alert us to the presence and application of parables; this knowledge can often be a “light to our understanding”.

If I had continued to study my map of Australia until I felt I knew every detail of the journey which I had proposed to do, and had not actually commenced my trip - then I might have become an expert map reader but not much more; I would have remained totally ignorant of what it is like to actually undertake such a journey, with all of its strenuous experiences, pitfalls and enjoyable vistas . 
 I would not have realised that often a detour is encountered, for whatever reasons, and close consultation of the map would be needed to find the best way around an obstacle.  The map would form the firm basis for deciding which way is best to choose.

Such is life.

Because the word of God reflects the mind of God, it is the best guidance to live by.    Using a map involves more than a cursory glance at it now and then.   My analogy is not perfect: analogies are not always, but I hoped that I could contribute beneficially with these thoughts.

 As I continue to encounter people at the point of death in my volunteering work, I am glad I have “my map” - notably, the scriptures and the legend provided by Ray, so that I can better understand what this life of ours is all about, to a better degree. 

 The frequent question I hear people ask is “why does God have man suffer so much”?  I cannot answer them, as they would not comprehend what we have been blessed to understand.  I am comforted by knowing that all will be revealed in God’s good time   - to ALL of us.   I do possess the map and am able to interpret some of the finer details, for which I am most thankful.     

The mind of Christ is one of compassion (which we can read of in many of His encounters with suffering humanity, when He walked the earth).   Understanding His teachings of showing love are of paramount importance to our developing the same mind which He has. 

This is a gradual process…..much as was my driving around Australia, where I learned as I went - how to become a better driver and navigator. 

We have to get out and DO……while realising that our good works are God-inspired.   He is the One who “lights out path”, but we have to take the steps.     
Colin
   
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cheekie3

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #7 on: October 07, 2016, 04:57:16 AM »

Colin -

Hello Everybody

Before I set out to drive around Australia, 50 years ago, I consulted detailed maps to plan our journey.   Detailed maps often have lots of symbols which are explained in what is termed a legend that provides explanation of the symbols used, such as to denote tracks, camping grounds, scenic lookouts, caravan parks, railway crossings etc.

By analogy, the scriptures are the map, a guide, for our walk through life….our “path”.    David was inspired to describe it this way:-
Ps 119:103  How sweet are thy words unto my taste! yea, sweeter than honey to my mouth!
Ps 119:104  Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way.
Ps 119:105   Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.

There are many other scriptures we can find, which include the term “feet” to denote our conduct, or misconduct ...and understanding which way we should live.     Proverbs is filled with them, for instance.

Ray’s numerous papers provide us with many explanations of the symbols used in our “scriptural map”, in that he elaborated and showed us how to avoid misinterpreting symbols, which we had done unknowingly. 
We had been brought up and taught to think that a “boggy bit of ground” was reliably safe to drive/walk on, by believing the doctrines of former false ministers.  One of the important clues which Ray gave us was to alert us to the presence and application of parables; this knowledge can often be a “light to our understanding”.

If I had continued to study my map of Australia until I felt I knew every detail of the journey which I had proposed to do, and had not actually commenced my trip - then I might have become an expert map reader but not much more; I would have remained totally ignorant of what it is like to actually undertake such a journey, with all of its strenuous experiences, pitfalls and enjoyable vistas . 
 I would not have realised that often a detour is encountered, for whatever reasons, and close consultation of the map would be needed to find the best way around an obstacle.  The map would form the firm basis for deciding which way is best to choose.

Such is life.

Because the word of God reflects the mind of God, it is the best guidance to live by.    Using a map involves more than a cursory glance at it now and then.   My analogy is not perfect: analogies are not always, but I hoped that I could contribute beneficially with these thoughts.

 As I continue to encounter people at the point of death in my volunteering work, I am glad I have “my map” - notably, the scriptures and the legend provided by Ray, so that I can better understand what this life of ours is all about, to a better degree. 

 The frequent question I hear people ask is “why does God have man suffer so much”?  I cannot answer them, as they would not comprehend what we have been blessed to understand.  I am comforted by knowing that all will be revealed in God’s good time   - to ALL of us.   I do possess the map and am able to interpret some of the finer details, for which I am most thankful.     

The mind of Christ is one of compassion (which we can read of in many of His encounters with suffering humanity, when He walked the earth).   Understanding His teachings of showing love are of paramount importance to our developing the same mind which He has. 

This is a gradual process…..much as was my driving around Australia, where I learned as I went - how to become a better driver and navigator. 

We have to get out and DO……while realising that our good works are God-inspired.   He is the One who “lights out path”, but we have to take the steps.     
Colin
 

When I was reading your Post, I began to think about why most people struggle to accept that there is a Creator who is pure Love.

