Hebrews 8:8-12

[cheekie3]

Hebrews 8:8-12J.B. Phillips New Testament (PHILLIPS)

8-12 Actually, however, God does show himself dissatisfied for he says to those under the first agreement: 'Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah—not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they did not continue in my covenant, and I disregarded them, says the Lord. For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel: After those days, says the Lord, I will put my laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. None of them shall teach his neighbour, and none his brother, saying, Know the Lord, for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest of them. For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more'.

[cheekie3]

Jeremiah 31:31-34 Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
32 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:
33 but this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

[Mickiel]

For everyone to know God, will be a wonderful unique thing to behold. I would like to know God, I think that would be quite something. In Job 23:13 it explains that God is of one mind and then asks " Who can turn him?" It says what his soul desires, " That he does!" In 1 Tim. 2:2 it explains that he desires all humans to be saved. Its just stunning to think about all being saved. A most merciful development.

[cheekie3]

Mickiel -

Hi, and thanks for sharing this with us:

For everyone to know God, will be a wonderful unique thing to behold. I would like to know God, I think that would be quite something. In Job 23:13 it explains that God is of one mind and then asks " Who can turn him?" It says what his soul desires, " That he does!" In 1 Tim. 2:2 it explains that he desires all humans to be saved. Its just stunning to think about all being saved. A most merciful development.

I recollect the first time I heard that 'He will not save everyone'; and my thoughts were 'how can He Give Life and then destroy that Life?'.

Warmest Regards.

George

[Mickiel]

Greetings,

Yes the mentality of God is amazing, those parts of it that we can see. He definitely has universal intentions for humanity and we are given windows to it, in another example, in Isaiah 66:9 God asks an interest question with definite universal intention; " Shall I bring to the birth , and not cause to bring forth? Says the Lord; shall I cause to bring forth, and shut the womb? says your God!" In my view, this suggest that God will not allow any human to be lost. I mean its how I see it. It like God is saying, in paraphrase; " You think I would create all these humans, only to let some of them die and somehow loose their eternity with me!"

In Isaiah 49:15 this suggestion continues, " Can a woman forget her sucking, that she should not have compassion on the son of her womb? Yes they may forget, yet I will not forget you."  Human salvation is important to God. For his own reason , Isaiah 48:11.

I think its interesting that God also relates the " Suffering syndrome in humanity." Isaiah 48:10, " Behold, I have refined you, but not with silver, I have chosen you in the" furnace of Affliction!" The furnace of affliction , my goodness that describes the road of a human being opened to this reasoning of God and being shown a definite hardship in their lives. Just makes you think.

Peace.

[cheekie3]

Mickiel -

Thank you for sharing this:

Greetings,

Yes the mentality of God is amazing, those parts of it that we can see. He definitely has universal intentions for humanity and we are given windows to it, in another example, in Isaiah 66:9 God asks an interest question with definite universal intention; " Shall I bring to the birth , and not cause to bring forth? Says the Lord; shall I cause to bring forth, and shut the womb? says your God!" In my view, this suggest that God will not allow any human to be lost. I mean its how I see it. It like God is saying, in paraphrase; " You think I would create all these humans, only to let some of them die and somehow loose their eternity with me!"

In Isaiah 49:15 this suggestion continues, " Can a woman forget her sucking, that she should not have compassion on the son of her womb? Yes they may forget, yet I will not forget you."  Human salvation is important to God. For his own reason , Isaiah 48:11.

I think its interesting that God also relates the " Suffering syndrome in humanity." Isaiah 48:10, " Behold, I have refined you, but not with silver, I have chosen you in the" furnace of Affliction!" The furnace of affliction , my goodness that describes the road of a human being opened to this reasoning of God and being shown a definite hardship in their lives. Just makes you think.

Peace.

I most certainly have the been through 'His Fiery Furnace' and 'been consumed by His Fire'; so I do hope that He has indeed refined me like silver and purified me in the many, many, many trials he has put me through - even though I wanted to die and give up on numerous occasions, He did not let me sit down, or go backwards - but dragged me through each ordeal through pain and suffering.

I am convinced that He has no shortcuts and that He makes our lives extremely hard many times; but what He has determined we will do, He will ensure we do it.

I still struggle with the concept of war, and those who deliberately harm others - as from my life's experience, I have observed that most of mankind want to be left alone in peace, to live their lives in peace - yet, there are those who willingly and deliberately choose to 'do harm to others'; and some even classify some of mankind as 'cattle' or 'animals' - to be used and killed.

Perhaps, it is to do with the original two seeds of 'Cain' and 'Abel', in that, 'Cain' instead of doing what was right before the Most High, decided instead to kill his brother Abel -even though Cain knew full well that the Most High would punish him for shedding the blood of his innocent younger brother?

