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Author Topic: Satellite in Zechariah  (Read 2845 times)

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hillsbororiver

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Satellite in Zechariah
« on: October 27, 2006, 04:33:53 PM »

Angie had referenced this topic in another thread and I thought perhaps some of the newer members might be interested as it was originally posted about 2 months ago (under the name Flying Rolls of Zechariah);





Zec 5:1  Then I turned, and lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and behold a flying roll.
 
Zec 5:2  And he said unto me, What seest thou? And I answered, I see a flying roll; the length thereof is twenty cubits, and the breadth thereof ten cubits.

These verses were used on TBN by Paul Crouch to show that his satellites were predicted in scripture, he even had a scale model of a satellite on the coffee table to show the that the dimensions quoted were also "on the money."

A few of us were sitting around Ray's kitchen table (Conference weekend) Saturday night discussing this and we were all amazed at the verses that immediately follow this prophecy, but not surprised at all that they were not presented on the program;


Zec 5:3  Then said he unto me, This is the curse that goeth forth over the face of the whole earth: for every one that stealeth shall be cut off as on this side according to it; and every one that sweareth shall be cut off as on that side according to it.
 
Zec 5:4  I will bring it forth, saith the LORD of hosts, and it shall enter into the house of the thief and into the house of him that sweareth falsely by my name: and it shall remain in the midst of his house and shall consume it with the timber thereof and the stones thereof.

What "stealing" is going on through the messages being presented?

This curse that enters into the midst of the house, is it coming through the TV sets of those who are believing and swearing by the heresy being preached?

Look at this;


Zec 5:5  Then the angel that talked with me went forth and said unto me, Lift up now thine eyes and see what is this that goeth forth.
 
Zec 5:6  And I said, What is it? And he said, This is an ephah that goeth forth. He said moreover, This is their resemblance through all the earth.

Amazing stuff.

Zec 5:7  And, behold, there was lifted up a talent of lead: and this is a woman that sitteth in the midst of the ephah.
 
Zec 5:8  And he said, This is wickedness. And he cast it into the midst of the ephah; and he cast the weight of lead upon the mouth thereof.

Any thoughts on who this woman represents (a harlot maybe?)

I had never seen any of this before and I was inspired to read the entire book, so many prophecies of how the fathers (leaders) would turn the flock into merchandise and how the people went along with it.

This is an incredible study;

Joe

 
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hillsbororiver

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Re: Satellite in Zechariah
« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2006, 07:08:05 PM »

King James Version

Zec 5:7 And lo! A leaden disc uplifted, and here a certain woman, sitting inside the ephah.

Zec 5:8 Then said he,
            [This] is Lawlessness.
            So he thrust her back inside the ephah, and then thrust the leaden weight into the mouth thereof.

Zec 5:9 Then lifted I up mine eyes and looked, and lo! Two Women coming forward, with the wind in their wings, and [they] had wings, like the wings of the stork and bare up the ephah, between the earth and the heavens.

Zec 5:10 Then said I unto the messengerwho was speaking with me, Whither are they carrying the ephah?

Zec 5:11 And he said unto me, To build for it a housein the land of Shinar, so it should be ready, and they should settle it there, upon its own base.

H8152
שׁנער
shin‛âr
shin-awr'
Probably of foreign derivation; Shinar, a plain in Babylon: - Shinar.


H374
אפה     איפה
'êyphâh  'êphâh
ay-faw', ay-faw'
Of Egyptian derivation; an ephah or measure for grain; hence a measure in general: - ephah, (divers) measure (-s).


Zechariah 5 (Amplified Bible)

5Then the angel who talked with me came forward and said to me, Lift up now your eyes and see what this is that goes forth.

6And I said, What is it? [What does it symbolize?] And he said, This that goes forth is an ephah[-sized vessel for separate grains all collected together]. This, he continued, is the symbol of the sinners mentioned above and is the resemblance of their iniquity throughout the whole land.(B)

7And behold, a round, flat weight of lead was lifted and there sat a woman in the midst of the ephah[-sized vessel].

8And he said, This is lawlessness (wickedness)! And he thrust her back into the ephah[-sized vessel] and he cast the weight of lead upon the mouth of it!