I find that most people that refuse to accept in a Creator and a Loving God, is because of all the suffering and killing.

In the Old Testament, Our heavenly Father killed and ordered Israel to kill many people and nations, either because they obeyed and served other gods, or that they did not obey Him.

How do we answer someone who asks 'How can a Loving God, tell you to love others as yourself, when He killed those that served other gods? Is this not what all the extremists in all religions do today?'.

It is difficult to reconcile the separation and extremism of The Old Testament regarding The Hebrews / Israelites, and The New Testament regarding 'God is Love'.

We are instructed to have answers to questions that we are asked - but can any of us on this Forum correctly answer the above question, that has been raised a multitude of times?

Kind Regards.

George

 
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Pini56

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #8 on: October 07, 2016, 05:54:00 AM »

Hello All,

Some really good responses here. I liked your Analogy Colin. How do we gain a proper understanding of the word of God. It’s no good just being a good Map Reader. As colin pointed out, we must get out there on the Road to fully appreciate the map and come to a better understanding of it. Here is scripture that backs this up.

Jas 1:19  Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath:
Jas 1:20  For the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God.
Jas 1:21  Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
Jas 1:22  But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
Jas 1:23  For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:
Jas 1:24  For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.
Jas 1:25  But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.
Jas 1:26  If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.
Jas 1:27  Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

Well to me this is what It’s all about. Sometimes all we are doing here on this Forum is for ever learning and never truly understanding. These Scriptures tell us what pure region is and that the understanding comes from being a doer.

I liked your explanation Dave, tis true what you said. And said in a way that spoke to my Heart. Thank you.

“It is a process of learning to be ‘Like Him’. One step at a time, through ‘suffering’.” Ditto on this one.

Thanks for your input Dennis. Act 20:29  For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock. This is unfortunately true.

I look forward to hearing from others. Maybe something that Ray has shown us.

Love to you all, Regards Geoff.
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Kat

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #9 on: October 07, 2016, 09:33:58 PM »


Hi Geoff, good topic, here is a few things from Ray on this.

https://bible-truths.com/lake8.html ------------------------------

Jesus Christ said,
"And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter [a movable stone], and upon this rock [Christ, the immovable boulder] I will build MY CHURCH; and the gates of hell [Greek: hades, the unseen realm of the dead] shall NOT prevail against it" (Matt. 16:18).

What did Jesus mean that the "gates of hades would not prevail against it?" This word "prevail" was translated from the Greek word katischuo and it means, "to overpower." It is used but one other time in Scripture and here we shall see exactly what this word means:

"And they [the chief priests] were instant with loud voices, requiring that He [Jesus] might be crucified. And the voices of them of the chief priests prevailed… And when they were come to the place which is called Calvary, there they CRUCIFIED Him…" (Luke 23:23 & 33).

The chief priests "prevailed" [katischuo] by putting Jesus Christ TO DEATH. But Jesus said that the "gates of hades [realm of the DEAD] will not prevail [katischuo] against it." In other words, His Church would NEVER be overpowered to death.

And so, the Church that Jesus Christ built is still around today.

On Pentecost, Jesus Christ came back to His disciples just as He said He would. He came back as the Comforter. Jesus said that they absolutely could NOT receive the Comforter until He went away. Why? Because Jesus Christ IS THE COMFORTER, but not in the flesh, but in THE SPIRIT!

It was on Pentecost that the first members of the Church of Christ received the Holy Spirit Comforter, just as He symbolized to them when He blew on them, showing that He Himself would come to them in spirit by the will of God. Now for the first time, His disciples were truly converted, baptized in Holy Spirit, possessing the mind of Christ, lead into all Truth (Jesus) by the Comforter—Jesus was NOW BUILDING HIS CHURCH!

"But the Comforter [Greek, parakletos, also called the Consoler, and in I John 2:1, Advocate in KJV, and Entreater in the CLNT] which IS the Holy Spirit, Whom the Father will send in My name, He shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you" (John 14:26).

The Advocate or Entreater in I John 2:1 IS the parakletos, The Comforter or Consoler of John 14:26 IS the parakletos,. and we are told that it is Jesus Christ Himself. Furthermore, the "Holy Spirit" that is said to come AS the Comforter is also Jesus Christ,

"Now the Lord IS that Spirit: and where the Spirit OF THE Lord [Jesus Christ] is, there is liberty" (II Cor. 3:17).


https://bible-truths.com/lake11.html -------------------------

The giant difference between the physically called of God and the spiritually Chosen of God is that the first are immature babes, and the second are spiritually mature sons—having the mind of Christ. The physical Church knows Christ only "after the flesh." The carnal believe that Jesus Christ was "crucified" for them—which is true. But the mature know by experience that, "I am crucified WITH Christ." The carnal-minded Christians "will be saved," but they will not be in the first resurrection, nor will they reign with Jesus Christ as the manifest sons and daughters of God in the Kingdom of God throughout the oncoming ages.


http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php?topic=5815.0 ------

God is bigger than we ever thought. He’s just so much bigger, so much wiser, so much everything. That’s why it says what it says here.

