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Horan:
--- Quote from: John from Kentucky on July 04, 2018, 10:43:43 PM ---Some of us have the understanding that the Adam and Eve story is not literal but a spiritual story chock full of deep spiritual truths. Adam is the Hebrew word for mankind. Eve is the mother of all living. But not all have this understanding. God guides all.
--- End quote ---
I'm mostly in agreement with this, though I take the garden story at face value. I think the scientific explanation has problems all day long, not the least being that it's not demonstrable theory but purely forensic and speculative. And scientific theories aren't facts but propositions. elaborated hypotheses. There's actually no scientific theory that's factual. It's simply not what a theory is. Theory is proved good or bad by its utility, its predictive capacity, and shouldn't be confused with scientific fact, such as the distance between the earth and the sun. So I don't hold with the concern for reconciling non-repeatable, consensus science with scripture. But I wasn't there. The story may be symbolic in whole or in part. But I believe it's spiritually true, entirely. and much more instructive on that basis than historically or scientifically. So I take it at face value. I've seen that Ray makes significant effort to read science into scripture, but he's done such a fine job with other things that I overlook it. Is this what you guys call being contrary? I could care less about science, while enjoying the benefits of scientific theories that are actually demonstrable.
lareli:
--- Quote from: Prune Soleiado on July 04, 2018, 07:44:54 PM ---About Eve: It says in Gen 2:22 that God formed Eve by taking one of Adam’s rib.
The hebrew word for « rib » is tsela‘ (Strong 06763) which signifies also the sides of a door, or the sides of a chamber( in a temple’s structure), or the sides of an arch.
Eve is not yet wise in the eyes of God, she’s not in the temple of God. And like Adam God took her out of her human foolish position to bring her to His wisdom, and we know Adam, like Our Lord Jesus with His Church, has the prerogative to render his wife pure, unblemished. God brings Eve to Adam after He has fashioned her also, she has come by the same process as Adam. She’s wise now and Adam recognizes it by saying « This now bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh ».
Just my humble opinion.. Hope I’m kinda clear. I don’t mean to confuse anyone 😉
Blessed be God, Father of Our Lord Jesus Christ.
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So the two of them were wise before they ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil?
I would say they weren’t even yet self conscious beings (let alone wise beings) until they ate from the tree. Once they ate, they became conscious of their mortality and conscious of the fact that they will die. Conscious of their vulnerabilities to death (naked) and conscious of the concept of ‘time’ and ‘future’. Before they ate, they were no more conscious than beasts..
Prune Soleiado:
Hello Lareli,
And Peter was wise enough to recognize Christ as the Son of God, yet he finally denies Him.
I must admit this part on Adam and Eve is pretty tough to understand.. 😅
Hope God guides us and shows us the right interpretation 🙏
Very interesting thread! Thanks for the discussion, brothers and sisters, I get to learn so much with you all!
For the glory of God.
Prune Soleiado:
Did we?
I didn’t know anything about the beast when God opened my eyes through Christ.
Yet I had a vague idea of what Holiness should be.
I believe firmly in God, yet I still have so much to be cleansed in my heart.
1Corinthians 3:3 « For ye are yet carnal »
Ray taught us about Eve taking the forbidden fruit: good to be eaten, pleasant to the eye and the pride to gain intelligence.
I still fight with those sins. Even if I am deeply anxious to please God.
Heavens we create, false prophets, fortress of our hearts, we all have throughout our lives in Christ to realize they’re here and learn by God’s Grace to reject them.
It’s a real path cross. But God supports us and lead us on this way. Christ’s way.
Eve and Adam didn’t have that chance we have under the New Covenant.
Matthew 13:17 « For truly I tell you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see but did not see it, and to hear what you hear but did not hear it. »
John from Kentucky:
--- Quote from: Dennis Vogel on July 05, 2018, 06:49:54 AM ---
--- Quote from: John from Kentucky on July 04, 2018, 10:43:43 PM ---Some of us have the understanding that the Adam and Eve story is not literal but a spiritual story chock full of deep spiritual truths. Adam is the Hebrew word for mankind. Eve is the mother of all living. But not all have this understanding. God guides all.
--- End quote ---
Certainly John. But let's not give the impression that Adam and Eve is only a spiritual story. We have Adam's genealogy recorded in the book of Genesis. So we know they were real people.
As for "Adam and Eve story is not literal." Some of it seems to be not literal if you consider Eve is "the mother of all living" and you believe there were humans before Adam and Eve.
But I've often wondered what "the mother of all living" means? Some of her descendants will become "the elect" or spiritually enlightened? What do you think John?
--- End quote ---
My understanding is that the Adam and Eve story is entirely symbolic and an allegory.
Adam means mankind and he is symbolic of the human father from whom we come. And Adam came from God.
Seth is the first mentioned in the genealogies when men first called on God. But Adam (mankind) was not his literal father but his symbolic father.
Eve is also the symbolic mother of all living. If there were other humans before Eve, then she would only be the mother of some of the living, not the mother of all living.
I have no problem with true science. It appears God created things over billions of years going from simple to complex.
I have no problem with the Scriptures. I believe they teach absolute Truth. Just not literal truth. Spiritual Truths, which provide deep understanding and peace. The Spirit guides us and we grow in grace and knowledge over time, just as the Apostles did over time.
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