9Then lifted I up my eyes and looked, and behold, there were two women coming forward! The wind was in their wings, for they had wings like the wings of a stork, and they lifted up the ephah[-sized vessel] between the earth and the heavens.

10Then said I to the angel who talked with me, Where are they taking the ephah[-sized vessel]?

11And he said to me, To the land of Shinar [Babylonia] to build it a house, and when it is finished, to set up the ephah[-sized vessel--the symbol of such sinners and their guilt] there upon its own base.

Zechariah 5 (New Living Translation)

A Woman in a Basket

5 Then the angel who was talking with me came forward and said, “Look up and see what’s coming.”
6 “What is it?” I asked.
He replied, “It is a basket for measuring grain, and it’s filled with the sins[c] of everyone throughout the land.”

7 Then the heavy lead cover was lifted off the basket, and there was a woman sitting inside it. 8 The angel said, “The woman’s name is Wickedness,” and he pushed her back into the basket and closed the heavy lid again.

9 Then I looked up and saw two women flying toward us, gliding on the wind. They had wings like a stork, and they picked up the basket and flew into the sky.

10 “Where are they taking the basket?” I asked the angel.

11 He replied, “To the land of Babylonia,[d] where they will build a temple for the basket. And when the temple is ready, they will set the basket there on its pedestal.”
 

All this ties in perfectly with Revelation (speaking of the elect and of the harlot);

King James Version

Rev 14:4  These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

Rev 14:8  And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.

Revelation 14:4, 14;8 (Amplified Bible)

4These are they who have not defiled themselves by relations with women, for they are [[a]pure as] virgins. These are they who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These are they who have been ransomed (purchased, redeemed) from among men as the firstfruits for God and the Lamb.

8Then another angel, a second, followed, declaring, Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great! She who made all nations drink of the [maddening] wine of her passionate unchastity [[d] idolatry]


Revelation 14:4, 14:8 (New Living Translation)

4 They have kept themselves as pure as virgins,[a] following the Lamb wherever he goes. They have been purchased from among the people on the earth as a special offering to God and to the Lamb. 5 They have told no lies; they are without blame.

8 Then another angel followed him through the sky, shouting, “Babylon is fallen—that great city is fallen—because she made all the nations of the world drink the wine of her passionate immorality.”

Does this symbolize anything to anyone?

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe


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ned

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Re: Satellite in Zechariah
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2006, 01:28:16 AM »

Re:
Zeh 5:11 He replied, “To the land of Babylonia,where they will build a temple for the basket. And when the temple is ready, they will set the basket there on its pedestal.”
and the Revelation scriptures mentioned by Joe.

Here's another reference from Jeremiah:

Jer 29:4-5 ...that the LORD All-Powerful, the God of Israel, had said: I had you taken from Jerusalem to Babylonia. Now I tell you to settle there and build houses. Plant gardens and eat what you grow in them.

Jer 29:8  Some of your people there in Babylonia are fortunetellers, and you have asked them to tell you what will happen in the future. But they will only lead you astray. And don't let the prophets fool you, either. They speak in my name, but they are liars. I have not spoken to them.

Jer 29:15-16  You feel secure, because you think I have sent prophets to speak for me in Babylonia.
But I have been sending prophets to the people of Judah for a long time, and the king from David's family and the people who are left in Jerusalem and Judah still don't obey me. So I, the LORD All-Powerful, will keep attacking them with war and hunger and disease, until they are as useless as rotten figs. I will force them to leave the land, and all nations will be disgusted and shocked at what happens to them....


I think all of Jer29 ties in with what you're saying here Joe. Babylon is such a secure place for those who aren't chosen to see. People will be shocked when Babylon is fallen.

This is an intense study where I pray and lean on God to open my eyes before I start to read. There's a lot to learn!

With love,
Marie
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Kat

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Re: Satellite in Zechariah
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2006, 03:19:14 AM »

Hi Joe,

The scriptures you have presented about the woman (Babylon),
is very evident to whom it repersents, the whole of orthodox Christianity.

But what I have been reading in Rev., makes you realize how totally corrupt that woman is,
and how christ will deal with her when He returns.