I Cor. 2:12  Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit which is of God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.
v. 13  These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches…

Well why not? Why not teach us these things in the words of man’s wisdom? What’s wrong with that? That’s not the way it’s done. Paul knew about man’s wisdom, he knew about words, he knew about meanings, he could write a full sentence. He could carry through a thought, like the philosophers or poets and all of that. But notice.

v. 13 …not in words which man's wisdom teaches, but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things (things should not be in there) with spiritual.
v. 14  But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
v. 15  But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one.
v. 16  For "who has known the mind of the LORD that he may instruct Him?" But we have the mind of Christ.

Well we should have the mind of Christ, we are suppose to have the mind of Christ.


https://bible-truths.com/lake13.html ----------------------------

There are three realms spoken of in Revelation: sea, earth, and heaven:

"And the angel which I saw stand upon the SEA and upon the EARTH lifted up his hand to HEAVEN, and swore by Him that lives for ever and ever, [for the eons of the eons], who created HEAVEN, and the things that therein are, and the EARTH, and the things that therein are, and the SEA, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer [no longer a time of delay]" (Rev. 10:5-6).

The angels [messengers] of God communicate things from heaven to both the earth and the sea:

"And the voice which I heard from heaven spoke unto me again, and said, Go and take the little book which is open in the hand of the ANGEL which stands upon the sea and upon the earth" (Rev. 10:08).

There are three realms of humanity and three realms of spiritual understanding. The lowest of all is the sea. Those with at least some spiritual understanding are those who dwell in the earth. And those who have the very mind of Christ are those who dwell in heaven.
v
"For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders; insomuch that, IF IT WERE POSSIBLE, they shall deceive the very elect" (Matt. 24:24).

Ah, but it is NOT POSSIBLE to deceive the very elect!


https://bible-truths.com/email13.htm -----------------------------

[Ray Replies]
Dear Walter:

The level of understanding that I personally possess is not necessarily what your goal should be. You should desire to have the understanding of Jesus Christ.

Now then, is there a "reading list" as you suggest that will give you this understanding? NO.

Will taking courses at a theological seminary (as you suggested) give you this understanding? NO.

Will reading and studying dozens of Bible Dictionaries and Bible Commentaries give you this understanding? NO.

Will reading the Bible ITSELF give you this spiritual understanding. NO.

Well where pray tell does it come from? It comes from the Spirit of God IN US--having the very MIND OF CHRIST IN US.

How do we get that? Repent & OBEY the gospel! "A good understanding have all they that DO His commandments." There are hundreds and hundreds of spiritual commandments in the New Testament Scriptures. You must OBEY those commandments. All of my writing are designed to help people better understand this commandments. That's why God has teachers. I personally try to obey ALL OF GODS SPIRITUAL COMMANDMENTS in the New Testament. I repent of my SINS.  I BEG God for spiritual understanding and spiritual obedience and spiritual LOVE for God and for all humanity.

Do these things ALL day, EVERY day, and God will give you understanding--I GUARANTEE IT!

God be with you,
Ray
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Pini56

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2016, 01:45:36 AM »

Hello Kat,

One Word. Excellent. Well constructed. Easy to understand. Gained a lot from it.
 
For the sake of others on the Forum how do we know that we have indeed received This 'Spirit'.

Love to you and yours. Regards Geoff.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2016, 01:52:49 AM by Geoff »
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Kat

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2016, 03:58:16 PM »


Even thought we cannot know 'for sure' until we have actually endured to the end, Ray did speak of the process we go through in this life. So if you are aware that these things will happen you can know that God's Spirit is working in you. But it's mainly when you 'look behind' from where you have come, you certainly know how carnal you were before and you should recognize the progress of becoming a different/new person.

2Cor 5:17  Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.

http://bible-truths.com/email12.htm#saved -------------------------

[Ray Replies]

"How do we KNOW that we are saved?" Excellent question!  Would you believe that the Scriptures do not answer this specific question?  If they do, I am not aware of such an answer. The problem in answering this question is that you put it in the PAST TENSE--"How do we know that we ARE saved" which, I guess, could be in the past or present tense. Either way, I know of no Scripture that gives such an answer.