Warmest Regards.

George

[Mickiel]

Mickiel -

Thank you for sharing this:

Greetings,

Yes the mentality of God is amazing, those parts of it that we can see. He definitely has universal intentions for humanity and we are given windows to it, in another example, in Isaiah 66:9 God asks an interest question with definite universal intention; " Shall I bring to the birth , and not cause to bring forth? Says the Lord; shall I cause to bring forth, and shut the womb? says your God!" In my view, this suggest that God will not allow any human to be lost. I mean its how I see it. It like God is saying, in paraphrase; " You think I would create all these humans, only to let some of them die and somehow loose their eternity with me!"

In Isaiah 49:15 this suggestion continues, " Can a woman forget her sucking, that she should not have compassion on the son of her womb? Yes they may forget, yet I will not forget you."  Human salvation is important to God. For his own reason , Isaiah 48:11.

I think its interesting that God also relates the " Suffering syndrome in humanity." Isaiah 48:10, " Behold, I have refined you, but not with silver, I have chosen you in the" furnace of Affliction!" The furnace of affliction , my goodness that describes the road of a human being opened to this reasoning of God and being shown a definite hardship in their lives. Just makes you think.

Peace.

I most certainly have the been through 'His Fiery Furnace' and 'been consumed by His Fire'; so I do hope that He has indeed refined me like silver and purified me in the many, many, many trials he has put me through - even though I wanted to die and give up on numerous occasions, He did not let me sit down, or go backwards - but dragged me through each ordeal through pain and suffering.

I am convinced that He has no shortcuts and that He makes our lives extremely hard many times; but what He has determined we will do, He will ensure we do it.

I still struggle with the concept of war, and those who deliberately harm others - as from my life's experience, I have observed that most of mankind want to be left alone in peace, to live their lives in peace - yet, there are those who willingly and deliberately choose to 'do harm to others'; and some even classify some of mankind as 'cattle' or 'animals' - to be used and killed.

Perhaps, it is to do with the original two seeds of 'Cain' and 'Abel', in that, 'Cain' instead of doing what was right before the Most High, decided instead to kill his brother Abel -even though Cain knew full well that the Most High would punish him for shedding the blood of his innocent younger brother?

Warmest Regards.

George

Yes it has to do with Cain and Abel , or Adam and Eve;  somewhere in there sin was introduced and struggling  and suffering became our reality, seemed to just naturally flow into the world after that tree was planted .I too have been burned in that fire and I don't like the concept of war either. We kill people, then get put in jail for killing people, then get killed in jail for killing others. The world can be a revolting development.

[John from Kentucky]

There is no free will.  God created evil.

The Scriptures say, "There is none good, no not one" and "All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God."

Since none are good, it follows God intended for all to sin because God is sovereign and nothing goes against His will.

Mankind sins because unseen forces compel mankind to sin.  We do not freely decide to do good or evil.  Mankind was created flawed.

Judas did not freely choose to betray Jesus.  Peter did not freely choose to deny Jesus.  All the Apostles did not freely choose to be cowards and abandon Jesus.  They did what they were compelled to do.

And many here among us do not freely choose to be ignorant and not understand the above truths, which are plainly taught in the Scriptures and in articles on this website.  You are compelled by forces you do not know or understand to follow the teachings of the great false church.

[Mickiel]

There is no free will.  God created evil.

The Scriptures say, "There is none good, no not one" and "All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God."

Since none are good, it follows God intended for all to sin because God is sovereign and nothing goes against His will.

Mankind sins because unseen forces compel mankind to sin.  We do not freely decide to do good or evil.  Mankind was created flawed.

Judas did not freely choose to betray Jesus.  Peter did not freely choose to deny Jesus.  All the Apostles did not freely choose to be cowards and abandon Jesus.  They did what they were compelled to do.

And many here among us do not freely choose to be ignorant and not understand the above truths, which are plainly taught in the Scriptures and in articles on this website.  You are compelled by forces you do not know or understand to follow the teachings of the great false church.

So for those of us who are ignorant, do you have any extra smart pills that we can take?

