> General Discussions
New Heavens and New Earth
Horan:
--- Quote from: Wanda on August 20, 2018, 03:09:01 PM ---
--- Quote from: Horan on August 19, 2018, 11:55:31 PM ---
--- Quote from: Rick Longva on August 19, 2018, 07:43:50 PM ---I don't believe it will be obliterated and a new Earth and heavens created. I was just wondering if Ray, or anyone here had any thoughts about that. Thanks for the reply.
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Hi Rick. It appears to me that this is a problematic issue with regard to those who believe in universal reconciliation. I personally believe that all life on earth will be destroyed at the end of this, current age. Jesus said that it will be just as in the days of Noah, and Peter makes it quite clear that destruction by fire will ensue in this coming judgement. I understand that many things need to be understood in spiritual terms rather than literal but, while I firmly believe that all will ultimately be happily reconciled to God, I read this end time event as destruction by some form of literal fire.
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Silly me, thinking when I found Universal Reconciliation I was free of that wrathful God of fire and destruction. I should have known it was to good to be true. ;)
1 Corinthians 2
13 These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one. 16 For “who has known the mind of theLord that he may instruct Him?” But we have the mind of Christ.
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I see no good reason whatsoever to dismiss the plausibility of God's wrath being expressed in literal destruction. Just examine the world we live in. Examine the history of the past 2,000 years. Examine the 20th Century. Aren't the examples too numerous to count of God's judgement being expressed in horrific, literal terms? What would actually be unusual about it? And I think the scriptural evidence easily supports this expectation. And that's all I intend to say about it. I've corresponded with Rick before, and I was responding to his query, even though it was mainly directed toward understanding what Ray may have said or written on this subject.
Prune Soleiado:
Couldn’t find it, but Ray taught us that men create their own heavens (beliefs, idols of heart), those same heavens from which the dragon falls down in Revelation 12. It is also the moment when believers abandon their first Love, Christ. The Earth represents the called ones (who turn themselves towards churches build with the hands of men).
The new covenant is no more the ancient covenant: Hebrew 8:13: « By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear. »
New wine into new wineskin, new sepulcre in which Jesus is placed after the crucifixion, new Jerusalem..
So, new Heavens and Earth, wouldn’t it be the same after all: a totally new way for people to believe, at least Faith for the True God, the One and Only God throught Jesus Christ?
John from Kentucky:
Sorry for you gloom and doomers, but it does help to have some understanding of the Scriptures.
In two Scriptures, in Matthew and Mark, Jesus tells us that unless those end days were shortened, then no flesh would be saved alive. But for sake of His Elect, those days will be shortened.
So there will be life, not total destruction. God is the God of the living, not the dead, for all will live unto Him and all will be saved.
Wanda:
--- Quote from: Prune Soleiado on August 20, 2018, 11:00:34 PM ---Couldn’t find it, but Ray taught us that men create their own heavens (beliefs, idols of heart), those same heavens from which the dragon falls down in Revelation 12. It is also the moment when believers abandon their first Love, Christ. The Earth represents the called ones (who turn themselves towards churches build with the hands of men).
The new covenant is no more the ancient covenant: Hebrew 8:13: « By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear. »
New wine into new wineskin, new sepulcre in which Jesus is placed after the crucifixion, new Jerusalem..
So, new Heavens and Earth, wouldn’t it be the same after all: a totally new way for people to believe, at least Faith for the True God, the One and Only God throught Jesus Christ?
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Hi Michelle, this is what I see.
Heb. 8:11
11 And they shall not teach everyone his fellow citizen, and everyone his brother, saying, “Know the Lord,” for all shall know Me, from the least to the greatest of them.
This shows that full knowledge of God will be in everyone, and it also implies that no one will have to command anyone to know Him or His will. Commands are a function of the Old Covenant, and when the New Covenant is universally implemented, no commands are necessary in the sense that we understand them today.
Cor. 5:17,
17 Therefore if any man is in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things passed away; behold, new things have come.
When everyone is truly “a new creature,” then John’s broader vision of the future is fulfilled. Just as our heaven and our earth is renewed through Christ on an individual level (as our old man is put to death and we walk out the life of the New Creation Man), so also does John present this as a universal promise.
John then links this to the marriage theme on its highest level—the marriage of heaven and earth. This fulfills Jesus’ prayer in Matt. 6:10,
10 Your kingdom come, Your will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
Prune Soleiado:
--- Quote from: John from Kentucky on August 20, 2018, 11:46:32 PM ---Sorry for you gloom and doomers, but it does help to have some understanding of the Scriptures.
In two Scriptures, in Matthew and Mark, Jesus tells us that unless those end days were shortened, then no flesh would be saved alive. But for sake of His Elect, those days will be shortened.
So there will be life, not total destruction. God is the God of the living, not the dead, for all will live unto Him and all will be saved.
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Aaaaand here is the enlightenment... 😅
Safe and clear, yep 👍
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