Here is what we do read regarding salvation:

"might save" "to save"  "shalt save" "save us" "shall be saved" "such as should be saved" "whereby we must be saved" "we shall be saved" "what must I do to be saved" etc., etc., etc.

And even those few verses that speak of "but unto us which ARE saved...." a closer look at the Greek shows that it is in the aiorist tense and should be translated "...which ARE BEING saved..." as it is not as yet a completed fact or act.

Even Ephesian 2:8 which states: "For by grace ARE you saved through faith...." which is properly translated with the word "are" than "are you being saved" or some other aiorist tense verb, still does not show that anyone is ALREADY saved. The phrase  "ARE saved" is telling us HOW we are saved, not WHEN we are saved. We "are" saved by grace just as people a century into the future also "ARE saved by grace." That's HOW they are saved, not WHEN.

If there were a verse that stated that we or anyone ARE or HAVE BEEN already saved, it would contradict many other Scriptures that show that salvation is an ongoing process.

This verse says it all: 

"But he that shall endure unto the end, the same SHALL BE saved" (Matt. 24:13). 

If this verse be absolutely true, can a statement that contradicts this statement of our Lord ALSO be true? Well, for example, "...he that shall NOT endure unto the end... ALSO be saved?"  See the contradiction?

Jesus says to him that OVERCOMES... seven time in Rev. 2 and 3. If the "overcoming" part is really not necessary, then why is it emphatically stated such SEVEN TIMES?

Is there a reason for not having a verse stating how one can know that they are absolutely SAVED [past tense] at some point in their lives?  I think so. We can NEVER STOP overcoming, striving, pressing on, following after, etc. We can have CONFIDENCE AND HOPE that we will be saved if we continue in our present total devotion to God, but never in this life can we say that we "ARE saved" already, in the past tense.

God has not, however, left us without assurances that we can absolutely bank on, if we follow His admonitions. Here is just one:

"And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; and to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; and to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brother kindness charity [LOVE]. For if these things be in you and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful... give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye DO THESE THINGS, YE SHALL NEVER FALL" (II Pet. 1:5-8 & 10).


 https://bible-truths.com/email3.htm -----------------------------------

[Ray Replies]
I would be happy to give your some Scriptures of encouragement.

When we can see our faults and weaknesses and admit them instead of denying them, we are already on the way to recovery.

Of Course, Jesus is the answer to EVERYTHING. But maybe you have already heard that, but it may not mean that much to you. How does that really work in the real world?

Notice in Matt. 11:20 what Jesus was doing AND WHY HE WAS DOING IT:
"Then began he [Jesus] to UPBRAID [reprove or correct them very sharply] the cities wherein most of his mighty works were done, BECAUSE THEY REPENTED NOT"
That is the very same problem we have all had in our lives, WE DON'T REPENT OF THE THINGS THAT WE KNOW ARE WRONG.  Repent means to see it, acknowledge it, and get rid of it!

When you repent of your sins and evils you automatically feel better and God Himself will give you rest (SPIRITUAL REST) from all your very heavy burdens. A guilty conscience is probably the worst burden that anyone can carry. But you will never, ever, get rid of a guilty conscience until you begin to REPENT and change your ways.

Down a few verses Jesus tells us what will happen if we will REPENT and start to OBEY His commandments:
"Come unto ME, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I WILL GIVE YOU REST! Take My yoke [this means to live your life with all its trials and tribulations, by living it CHRIST'S WAY] upon you, and LEARN OF ME [read your Bible and DO WHAT CHRIST SAYS TO DO and DON'T DO WHAT HE SAYS NOT TO DO]; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and YOU SHALL FIND REST UNTO YOUR SOULS.  For My yoke is easy [it will enable you to overcome the world, because Jesus overcame with world with His humble and meek attitude] and my burden light" (Matt. 11:28-30).

When you find that you're too weak to overcome your sins and faults, IT WILL DRIVE YOU TO YOUR KNEES!  You will call out to God, because you will know in your heart that you do not have the POWER to stop all of your sins. When you cry out to God He will hear, and He will give you strength and power to do what seemed so hard before.

Notice what fruit the Spirit of God will produce in your life:
"But the fruit of the Spirit is LOVE, JOY, PEACE, PATIENCE, GENTLENESS, GOODNESS, FAITH, MEEKNESS, SELF CONTROL: against such there is no law" (Gal. 5:22-23).
We all want these qualities in our lives, but they only come by crucifying our old carnal, selfish selves.  The key is to: REPENT and OBEY. Read Matthew chapters 5, 6, and 7. They are filled with the things we are to do to find peace with God and peace with ourselves.