[Musterseed]

I totally agree John. We are created as weak minded carnal beasts to be tamed. I don't know why
God did it this way, I just know it is the best way for His Master Plan.
The Apostles did not freely choose to be Apostles.  They were just doing their everyday work when Jesus walked by and said " Follow me" , He didn't give them an application to fill out and they didn't even question Him , they just dropped everything and by a supernatural compelling force, they followed, they wanted to follow, they wanted to Love Him. He compels us , He is in control of everything and It is so comforting to know this because the world is headed exactly where He wants it to go. Like Ray said" The world will be in turmoil when Jesus comes "and I can't wait for
every knee to bow to Him and know that He is God. If God wanted the world to believe in Him right now, it would, but He doesn't. That day is coming though and I say " Come Lord Jesus
My kids profess to be atheists, however they believe in the false doctrine of free will without even knowing its of the great false church teaching. Our Lord God is awesome. You are right John, if I am meant to be ignorant about some things, it is in the plan. All is of God. Amen...... God Bless You my friend,,,,, Pamela

[John from Kentucky]

There is no free will.  God created evil.

The Scriptures say, "There is none good, no not one" and "All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God."

Since none are good, it follows God intended for all to sin because God is sovereign and nothing goes against His will.

Mankind sins because unseen forces compel mankind to sin.  We do not freely decide to do good or evil.  Mankind was created flawed.

Judas did not freely choose to betray Jesus.  Peter did not freely choose to deny Jesus.  All the Apostles did not freely choose to be cowards and abandon Jesus.  They did what they were compelled to do.

And many here among us do not freely choose to be ignorant and not understand the above truths, which are plainly taught in the Scriptures and in articles on this website.  You are compelled by forces you do not know or understand to follow the teachings of the great false church.

So for those of us who are ignorant, do you have any extra smart pills that we can take?

Only Jesus saves.  Only Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life.  Only Jesus reveals the Father.

Mankind is dust.  If you lack wisdom and knowledge, pray to God.  He will not abandon those who tremble at His words and are of a humble heart.  Not the fake humility of the Christian Church.  Every Christian I know first tells you how humble they are, then tells you how good they are by the good works they do.

"Not by might, nor by power, but by My Spirit says the LORD God Almighty."

[John from Kentucky]

I totally agree John. We are created as weak minded carnal beasts to be tamed. I don't know why
God did it this way, I just know it is the best way for His Master Plan.
The Apostles did not freely choose to be Apostles.  They were just doing their everyday work when Jesus walked by and said " Follow me" , He didn't give them an application to fill out and they didn't even question Him , they just dropped everything and by a supernatural compelling force, they followed, they wanted to follow, they wanted to Love Him. He compels us , He is in control of everything and It is so comforting to know this because the world is headed exactly where He wants it to go. Like Ray said" The world will be in turmoil when Jesus comes "and I can't wait for
every knee to bow to Him and know that He is God. If God wanted the world to believe in Him right now, it would, but He doesn't. That day is coming though and I say " Come Lord Jesus
My kids profess to be atheists, however they believe in the false doctrine of free will without even knowing its of the great false church teaching. Our Lord God is awesome. You are right John, if I am meant to be ignorant about some things, it is in the plan. All is of God. Amen...... God Bless You my friend,,,,, Pamela

Right on, right on, right on.  Flow, Spirit, Flow.

[Mickiel]

There is no free will.  God created evil.

The Scriptures say, "There is none good, no not one" and "All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God."

Since none are good, it follows God intended for all to sin because God is sovereign and nothing goes against His will.

Mankind sins because unseen forces compel mankind to sin.  We do not freely decide to do good or evil.  Mankind was created flawed.

Judas did not freely choose to betray Jesus.  Peter did not freely choose to deny Jesus.  All the Apostles did not freely choose to be cowards and abandon Jesus.  They did what they were compelled to do.

And many here among us do not freely choose to be ignorant and not understand the above truths, which are plainly taught in the Scriptures and in articles on this website.  You are compelled by forces you do not know or understand to follow the teachings of the great false church.

So for those of us who are ignorant, do you have any extra smart pills that we can take?

Ignorance of God may be a weakness, but God is calling the weak of the world. The New Covenant is being made with the ignorant of God. I don't think God calls humans because they are wise or smart or have some trumped up knowledge. Or are in a special group.

I don't know why God calls the people he does; I guess that is just another area I am ignorant in.

[Dennis Vogel]

1Co 1:26  For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

1Co 1:27  But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

1Co 1:28  And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:

1Co 1:29  That no flesh should glory in his presence.

[Mickiel]

An interesting drama is to consider God and why he does things, or even why he does not do things. In 1 Corinth. 2:16 , " For who has known the mind of the Lord?" And I really  think that is not an easy thing to consider, even considering just why God has called you , if he has. In verse 26, " For " You "See" your calling;". Hey, just how do you see your calling. You know, just how is it affecting your conscious outlook about yourself? You know, do you step on a platform and now see others from a higher point of view? Oh so now God has called a weak,  low based conscious individual who people once despised, only to change their conscious outlook on others to an elevated point of view in some reward show that uses knowledge as a way of determining what a new race of God would be like? Oh so now that kind of elevated awareness can glory in God's presence? And actually tell others to their face why you think they have not been called? My goodness, does the calling of God actually cause that? Why would God do something like that to you?

