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Author Topic: I need clarity  (Read 461 times)

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octoberose

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I need clarity
« on: November 26, 2023, 11:48:19 PM »

Could you help me with something ? If someone close to you lives in a way you know to be against God and His way , but they donít recognize God or things of God, and they want your love and respect - and you do love them. You know God has not opened their eyes yet or drawn them to Himself.  How do you, specifically, love the person and honor God? You canít say it doesnít matter, how they live, what they do, but Christ spent virtually no time telling gentiles how to live.  He offered himself as living water,  He made no excuses for anybody.  He was kind to the extreme.  What would you say he did with the unbelieving and how do we respond when loving the sinner ( understanding that if we say we have no sin we deceive ourselves ).  Thank you for listening.
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ralph

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Re: I need clarity
« Reply #1 on: November 27, 2023, 04:49:41 AM »

Christ didn't instruct the Gentiles while on planet Earth but he has instructed many millions of them spiritually. 

John 16:7-11
7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. 8 And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me; 10 of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; 11 of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.

I don't know the particular details of your relationship, but I have someone close to me as well and I correct and instruct this person often.  For me it is not possible to do anything else.  For me, to tell this person the truth is kindness, love and respect.
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indianabob

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Re: I need clarity
« Reply #2 on: November 27, 2023, 06:20:31 PM »

Hello Ralph,
Thanks for the good advice.
Just curious, how do these folks that you correct receive it?
Do they after learning of a better way of understanding continue in the better way and correct themselves as they practice the leading you have provided?

Has the correction born fruit of the spirit? Or has the correction just been politely ignored?

I have four children and a few good friends who are close to me as well, and mostly I notice very little personal interest on their part in sharing the good news with others.

My conclusion is that for them it is not the time of their enlightenment.
I have decided to accept God's will in these matters, knowing that God will handle it at the appropriate time.
Indy Bob

p.s.
Crist Jesus did send apostle Paul to the gentiles as shown in the letter to the Romans.
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octoberose

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Re: I need clarity
« Reply #3 on: November 27, 2023, 11:39:58 PM »

Crist Jesus did send apostle Paul to the gentiles as shown in the letter to the Romans.

Very true. 
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indianabob

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Re: I need clarity
« Reply #4 on: November 28, 2023, 06:09:00 AM »

Crist Jesus did send apostle Paul to the gentiles as shown in the letter to the Romans.

Very true.

Thanks for the reply.
So then are we gentiles or are we Jewish proselytes or some other category of believer.??

Indy Bob
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ralph

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Re: I need clarity
« Reply #5 on: November 28, 2023, 10:41:21 AM »

Hello Ralph,
Thanks for the good advice.
Just curious, how do these folks that you correct receive it?
Do they after learning of a better way of understanding continue in the better way and correct themselves as they practice the leading you have provided?

Has the correction born fruit of the spirit? Or has the correction just been politely ignored?

I have four children and a few good friends who are close to me as well, and mostly I notice very little personal interest on their part in sharing the good news with others.

My conclusion is that for them it is not the time of their enlightenment.
I have decided to accept God's will in these matters, knowing that God will handle it at the appropriate time.
Indy Bob

p.s.
Crist Jesus did send apostle Paul to the gentiles as shown in the letter to the Romans.

Hi Bob,

For the record, I am not implying that I am a know-it-all and no longer need correction. I have received much of it and still do from The Lord. The person I am referring to, an adult, seems unable or unwilling to discern right from wrong in the simplest of matters. I continue to pass on the wisdom I have been given, but it appears to fall on deaf ears. As you say, it is not their time of enlightenment.

Regarding the other topic.  This scripture came to mind:

Romans 2:28-29
28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; 29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.

If this is the spiritual definition of a Jew, then what is a gentile spiritually speaking?  Something to ponder.
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Dave in Tenn

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Re: I need clarity
« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2023, 04:34:15 PM »

"Spiritual gentiles" are everyone who is not one inwardly; with circumcision that is not of the heart, nor in the Spirit, but in the letter; whose praise is from men but not from God.

