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Abednego:

--- Quote from: indianabob on March 05, 2022, 01:20:41 AM ---
God struck down Uzza because he did not trust God to protect the ark and intervened out of a lack of faith.

--- End quote ---

God struck down Uzza because He gave very specific instructions on how the ark was to be transported and those instructions were not being followed. Only Levites could touch the ark, and only using poles. They weren’t supposed to reach out and touch it at all.

Extol:
Hi Ralph,

The first of the forum rules is stated as follows:

This forum is primarily a place for people of a like mind to fellowship, and secondarily to discuss and question what they learn on bible-truths.com.

In other words, discuss and question what they learn from the writings of L. Ray Smith. Since Ray has been dead for nearly a decade, it is not surprising the forum has gotten increasingly quiet. A big part of Ray's mission was "exposing those who contradict" (Titus 1:9), primarily regarding the doctrine of eternal hell. Well, there's only so much you can discuss about hell not being real, and the church being wrong, especially when a) we've all known for a long time there is no eternal hell; and b) there is no new material coming out to discuss. People have tried to bring in new ideas (while still fervently believing the basic truths of God's sovereignty and the salvation of all) but they are muzzled for violating the rules. There are plenty of other ways to have those discussions (private message, regular e-mail, phone, letter, in person) but we aren't supposed to do so here. I don't particularly like it, but those are the rules.

That being said, I will risk breaking the rules and give a couple of my thoughts.

I like to look up the meaning of names in stories--especially bizarre stories like this one--because the meanings often give valuable insight for their prophetic and/or descriptive significance. The name Uzza means strength, which indicates he was trying to help God with his own human strength, rather than having faith in God to do the work. This is still common today; there are many of us who think God needs a helping hand to fulfill His promises. I like how 19th-century German theologian Otto von Gerlach explained it:

Uzzah was a type of all who, with good intentions, humanly speaking, yet with unsanctified minds, interfere in the affairs of the Kingdom of God, from the notion that they [the kingdom affairs] are in danger, and with the hope of saving them.

Interesting aside: later there was a King of Judah with a similar name, Uzziah, meaning strength of Yah. He was a godly king, strengthened by Yahweh (as his name suggests), although he eventually thought too highly of himself and had an Uzza moment:

But when he was strong [note the play on words], his heart was lifted up to his destruction: for he transgressed against the LORD his God, and went into the temple of the LORD to burn incense upon the altar of incense. 2 Chronicles 26:16

Obed Edom was a Levite, which may explain, at least in part, why his house was blessed . Levites were set apart to deal with the ark and "holy things" (Num 4:4). Though some commentators assume Uzzah and Ahio were Levites because their father had guarded the ark (1 Sam. 7:1), it is never stated they are of Levi. After Uzzah got zapped, David restored the lawful order of things regarding the Levites handling the ark and leading worship. Said David: None ought to carry the ark of God but the Levites: for them hath the LORD chosen to carry the ark of God, and to minister unto Him for ever. (1 Chr. 15:2). This is followed by a list of Levites, among whom was Obed-Edom (15:18). To me this suggests Uzzah was perhaps not a Levite, and/or they were not properly following the rules of the holy things prior to David's reforms.

Porter:

--- Quote from: ralph on March 04, 2022, 07:01:10 PM ---

What is the spiritual significance of the ark?
The oxen stumbled at “Chidon’s threshing floor”.  Does that have any significance?
Why did God strike down Uzza for putting his hand to the ark?
Why did God bless the house of Obed-Edom when keeping the ark in there house?



--- End quote ---
The ark is Christ. Chidon's threshing floor is the place where judgment occurs for the many called. Uzza's death represents the second death of the many called. The house of Obed-Edom represents the chosen Elect.

Ray said the Old Testament is the biography of Jesus, and that when ever the OT talked about the prophets and Israel, it was talking about Jesus and His Elect. 