You know if you been called, then you should be an example of what God would do to the mind of a human and their consciousness. Our consciousness is the governor of our behavior. Hey, we can only be conscious of, those things we are conscious of. In my view, if you allow me to give it, even those who have been called must be careful how they HANDLE the calling;  I mean if a person has been called by God, I think that would be quite something. I mean people just don't know God. In Job 36:26, " Behold, God is great and we know him not!"

God is different, and his affect on the human consciousness is just different. In Job 37:5 it says God does Great things which we cannot comprehend. Which means we are not conscious of those things. Look, the calling of God is just a beginning of a very long journey and we have not arrived, and can't speak as if we have. We have not even been changed from this flesh, we are still affected by outside sources. Its like getting a get out of jail card free, but your still living in the cell. Its then reduced to a conscious thing only. So the calling of God is an invasion into the consciousness first, and that is a real shock, even more than a culture shock. But why God has done this to you, is unknown. If you think not, then explain to me why God called you.

And if you cannot explain why God has called you, then you certainly have absolutely no business trying to explain why he has not called anyone. The calling of God is just a matter of time, NOT anything else.

[lareli]

Isnt it not true to say that nothing goes against Gods will, as was stated in this thread? Nothing goes against His intention.. but His intention is that we, for a time, go against His will.

[Mickiel]

Hi Mickiel! I've enjoyed your observations here. Very interesting about the individual perceptions of the 'calling'. Every person who is, or claims to be, a follower of Jesus (or any other god for that matter), is initially enlightened while still encumbered with a fleshly, unrenewed mind. It takes a while, for some of us (me  ) a very long while, to renew the mind and learn some of the ways of God. So... it's not unusual that the 'newly born' called-one could perceive himself or herself in a now-elevated position with relation to the rest of mankind, among lower, 'ignorant' beings. But then God undertakes to dethrone that 'beast' in a painful process. Ray has some amazing takes on this 'beast'. (If you haven't, read the Lake of Fire series, several times.)

Indeed, in EVERY group of 'called saints' I've ever encountered, no matter the persuasion, some called, mature, enlightened (non-ignorant), appointed-by-God Special Agents (I'm speaking of the self-perceptions you've alluded to) stand vigilant, every ready to immediately correct the ignorant (in love of course) and make sure the ignorant knows and feels that he or she IS indeed ignorant. I've been one of them. And in many cases these mature saints, filled with Christ's love and knowledge, are the first to fling an extremely rude, judgmental, self-serving, demeaning, possibly irrelevant reply into just about any attempt of social intercourse among curious people, all the while congratulating himself or herself on the service to God and man being performed. Nobody is going to convince this apostle that he or she is in reality just one more annoying obstacle that everyone has to overcome within the ecclesia. They are here to correct the ignorant and fight for 'The Truth'!

We'd all do well to recognize this tendency, in others and especially within ourselves, since we ALL have it to some degree. We all have the same nature that we have to overcome. Thanks for bringing it up before me to consider.

Gal 6:3  For if anyone thinks to be something, he deceives himself, being nothing.

1Th 2:7  But we became gentle in your midst, as a nurse should be cherishing her own children."

1Co 13:4  Love is patient, is kind. Love is not jealous. Love is not bragging, is not puffed up,
1Co 13:5  is not indecent, is not self-seeking, is not incensed, is not taking account of evil,
1Co 13:6  is not rejoicing in injustice, yet is rejoicing together with the truth,
1Co 13:7  is forgoing all, is believing all, is expecting all, is enduring all."

Don't be offended about being 'ignorant'. We're ALL ignorant of many things. And we ALL 'know' things to be 'right' that will eventually be found to be, in fact, not right at all. If we can learn to listen carefully to others' thoughts, opinions, and/or just musings about just about anything, we're more likely to be open to learning, if not truth, then at least how to bear with one another in love and respect. Even a misguided rebuke or 'correction' can help correct me IF I hear it in the right attitude, without feeling the necessity to retaliate against a perceived attack or insult. Then I can be at peace with pretty much anybody, eh?

However, we should all feel free to voice our thoughts and wonderings among one another without fear of being slapped around and censured by the eldership.

Thanks to Cheekie for posting the beautiful Scripture telling of the New Covenant. Nothing to quibble over there since God is going to work out the details regardless of our understanding of it. Just Words to give us Faith and Hope in the Love of God.