There are many Scriptures of encouragement, and you will learn them as you read and study God's Word. But you need a starting point and you need it RIGHT NOW!  STOP DOING the obvious wrong things that you are doing and go to God in prayer and ask Him to CLEAN YOU UP!  Trust me, he will answer your prayer.


https://bible-truths.com/lake6.html ----------------------------------------

THE LIFE OF A BELIEVER
Let’s see again just what is involved in living the live of a believer:

1. "For by GRACE are ye saved through FAITH; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: NOT OF WORKS, lest any man should boast. For we are HIS workmanship [Gk: achievement], created in Christ Jesus unto [unto what?] … unto GOOD WORKS, which God has before ordained that we should walk in them" (Eph. 2:10). We are not saved by OUR WORKS, but we are preordained to walk in GOD’S GOOD WORKS, nonetheless.

2. "Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be BORN AGAIN, he cannot see the kingdom of God." (John 3;3). Notice that Eph. 2:10 says that we are "created IN Christ." Something new happens when we are "IN" Christ. There is a NEW birth and there is a NEW creation, "Therefore if any man be IN Christ, he is a NEW CREATURE [Gk: creation]: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new" (II Cor. 5:17). Albeit, this new creation has its perils as we will see in the next verse.

3. "Yea, and ALL that will live godly in Christ Jesus [as a new and different creature] SHALL SUFFER PERSECUTION." (II Tim. 3:12). This is not just a possibility; it is an absolute PROMISE.

4. "Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through MUCH TRIBULATION [pressure, afflictions] enter into the kingdom of God" (Acts 14:22).

5. "For if we would JUDGE OURSELVES, we should not be judged. But when we ARE JUDGED, we are CHASTENED [Greek: paideuo, to train, educate, discipline, punish, chastise, instruct, learn, and teach] of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world [at the great white throne judgment]" (I Cor. 11:31-32).

6. "And you have forgotten the exhortation which speaks unto you as unto children, My Son, despise not you the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of Him. For whom the Lord loves He CHASTENS [Prov. 13:24] AND SCOURGES [see I Pet. 5:9] EVERY SON WHOM HE RECEIVES. But if you be without chastisement, whereof ALL are partakers, then are you ********, and not sons" (Heb. 12:5-8). "Every man’s work shall be made manifest; for the day shall declare it, because it shall be REVEALED BY FIRE; and the fire shall try EVERY MAN’S WORK of what sort it is" (I Cor. 3;13).

7. "Fear NONE of those things which you shall suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that you may be tried; and you shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give you a CROWN OF LIFE" (Rev. 2:10).  "To him that overcomes will I give to eat of the TREE OF LIFE [eternal, immortal life]" (Rev. 2:7), "He that overcomes shall not be hurt of the second death" (Rev. 2:11),  "And he that overcomes, and keeps my works unto the end, to him will I give POWER OVER THE NATIONS" (Rev. 2;26),  "He that overcomes, the same shall be clothed in white raiment [righteousness] and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life [Christ is the book of life] but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels" (Rev. 3:5),  "Him that overcomes will I make a PILLAR [a main and vital support in the very government of Almighty God] IN THE TEMPLE OF MY GOD…" (Rev. 3:12),  "To him that overcomes will I grant to SIT WITH ME IN MY THRONE, even as I also overcame [see John 16:33], and am set down with My Father in His throne" (Rev. 3:21).

There we have a very brief overview of the life of a believer. Is it not obvious that the life of a believer consists of a whole lot more than just "believing" that Jesus is the Christ? God has bigger plans for the human race than just "saving" them. God can "save" chickens, but God doesn’t want chickens for sons! God wants sons that are PERFECT as He is perfect! Wouldn’t you all agree that becoming perfect might just require a whole lot more than singing gospel music once a week? Perfection requires many things that only God can perform in our lives. We are, after all, His workmanship, His achievement. Having ALL OUR WORKS tried in the fire of His Holy Spirit is no small part of becoming perfect.
v
We have works that are like gold and silver in certain ways—we have thoughts, words, and deeds of good and lasting value. We also have carnal and evil works—bad thoughts, crass words, and evil deeds that are of no lasting value and are only fit for destruction. Only God’s SPIRITUAL FIRE can burn away spiritual wickedness and evils of the heart.
v
Since God likens the building of His spiritual temple to the assembling of a physical building, then this process, likewise, requires time and activity. Time and activity is what we call living our lives. Now then, when does judgment begin at the building of this house of God? Answer:

"For the time IS COME that judgment must begin at the house of God…" (I Peter 4:17).

