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Is Jesus Christ Eternal

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Anjel Uriel:
I know The Father brought forth Christ and I always took it as that He gave birth to Him. There was a time when The Father alone existed and He then created Christ by bringing Him forth. Well, Iíve been seeing old posts of people here and Iím getting kinda confused. Basically, it seems some old posters basically believed in a form of Binitarianism, that is, Christ always existed with God The Father and itís co-eternal and that Christ canít be created because we worship Him. So is there Scriptures that prove Christ is always existed?

My point of view (which I made a whole post about where IndiBob and Dave responded) is this:

God The Father was always existed. He then decided to create a Divine Being that would be His Representative to Humanity, so He did this by begetting a Son and that Son is The Very First Creation of His Father. I saw things along the lines of ďHow can Christ be be created if Heís worshipped, Heís begotten of God not createdĒ.

But, arenít we also both created and begotten of God? We are created because thereís a time we didnít exist but we are begotten because God is our Father and lives in us and whatever someone does to us, they do it to God.

My reason for why Christ can be both created and still worshipped is because He represents His Father perfectly. For example, Christ will judge the world for how they treats us because whatever they do to us is the exact same as doing to Him, because we represent Him. Therefore, even though Christ was created, because Heís the very first creation and the begotten Son of God who represents Him perfectly, then He can be worshipped because worship to Christ is the same as worship to His Father.

Let me know what you all think cause Iíve been wrestling with this for the last week.

octoberose:
What is the difference between creating  and begotten ? 

Anjel Uriel:

--- Quote from: octoberose on September 05, 2022, 03:01:17 PM ---What is the difference between creating  and begotten ?

--- End quote ---

Hi octoberose, sorry if this response is too long but from what Iíve and understand (emphasis on MY understanding, Iím still a fetus in Christ). When someone is created, it means that theyíve been brought forth into existence. Before, they didnít exist, they only existed, if you can even call it that, as an idea.

For example, God predestined to call us and know The Truth before the foundation of the world. We existed in a sense in Godís Mind in the respect that He planned for us to be created, grow up, be deceived by Babylon and then rescue us from the darkness. However, He still didnít create us then because He hadnít started the process of bringing us into existence.

Begotten, from what Iíve gathered from Scripture when referring to God, is when God regenerates or conceives someone, that is, He takes a person that previously wasnít His child and puts His Spirit inside them and conforms them to His Image, that is, they share the spiritual attributes of their Father, His Kindness, Love, Compassion, Wisdom, etc. Itís also the same word used as when someone gives birth. In human terms, you are begotten as in conceived when your father impregnates your mother and youíre begotten 9 months later when she gives birth to you, itís the same word.

However, when we look at Scriptures when referring to Christ as the only-begotten Son of God, the Greek word is different to when referring to us being begotten by God. The word used for us is 1080. gennaů and it means to beget, to bring forth, etc. But, the word for Christ is 3439. monogenťs and it means properly, one-and-only; "one of a kind" Ė literally, "one (monos) of a class, genos" (the only of its kind).

So this let us know that let us know that in a way our sonship and Christís are different. If Iím not mistaken orthodoxy says that it means that Christ is eternally generated by God the Father.

Someone say that means that Christ wasnít created and that it means He always existed as Godís Son. For me, from what Iíve gathered, when Christ is referred as Godís Only Son, it doesnít mean that we also arenít sons of God and even Christ calls us brothers and Scripture testify we share the same Father with Christ. But, it means that Jesus is Special, Heís The Son who has never sinned, who was never disobedient, who was never adopted and reborn. We are Godís sons and Heís called Godís Only Son. For me, this is because we are different in our likeness to God, we reflect Godís Character in part but Christ as the firstborn is the only one who reflects Godís Character completely, Heís the only one whoís equal to God in terms of power, character, love, divinity, wisdom, etc. We are flawed representatives of God while Heís The Perfect Representative.

So thatís why Iíve gathered and thatís why Iím confused because people use this special position of His as saying He wasnít created while my position is that Heís the only one who was created (that is was brought into existence) and is currently begotten (conformed to Godís Image) in a perfect state.

Dennis Vogel:
Talking about The Father:

1Ti 6:16  Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen. 

ralph:
"But, it means that Jesus is Special, Heís The Son who has never sinned, who was never disobedient, who was never adopted and reborn."

I'm not so sure about that.  We read here:

Hebrews 5:8
8 though He was a Son, yet He learned obedience by the things which He suffered.

Now I don't fully understand this, so I am just thinking out loud here.   If Christ was perfect and one with the father as a flesh and blood human being, how could he then "learn obedience".  If he was perfect, what did he have to learn?  Does that not mean that he went through a process of learning "before" he emptied himself and became human? Was he always perfect like his father?  I'm not so sure about this.

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