Well I understand, believe me I do. I guess I just take issue with a called person suggesting to others that they don't understand God because they are ignorant; I mean I just don't like that. Forgive my taking issue with it if it offends, that is not my intent. Even if its true, I don't think its a way to speak to visitors or those who do not understand God. Because I have discovered that one can be called of God, be influenced by Christ being " With them", and yet still be ignorant of many , many spiritual and biblical things. What God and Christ are doing with humanity is nothing short of amazing, and his calling is a miracle. Notice then Jesus in Luke 5:32, " I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance." So if a person has been called, then biblically, according to Christ, two things are obvious, they are not righteous and they are a sinner,  these are the two revealed reasons WHY God calls people. There are no other reasons revealed as to why God chooses an individual, none that I am aware of. Other than those two, we just don't know.

There is no pride in those two reasons, and I think that was the intent of God, knowing just what his calling can do to a persons ego, he instructed Christ to teach that. Sinners to repentance is NOT just limited to those called by God, in Acts 17:30 it says" At times of ignorance God winks at that,  but now he has commanded that ALL men everywhere repent", everywhere in history and life. Who did God command this to? ALL Men, so the calling of God is just a matter of time, his commandment was " Now", but obviously all have not repented now, because its just not their time. Their sin and ignorance means absolutely nothing to God. We talk about being " Dragged" to God, or drawn, Jesus said in John 12:32 that if he be lifted up he will draw all men to him. Well he got lifted up, but its obvious that not all men got drawn to him. So his prophecy is then just a matter of time. It will come true. In Isaiah 45:23 God swore his only holy oath in scripture to make sure that the prophecy will be true. And nothing can stop all men being called of God. Its just a wonderful thing to be aware of. And that awareness should filter how we have speaks with those not yet called.

[StevenL]

Isnt it not true to say that nothing goes against Gods will, as was stated in this thread? Nothing goes against His intention.. but His intention is that we, for a time, go against His will.

Ray said that EVERY human has gone against God's will and was caused by God to do so. I read that just recently.

[StevenL]

"One last thought for you. God DID create men spiritually weak so that they cannot resist sin. "ALL have sinned..."It obviously IS God's will that for a time we go AGAINST His will. But. . .BUT, NO ONE EVER goes against God's "INTENTION." There is a giant difference. Paul's detractors ask in Roman's nine, "For who has gone against God's INTENTION?" And the answer is, absolutely NO ONE. It could not even BE God's will that all be saved, unless first ALL ARE LOST!"  **** From email entitled "What did God 'Will' for Adam and Eve"


"So the question that Paul is setting up is not "...who has resisted His will?" but rather, "who has resisted His purpose [His plan, His intention]?"

To the question, "...who has resisted His will?" the answer is: EVERYONE! But when properly translated, to the question, "who has resisted His purpose?" the answer is: ABSOLUTELY NO ONE!"  ****  from Lake of Fire part 15A

[Mickiel]

I wasn't offended in the least Mickiel. But it seemed that you were somewhat offended and my post was a (probably ignorant) attempt at peacemaking.     Your offense is completely understandable and your objection has a sound basis. I've had the same and passed it off as not worth the strife to address.

God bless.

Well thank you, I am at peace. It was in my heart to speak on it, and I too could hardly hold my peace. The New Covenant that Cheekie posted on has a promise from God to " Write his laws in the hearts of people";  or literally place some of his ways within them. Well what does that mean? Does it mean the over 600 laws of Moses? Is the Kingdom of God then to be a place governed by the law of Moses? No, in Gal.5:22-23 THESE are the ways and means of God, these are what are being placed in the hearts of those affected. Love, Joy, Peace, Longsuffering, Gentleness, Goodness, Faith, Meekness and Temperance. These are how God really is, its the best scriptures in the bible that describe him. These are the ways of God, its how God really, really is! God is Gentle and Meek, a very loving and patient being. He is VERY Good and at perfect peace. These ways and means are how God decides things, everything he does is entirely based on these ways and means. These are what rules his Kingdom, God has no laws in heaven. In verse 23, " Meekness, Temperance, against such things " There is no law!." These are the things that rule the Kingdom of God, and there are no laws to govern them, they ARE the way to live. When everyone lives like that, no laws are needed.

And its just a marvel that God will place these superior ways into the very consciousness, ( or heart), of a human being. These ways ARE how we recognize a true believer, NOT their knowledge. These incredible ways are how I know I have a very long way to go, before I say I am chosen of God. Oh I am called for sure, but I have not advanced beyond that. My own behavior reveals to me where I am. As you can see, I can be disagreeing.

Anyhow, peace on your journey.