And so it clearly has already begun with the Apostles and New Testament Church nearly two thousand years ago. And it is still going on in the Church of God today, in every believer’s life, as he lives his life.
Therefore, Paul warns:

"But let every man take heed HOW he builds [his building’] thereupon" (I Cor. 3:10).

And so judgment is upon the building of God’s house as each individual believer is framed and fitted for the calling that God has for each individual. This judgment began in the days of the Apostles after the resurrection of our Lord. It continued generation after generation down through the age until today when it yet continues. And it will continue still further until the entire harvest of firstfruits is completed. Remember we already learned that if we would judge ourselves now, Paul said we would not be condemned with the world later (I Cor. 11:32).

It is while we are living and building that our works are being tried and judged BY FIRE according to HOW we are building. What fire? God’s fire. God’s "CONSUMING [spiritual] FIRE"(Heb. 12:29)! God is SPIRIT and likewise His fire is SPIRIT. I have never heard a minister or teacher preach on the good and beneficial side of God’s FIRE. Fire is usually portrayed as bringing about pain, evil, and destruction. Since God is GOOD (Luke 18:19), and God is SPIRIT (John 4:24), and God is INVISIBLE (Col. 1:15), why does the church teach the world that God as a CONSUMING FIRE (Heb. 12:29) is visible and not invisible, literal and not spiritual, and bad rather than good?

"For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones [valuable traits of Godly spiritual character] wood, hay, stubble [carnal traits of no value]; Every man’s work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because IT SHALL BE REVEALED BY FIRE; and the fire shall try every man’s work of what sort it is."

Every thought, every word, and every deed that proceeds out of the heart and mind of man is his "WORKS." And every thought, every word, and every deed of man will come into the judgment of Almighty God’s "CONSUMING FIRE." Notice that it is both our things of great value: "gold, silver, precious stones," and our things of no value: "wood, hay, stubble" that are tried in the fire, God’s Consuming Fire. Every person possesses knowledge, therefore, every person is a combination of both good and evil (for knowledge can only be a combination of both good and evil knowledge).
v
Can we not get it into our heads that GOD IS SPIRIT and that all He is building and creating is SPIRITUAL. We will have SPIRITUAL bodies, we are SPIRITUAL temples, we are to produce SPIRITUAL fruit, we will live in SPIRITUAL Jerusalem, in SPIRITUAL Zion, in SPIRITUAL heaven, as members of a SPIRITUAL kingdom, Headed by a SPIRIT GOD!


http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php?topic=3849.0 --------------

When came around Pentecost time though, a whole bunch of them were converted, about 120 of them. But Christ was leading them up to that. He’s probably leading some of us up to that.

All these things take a lifetime. We’re going to live "the seals." A third part of the man died... that’s a third part of the man in us that is going to die, a third part of the carnality. God works in increments, He wipes out some of the trees and then He burns some of the grass… what is the trees and the grass? These are all things in us. We have islands, and mountains, and trees, and grass. All of these are belief systems and ideas and doctrines and philosophies of life and all these things. They are all going to be burned out and broken down and destroyed. All of those seven seals, seven trumpets, seven plagues, they are all things that must happen in our lives.

You say, 'Well I don’t remember any trees being burned down.' First of all, you won’t even know some of it is happening until it’s over. Some of you will remember, I have this in my Lake of Fire Series: “And I was in the spirit on the Lord’s Day and I heard a voice BEHIND me as the voice of a trumpet and I turned to see the voice that spoke to me and being turned I saw…” You won’t see some of these things until they are behind you. You’re going to have to look behind you to see where you came from, to see where God has been taking you. Some of us wouldn’t want to live tomorrow if we knew what was coming, you know. Be thankful that you don’t know everything that’s coming. Be thankful that you only have to take one day at a time. You don’t want to know what every day has to hold. Take it one day at a time as God presents it to you.

There will come a time, when you can look behind you, as I can, and see where God’s been taking you all these years. You’ll see it plain as day. I could sit here for hours and tell you all about it. I can tell you about trees and grass and mountains coming down, I know what it means. It’s all one, all this stuff. Are you getting it? It’s all one thing. Whether you believe on Christ or enter the door of Christ or call upon the name of Christ or accept His grace through the faith of Christ, it’s all one thing. It’s all Christ coming to you, living His life in you!


http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,4866.0.html ---------

I have stated this very very clearly in my writings: If God has chosen and pre-ordained you to be one of His Chosen Elect Few, THEN YOU WILL BE ONE OF THEM. Period.  Ananias and Sapphira were decidedly NOT two of God's Chosen Elect. They were CALLED, but not chosen, and like all "called" but NOT chosen, they could NOT obey from the heart and be among those in the first resurrection to reign with Jesus.
 
