> General Discussions
Who are the Real Hebrew Israelites today
AwesomeSavior:
Hi Dave, and to everyone else:
"I'd want to know first who was making that claim"
1) I have been personally observing this phenomenon for the past 3 years by carefully watching the news from Israel. Until recently this mostly involved the organization called "The Quartet", which is comprised of The United Nations, America, Russia, and The European Union. It's very easy to do. The thing you have to do is watch whenever someone who represents the American government (The President or any of his representatives) makes a serious push for the nation of Israel to give up more land to the "Palestinians" (Philistines), OR if they harshly criticize Israel for their God Given Land (Genesis 15:18). I mark the date on my calendar for when any meeting is scheduled for this "peace" process, and IF PROGRESS towards giving up land is made or attempted to be made, God responds. His response depends on the EFFORTS made by America, and also Europe.
2) I first learned of this phenomenon from the books called "The Israel Omen" and "The Israel Omen II", by David Brennan. I decided to test his theory out by observing, for myself, whether this phenomenon is true. For the past 3 years, I have observed 12 such events, on my own watch. Here is the list, and I hope you all don't mind a really long post replete with examples, but since people have rightly wanted more information on this topic...
a) The Quartet met on September 30th, 2015. The next day, Hurricane Joaquin strengthened from a Cat. 2 to a Cat. 4. Although it never made landfall in the U.S., another large storm system over the southeast drew tremendous moisture from the hurricane, resulting in catastrophic 1 in 1000 year flooding in South Carolina, and resulted in 19 deaths (Wikipedia).
b) Hurricane Patricia caused severe flooding in southern Texas on October 24-25 of 2015. The mideast "Quartet" met on October 23rd in Vienna "to coordinate messages, and to pass a STRONG MESSAGE to the parties to calm down the situation on the ground".
c) On Friday June 3rd 2016, the same day that an international conference of the French initiative to FORCE peace talks on Israel occurred in Paris, floodwaters in Paris reached peak levels in what was declared a natural disaster. The Louvre museum was closed as staff hurriedly moved artworks out of the flood path. Secretary of State John Kerry also attended this conference. And severe thunderstorms drenched southeast Texas leading to flash flooding, forcing Governor Greg Abbott to declare a state of disaster for 31 counties. 5 Fort Hood soldiers died as floodwaters overturned their army truck.
d) On August 31st 2016, the Obama administration issued a FIRM REBUKE to Israel for approving 463 housing units in Samaria, CONDEMNING the move and warning that Israel risked undermining "the prospects for a two-state solution". Two days later, Hurricane Hermine made landfall in Florida on September 2nd 2016, with total economic losses across the United States reaching US $550 million (Wikipedia).
e) On Friday September 23rd 2016, the Mideast "Quartet" blasted Israeli "settlements" and claimed they are an obstacle towards peace, emphasizing it's "strong opposition" to construction in Judea and Samaria. Meanwhile, deadly midwest flooding occurred in Wisconsin. "In my 33 years in Vernon County law enforcement, this is the worst I've ever seen," Sheriff John Spears told the AP while surveying flood damage in Victory. "This has been devastating." Minnesota and Iowa also experienced major flooding.
f) On Wednesday October 5th 2016, State Department spokesman Mark Toner issued a SHARP CONDEMNATION of Israel over their approval of construction of homes on state owned land in Shilo for Israelis who were evicted from the community of Amona. Mark Toner called it "another step towards cementing a one state reality of perpetual occupation". (As an aside, the Lord told Abram in Genesis 15:18 that his natural descendants would be given the land from the Nile to the Euphrates rivers). And what happened? Hurricane Matthew happened. In total, the storm killed 47 people in the US, including 26 in North Carolina, 12 in Florida, 3 in Georgia, 4 in South Carolina, and 2 in Virginia.[118][119][120][121] According to the National Centers for Environmental Information, damage from Matthew across the United States reached approximately $10 billion. This ranked it the costliest national disaster in the country for 2016 alongside record floods in Louisiana.[122] (Wikipedia).