When ever the Old Testament starts to seem complicated for me, I try to remember the simplicity of whom they represent -  spiritually. If all I see is literal death (and there is a lot of that in the OT), it gets confusing.  However, if I can see Jesus and my own self in the OT, it becomes a bit more clear.

The OT stories often revolve around Israel disobeying God, with only a few that ever obey. If Scripture is written for "our admonition", what is it God is admonishing us to do? 

I'm not saying anything new, as Ray has covered all of this in his papers. The amount of spiritual wisdom through the many topics in Ray's paper's would take me a lifetime to absorb (maybe cause I'm slow lol). Ten years later, I still learn something new when ever I read them. There is just so much spiritual content, that the reconciliation of all is only the tip of the iceberg, or even the cherry on top.

I'm not saying anyone that explained the significance of the events in 1 Chronicles is wrong, as I think a lot can be gleaned from those explanations.  It's like all the details combined paint a better picture of God's plan for us all, along with how we should walk in them.

indianabob:
Hello Jesse,
Thanks for expanding on the issue at hand.
Appreciate your contributions very much.
Indiana Bob


--- Quote from: Extol on March 08, 2022, 12:10:20 AM ---Hi Ralph,

The first of the forum rules is stated as follows:

This forum is primarily a place for people of a like mind to fellowship, and secondarily to discuss and question what they learn on bible-truths.com.

In other words, discuss and question what they learn from the writings of L. Ray Smith. Since Ray has been dead for nearly a decade, it is not surprising the forum has gotten increasingly quiet. A big part of Ray's mission was "exposing those who contradict" (Titus 1:9), primarily regarding the doctrine of eternal hell. Well, there's only so much you can discuss about hell not being real, and the church being wrong, especially when a) we've all known for a long time there is no eternal hell; and b) there is no new material coming out to discuss. People have tried to bring in new ideas (while still fervently believing the basic truths of God's sovereignty and the salvation of all) but they are muzzled for violating the rules. There are plenty of other ways to have those discussions (private message, regular e-mail, phone, letter, in person) but we aren't supposed to do so here. I don't particularly like it, but those are the rules.

That being said, I will risk breaking the rules and give a couple of my thoughts.

I like to look up the meaning of names in stories--especially bizarre stories like this one--because the meanings often give valuable insight for their prophetic and/or descriptive significance. The name Uzza means strength, which indicates he was trying to help God with his own human strength, rather than having faith in God to do the work. This is still common today; there are many of us who think God needs a helping hand to fulfill His promises. I like how 19th-century German theologian Otto von Gerlach explained it:

Uzzah was a type of all who, with good intentions, humanly speaking, yet with unsanctified minds, interfere in the affairs of the Kingdom of God, from the notion that they [the kingdom affairs] are in danger, and with the hope of saving them.

Interesting aside: later there was a King of Judah with a similar name, Uzziah, meaning strength of Yah. He was a godly king, strengthened by Yahweh (as his name suggests), although he eventually thought too highly of himself and had an Uzza moment:

But when he was strong [note the play on words], his heart was lifted up to his destruction: for he transgressed against the LORD his God, and went into the temple of the LORD to burn incense upon the altar of incense. 2 Chronicles 26:16

Obed Edom was a Levite, which may explain, at least in part, why his house was blessed . Levites were set apart to deal with the ark and "holy things" (Num 4:4). Though some commentators assume Uzzah and Ahio were Levites because their father had guarded the ark (1 Sam. 7:1), it is never stated they are of Levi. After Uzzah got zapped, David restored the lawful order of things regarding the Levites handling the ark and leading worship. Said David: None ought to carry the ark of God but the Levites: for them hath the LORD chosen to carry the ark of God, and to minister unto Him for ever. (1 Chr. 15:2). This is followed by a list of Levites, among whom was Obed-Edom (15:18). To me this suggests Uzzah was perhaps not a Levite, and/or they were not properly following the rules of the holy things prior to David's reforms.

--- End quote ---

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