It matters not, Brett, whether we say it is necessary to "do" something or that we "must do" something. The word "must" does not necessarily add to or detract from something that God says will be "DONE."  Example:  Jesus said, "And why call ye Me, Lord, Lord, and DO not the things which I say?" (Luke 6:46).  Now do we see the words "MUST DO" in this verse? NO. 

But can you imagine one of the disciples saying to Jesus: "You mean we MUST do what you say?"  OF COURSE  we "must" do what Jesus says!!  But that does not mean that we "do" what we "MUST do" by our own power and will.

Nothing I have said in Installment 16 contradicts the Scriptures or anything that I have said in any of my other installments.  God KNOWS who is and who isn't one of His chosen elect, but WE DON'T.  That is how God keeps us from becoming spiritually lazy and complacent. It may "appear" that God has "chosen" us for one of His elect, but there is no way of being 100% sure until THE END.
 
This is why, the Greatest Apostle who has ever lived, said that even he could be a "castaway" from the Kingdom of God if he did not daily fight the good fight of faith (I Cor. 9:27).
 

http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,305.0.html ----

    COMMENT:  When sin no longer "has dominion over you," you will know that God's Holy Spirit is operating in you. Not that you will not sin, but sin will not lord it over you; you will no longer be a slave to sin; you will not be fighting sin ever moment of your day; you will be given peace in that area of your life.

God be with you,
Ray
« Last Edit: October 09, 2016, 10:21:42 AM by Kat »
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Pini56

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2016, 10:22:53 PM »

Hello Kat,

Thank you very much. I am sure that everybody will gain some strength from that and I hope will open a few eyes to what it really means to follow Christ.

Love To You And Yours. Regards Geoff.
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Terry

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #13 on: October 08, 2016, 10:24:04 PM »

There will come a time, when you can look behind you, as I can, and see where God’s been taking you all these years. You’ll see it plain as day. I could sit here for hours and tell you all about it. I can tell you about trees and grass and mountains coming down, I know what it means. It’s all one, all this stuff. Are you getting it? It’s all one thing. Whether you believe on Christ or enter the door of Christ or call upon the name of Christ or accept His grace through the faith of Christ, it’s all one thing. It’s all Christ coming to you, living His life in you!



COMMENT:  When sin no longer "has dominion over you," you will know that God's Holy Spirit is operating in you. Not that you will not sin, but sin will not lord it over you; you will no longer be a slave to sin; you will not be fighting sin ever moment of your day; you will be given peace in that area of your life.

God be with you,
Ray
« Last Edit: Today at 05:11:20 PM by Kat »

Thank you Kat for posting your reply it has been very helpful to me, I thought God had been moving so slow in my life but looking back I see he has been doing a lot, there are sins in my life that are gone I don't even think of them anymore, not to say i'm not still struggling with others sins but with the help of God I know i'll over come them. The thing is there was a time I didn't seem to care about the sins I committed but now I despise them and fight daily to stop doing them, I think this fight will last to the day I die and its hard, but theres  a joy in it too, I understand that my flesh must die that Gods Spirit may grow.
I'm so thankful for this site I get fed here every day I get a little more spiritual strength every day and i am so thankful.
Terry
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Terry

Musterseed

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #14 on: November 08, 2016, 10:26:37 AM »

Thankyou all so much. I was up at six this morning , excited to go online and read. I am learning so very much from all of you. I have had a rough couple of years and many changes. I have been looking behind me a lot lately and now understand what it all means. Every day is a struggle but I know it is all for the greater good. Please can you help me understand the feeling of wanting to be a recluse, I seem to not want to be around people much. I feel bad about this. I have to tell you, my home is originally a place called Newfoundland and we still use the word YE as plural for you and many other biblical terms, I noticed this while reading the bible. Also something else I am learning is that Our Lord has a sense of humour. I have never experienced a love so great. AGain Thank you .     Pamela
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cheekie3

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #15 on: November 08, 2016, 11:29:46 AM »

Pamela -

Thankyou all so much. I was up at six this morning , excited to go online and read. I am learning so very much from all of you. I have had a rough couple of years and many changes. I have been looking behind me a lot lately and now understand what it all means. Every day is a struggle but I know it is all for the greater good. Please can you help me understand the feeling of wanting to be a recluse, I seem to not want to be around people much. I feel bad about this. I have to tell you, my home is originally a place called Newfoundland and we still use the word YE as plural for you and many other biblical terms, I noticed this while reading the bible. Also something else I am learning is that Our Lord has a sense of humour. I have never experienced a love so great. AGain Thank you .     Pamela

Jesus was not a recluse, nor were his disciples and apostles.