g) On Friday October 14th 2016, The United States criticized Israeli policies in Judea and Samaria during a UN Security Council discussion. The meeting was entitled "Illegal Israeli Settlements: Obstacles to Peace and the Two-State Solution". The U.S. representative to the session, Deputy U.S. Ambassador to the UN David Pressman, said Washington is "deeply concerned and STRONGLY OPPOSES settlements which are corrosive to peace". The next day, October 15th 2016, a powerful storm system hit the Pacific Northwest, bringing down trees and power lines, leaving tens of thousands without power, after the remnants of a TYPHOON hit the area. Two rare tornados tore through Tillamook County, Oregon.
h) On May 4th 2017, Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu said that he "looks forward to discussing with President Trump the best ways to advance peace. This is something we fervently share with the president", after Trump met with PA Chairman Mahmoud Abbas, who lyingly said that "the Palestinians teach their children peace". Donald Trump has made it clear he wants a peace deal done. On that same day, historic flooding begins in Missouri, Arkansas, and Illinois, leading to 10 deaths over the next several days.
i) On June 21st 2017, Prime Minister Netanyahu met with President Donald Trump's son-in-law Jared Kushner, Middle East envoy Jason Greenblatt, and US Ambassador to Israel David Friedman to discuss the peace process with the Palestinian Authority. On June 22nd, Tropical Storm Cindy made landfall in Louisiana and Texas, leading to 2 deaths and the usual flooding outages and trees down. It also affected Alabama and Tennessee.
j) On July 13th 2017, the Mideast Quartet met with US special envoy Jason Greenblatt. That same day, storms pummelled the Midwest and Northeast with rain, triggering widespread flash flooding from Indiana, Ohio, Michigan, New York, and into Massachusetts.
And now, for the most dramatic examples of God's anger (just lately) towards this phony peace process:
k) On Thursday August 24th 2017, President Trump praised Prime Minister Netanyahu following a meeting between the Prime Minister and Trump's son-in-law and senior advisor, Jared Kushner. "Thank you Prime Minister and Jared," Trump wrote via Instagram. "Let's advance #Peace, #Prosperity, and #Security in the area." (As an aside, you might want to look at 1 Thessalonians 5:3, which states that when they shall say Peace Safety (or Security), then cometh sudden destruction, like labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they shall not escape). The very next day, Hurricane Harvey made landfall in Texas, with never before seen 4 feet of rainfall in some areas of Texas, and leaving Houston devastated.
l) On September 7th 2017, President Trump called a potential two-state solution "the world's most complex and difficult deal," but expressed hope for peace in the region and said that "we are working" on a solution to the Israel-Palestinian conflict. On September 10th, Hurricane Irma made landfall in Florida, devastating the Florida Keys, and causing 50 deaths and 50 billion dollars in damages (Wikipedia)
In conclusion, this phenomenon has been well observed and documented since 1991, beginning with "The Perfect Storm". Some of the more notable examples include Hurricane Katrina in 2005, which formed after the last Jews were forcibly evacuated from The Gaza Strip, as well as Hurricane Andrew in 1992, and so many other examples too numerous to mention.
To me, it's exciting to be able to visibly watch God at work in this world, and to know that the Lord Jesus' return is getting closer.
cheekie3:
Dave -
Regarding your questions about the terms 'Hebrew Israelites':
--- Quote from: Dave in Tenn on September 23, 2017, 09:11:19 PM ---Among other things, that assumes God sends "historically bad weather to America whenever a serious push is made by the American government to "part His land" (Joel 3:2), in this ongoing "peace deal" between them and the arabs".
I'd want to know first who was making that claim.
I don't believe Ray said that none of the Jews in Israel are physical "Jews" descended from the original tribes, only that some of them may not be. Correct me if I'm wrong about what Ray said.
Please pardon me one further ignorance. I'm not familiar with the term "Hebrew Israelites" and why there should be "real" ones and (presumably) "not real" ones. Can someone explain that please? "Real" HEBREW Israelites? Real Hebrew ISRAELITES? Or is the the combination of both that may or may not be real?