Rose, if people are not coming to me (and they aren't, at least not in droves) then I reckon my "light" and "good works" are insufficient at present to draw them.  I'm there.  I'm available.  I even have a boatload of answers once they can ask the right questions.  Until then, I am in their lives as much as I can be and they are in mine as much as I can allow them to be.  Mostly, with most people closest to me, they think there's something wrong with me.  And of course there is.  I'm in their lives as much as they can have me be, and allow me to be there.  Seems like a fair arrangement.
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Heb 10:32  But you must continue to remember those earlier days, how after you were enlightened you endured a hard and painful struggle.

Dennis Vogel

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Re: I need clarity
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2023, 09:43:32 PM »

Very good Dave - Thank you.

Recently YouTube discovered that I'm into everybody being saved and is showing me these types of videos. But this one especially caught my eye because I just posted a YouTube video with the same title. So I watched some of it and here is a link that starts about one minute in: https://youtu.be/CsezhfW7sI0?list=PLSnOlh5tXXT34fG6WBsPGwy3Xyzj6TjxT&t=80

Keep watching until he is done talking about eschatology (people believing the last thing taught - the part of theology concerned with death, judgment, and the final destiny of the soul and of humankind - Google) which is around 5:40 into the video. That's about where I stopped. But what he says about others is 100% correct IMO.

Ray wrote about The Rapture about 20 years ago and I always wonder if people get their ideas from Ray's teachings?

BTW, I've found several other sites recently but so far they do not believe what we believe. Like one of them does not believe in hell or in free will but one of the teachers said we have 'limited' free will.

« Last Edit: November 29, 2023, 09:52:19 PM by Dennis Vogel »
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Musterseed

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Re: I need clarity
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2023, 11:22:56 PM »

Thanks Dennis, I watched it to the end and as usual  itís wrong because he still teaching that the parables are all literal as is the whole book and on top of all that
the rapture of the wicked to them  is that they are the righteous and everyone
else is wicked. Jesus said , there are none righteous, no not one. They donít like
Or understand that scripture, as a matter of fact they despise the word of God.
I believe, even if they teach from Rayís papers, they still donít understand and will twist the words and meanings of them.
Sometimes I read some of them and it all sounds so good, sometimes right to the end, but then they are exposed by what we have been taught by Ray through
our Lord like that limited free will. The scriptures will always expose them.
However with that said, just maybe some of those people will now open their
bibles and pay attention to the words if our Lord so desires. Our Lord does
nothing without purpose and itís his sovereignty that is a stumbling block
because of their fabled free will hearts of unbelief.

From the church that Jesus Built

Paul knew that much of his labour in the gospel would FAil to bring most of the
saints to maturity.

When Jesus returns will he find faith on the earth? Jesus asked a rhetorical
question because He will find very little faith on the earth when He returns.

But Ö. Isa. 26: 9 Ö WHEN Thy judgements are in the earth , the inhabitants of the world will learn righteousness.

Matt.13:11Ö to you it is given to know( understand) the secrets of the Kingdom
of heaven (s) , but to them , it has not been given.

Paul said Apostasy would get worse and worse, from bad to worse. And
You tube is filled to the brim with vile preaching and mockery of Our Lord.
Itís disgusting.

Gen.6:5 Ö and God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth
and every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
Ray quoteĒ thatís a lot of badĒ

Have things gotten better? No, worse, much worse.

 But we canít boast, because
Rom.11:32Ö For God has concluded them all ( Jews and Gentiles) in unbelief,
that He might have mercy on ALL.

RAY,,,,, SO THEY ARE ALL IN THE SAME BUCKET( unbelief, apostasy, no faith)

In Christ, Pamela


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" No man can come to me,except the Father draw him"
                                   (John 6: 44)

Dennis Vogel

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Re: I need clarity
« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2023, 10:19:03 AM »

And in the beginning he said he was 'saved'.

I only suggested the non-teaching part in the beginning so the rules were not broken. But what he said about changing people made sense to me.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2023, 10:26:34 AM by Dennis Vogel »
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waterfall77

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Re: I need clarity
« Reply #10 on: November 30, 2023, 10:53:56 AM »

Thanks Dave , I needed to hear that also.
Aubrey
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