We are to have the 'Mind of Christ' and renew our mind - which to me, includes, changing the way we think, as well as changing the desires of our heart.

We will all, always, have to be in contact with, and have relationships, with all sorts of people; as well as those that desire to always please Him.

We need to know how to relate to those that currently do not seek to please and love Our Heavenly Father and His Begotten Son.

Only by His Holy Spirit can He direct you on this matter.

We are to live as 'living letters' and not 'Bible bash' anyone - so, if someone asks us a question about Him, we should be able to answer them in a way that they will understand what we are saying - and even then, it is only by His Holy Spirit that they will really understand what you said.

There is a lot of information on BibleTruths.com and on this Forum - and we all know it is impossible to discuss the deep things of Our Heavenly Father with most people - and that is probably why, most of us, learn from each other on this Forum.

Very Kind Regards and Warmest Wishes.

George


 
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indianabob

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #16 on: November 08, 2016, 11:57:51 AM »

Hi Pamela,
Greetings from Indiana to Newfoundland.

Great to hear from ye (?)
Welcome to the forum of better understanding.
Ole, Indiana Bob (Plymouth, IN)
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Pini56

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #17 on: November 11, 2016, 06:05:54 AM »

Hello Pamela,

I totally agree with you, that Jesus does indeed have a sense of humour.

With the recluse thing I truly do understand where you are coming from. I have never been married. I Have been alone most of my life and Jesus is my constant companion. Over the years i have had very severe trials and by this have learned to trust the Lord completely.

From the beginning of my walk, which has been 40 years by the way, I have been immersed in the Game of tenpin bowling. From this I have had many discussions on life in general and just by mentioning the things in which I believe, Lights have been turned on. I do not know the full results of the many discussions I have had but through it all I know that I have influenced many lives. I have travelled all around the Country playing this Game and know that Jesus has used it for his very purposes.

Having said that, I live alone in a one bedroom apartment here on the Gold Coast, Queensland Australia, and yes I do not socialise a lot with the people in the complex. There are reasons but i won't go into them.

Again you are not alone in this thinking, so do not be concerned. Remember Our God is a Jealous God and does require our complete attention. Although it does not mean that you hide yourself away. We must go into this World as 'Shining Lights' and be prepared to give an answer to the hope that is in us.

Find an interest that means being involved with people with the purpose of being a 'Shining Light' and i am positive that Jesus will bless you in your undertaking in ways you never thought were possible. Believe me there will be many trials, but by this you will learn to trust the Lord with all your heart.

You can count on it. Love to you and yours. Regards, Geoff.

« Last Edit: November 11, 2016, 06:21:42 PM by Geoff »
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Musterseed

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #18 on: November 11, 2016, 12:59:13 PM »

Thanks Geoff
I appreciate all advise, all your experiences, and to know that I have a place on this forum to learn. I have always loved to read and gain knowledge ever since I was a kid. This past summer , God inspired me to buy a little camper and go back to the Place I was born. My husband and I travelled for three weeks camping in Newfoundland, meeting people from all over the world doing the same thing and visiting family and friends. With my renewed mind I was able to see more clear and desern which people I wanted to be around. I was sad to see many of my old friends in turmoil, health issues, money problems, judging each other, hatred, self pity, and getting saved with the eleven second prayer, most were still in Mystry Babylon. IT broke my heart, even my own sisters and brother. I realized that they were still in the prison that I was in and all I could do was Love them, and be kind in my words. As for having the mind of Christ, I believe it comes a little here and a little there for me, slow and steady and I submit, meditate on it with The Lords Help. Thank you for reassuring me Geoff, I pray and love all of you here. .
For of Him,and through Him and to Him are ALL things, to whom be Glory forever. Amen Rom. 11:36. Australia eh, well then G-day mate
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Dave in Tenn

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Re: The Mind Of Christ.
« Reply #19 on: November 11, 2016, 04:08:25 PM »

Hi Pamela, don't overburden yourself on this score.  Jesus socialized AND He went off by Himself.  He was a man of sorrows, acquainted with Grief AND he was full of Holy Spirit, the fruit of which is Joy.  No matter what you are feeling, it's very easy to "follow Him" in this regard.  There is a time and a place for every purpose under the heavens.   Since He's calling all men everywhere to 'repent', I believe He wants the 'extrovert' to experience more introspection, and the 'introvert' to experience more sociability.  He'll take you from where you are to where He wants you.  Don't worry about anything.   
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Heb 10:32  But you must continue to remember those earlier days, how after you were enlightened you endured a hard and painful struggle.
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