--- End quote ---
Unless I am mistaken, the following (KJV) New Testament Scriptures, especially 2 Corinthians 11:22, indicate that the natural descendants of Abraham / Isaac / Jacob, are referenced as either 'Hebrews' or 'Israelites' or both; and Jesus spoke to Saul in the Hebrew Language:
Acts 6:1
And in those days, when the number of the disciples was multiplied, there arose a murmuring of the Grecians against the Hebrews, because their widows were neglected in the daily ministration.
Acts 26:14
And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.
2 Corinthians 11:22
Are they Hebrews? so am I. Are they Israelites? so am I. Are they the seed of Abraham? so am I
Philippians 3:5
circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
Hebrews 13:25
Grace be with you all. Amen. Written to the Hebrews from Italy by Timothy.
Romans 9:4
who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;
Perhaps I should have used the term 'Hebrews / Israelites'?
Regarding what Ray said about the State of modern Israel - I recollect that Ray said something like 'and I do not mean those in the State of Israel', when he was referring to modern day 'Hebrews' / 'Israelites'.
I understand that Ethiopians are all non-white, or mostly non-white; and I understand that some Ethiopians are now living in the modern State of Israel.
Regarding the recent tragic weather that has wiped out a lot of homes, crops, etc, and caused devastation - I understand that there are at least two schools of thought about this:
1. They are all 'Acts of God'.
2. There are weather weapons around that can manipulate weather, and pinpoint where the damage is to be done.
I know that Our Heavenly Father is Sovereign, and He is responsible for all things - but He made mankind accountable for all that they do.
As far as I am aware, The Old Testament Scriptures and The New Testament Scriptures do not confirm that the formation of the modern State of Israel is in the 'Prophecies' spoken by the Hebrew / Israelite Prophets.
I thought Ray taught that the 'Hebrews / Israelites' are scattered all over the Earth; and that in this current Age of His Grace, a remnant of the 'Hebrews / Israelites' will be saved.
Warmest Regards.
George
Dave in Tenn:
Ya'll are talking over my pay-grade.
Let's at least make THIS effort. Instead of bringing up something we think Ray may have said, locate the article or transcript and bring it to the forum. Frankly, I don't recall Ray making any statement that led me to a broad conclusion about whether the Jews in the State of Israel were (mostly) not genuine physical Hebrews/Jews/Israelites. I recall very vividly that he taught as Paul did that "physical Israel" is not the True Circumcision, except for a few.
I've misquoted and/or misunderstood Ray myself on occasions, so I know it can be done. It IS asking a lot, I know...but how else are we going to follow the purpose of the forum?
"At least two schools of thought" about the storms is an understatement.
Somehow I knew there was a book or two behind the other thoughts, though there are so many books, I can't follow them all.
John from Kentucky:
I fully agree with Dave.
When I see these long threads discussing physical Jews and Israel, I start looking for some spiritual gun to shoot myself in the head. Soooooo boring.
We need to come out of false teachings.
None of the Old Testament figures and the physical Hebrews, Israelites, Jews are all that important. David was a murderer, filled with hate, and the last word out of his mouth was blood. John the Baptist was the greatest of them all, but Jesus said the least in the Kingdom of God would be greater than the Baptist. There is a Scripture that tells us the OT things are there only for examples for the Elect. The last shall be first, and the first shall be last.
Here it is in a nutshell from the inspired writings of Paul, primarily Galatians and Romans and Hebrews.
It is Jesus Who is the Seed, and inheritor of the promises, not Isaac. It is through Jesus that all the nations of the world will be blessed (Genesis), which is universal salvation of all. If you have the Spirit of Jesus within you, then you are His descendant, and one of the "Israel of God", a Spiritual Jew, the Elect, and will inherit all things, as will eventually all mankind. That is the Good News.
So be happy and ditch all the false teachings about physical Israel.
It is all about Jesus and how He will bring about the salvation of all and God will be all in all.
Dennis Vogel:
Thank you John.
And I can say as a fact that Ray did not speak favorably about the current country of Israel. He spoke most unfavorably of it.
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