Rev 14:8  A second angel followed and said, "The great city of Babylon has fallen! This is the city that made all nations drunk and immoral. Now God is angry, and Babylon has fallen."

Rev 16:18  and there came voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and a great earthquake came, such as came not since men came upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake--so great!
Rev 16:19  And it came--the great city--into three parts, and the cities of the nations did fall, and Babylon the great was remembered before God, to give to her the cup of the wine of the wrath of His anger,

Rev 18:2  And he cried with a mighty voice, saying, Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great, and is become a habitation of demons, and a hold of every unclean spirit, and a hold of every unclean and hateful bird.
Rev 18:3  For by the wine of the wrath of her fornication all the nations are fallen; and the kings of the earth committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth waxed rich by the power of her wantonness.

Rev 18:5  Her sins are piled as high as heaven. God has remembered the evil she has done.

Rev 18:8  For this reason her plagues of death, misery, and famine will come in a single day. She will be burned up in a fire, because powerful is the Lord God who judges her."

Rev 18:21  And a strong angel took up a stone as it were a great millstone and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with a mighty fall shall Babylon, the great city, be cast down, and shall be found no more at all.

Rev 19:2  for his judgments are true and just; for he has judged the great prostitute who corrupted the earth with her immorality, and has avenged on her the blood of his servants."

Really makes you think, that time will be terrible,
but necessary.

mercy, peace, and love
Kat



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joyful1

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Re: Satellite in Zechariah
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2006, 08:13:21 PM »

Joe--
Looking at these passages we find a lot of symbolism! We are told plainly that the woman in the basket represents wickedness...why?

First of all, the ephah seems to me, to represent a tool for measuring grain--
akin to the RULE used for  measuring the temple--

and the wickedness, to me is not JUST a woman, but the fact that the woman SITS in the midst of the ephah--
the woman SITS in JUDGEMENT (measuring) the grain within the ephah--

this is wickedness that must not only be contained (by placing the lead talent on the mouth of the ephah) but must be punished by taking it to Babylon, where it will have its own pedestal.

I noted that the storlike angels take the wickedness to Babylon--
Psalm 104 has revealed MANY keys to simple terms--
Psalm 104:17 "...;as for the stork, the fir trees are her house."

Messengers from Lebanon taking the wickedness of a woman (church?) that sits in judgement of Israel, to Babylon. What do you see ?

Joyce


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hillsbororiver

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Re: Satellite in Zechariah
« Reply #5 on: October 30, 2006, 02:10:50 PM »

Hi Joyce (joyful 1),

Much of Zechariah seems to be a description of false shepherds leading astray and fleecing the flock, making merchandise of the people. This bit about the ephaph and the flying roll does show the broadcast of the evil messages and doctrines that are being sent throughout the world, their "resmblence" being shown in the midst of every house that will receive the image of them (the lying messengers of Babylon).

I can see the measure symbolism as a promise that the iniquity within the messengers and the believers in them is being dutifully recorded and weighed by God and a fair price (punishment/stripes) will be remitted.

Zechariah says to "look up" this basket (with the harlot within) will be placed between the earth and the heavens, that is where satellites are, only this one (what it represents) is particularly evil.

The entire book of Zechariah is fascinating, speaking (as so many OT books) right to the called and (by extension) chosen of the Lord as the world religious and secular "waxes worse and worse."

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe
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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: Satellite in Zechariah
« Reply #6 on: October 30, 2006, 04:23:50 PM »


Hello Joe

Thank you so much for sharing this :)...it is spine chillingly exciting :D.....Luke 21 : 28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

I went to the Message translation and got even more excited! ;D.. :D  Here it is....

Zec 5 : 1

I looked up again and saw - surprise! - a book on the wing! A book flying!
The Messenger-Angel said to me, "What do you see now?"
I said, " I see a bookflying, a huge book - thirty feet long and fifteen wide!"
He told me, "This book s the VERDICT GOING OUT WORLDWIDE against THIEVES AND LIARS.  The first half of the book disposes of everyone who steals, the second half takes care of everyone who lies. I LAUNCHED IT. (When I read I LAUCHED IT, I see the SOVEREIGNTY OF OUR GOD!)  - Decree of God-of-the-Angel-Armies- "and so it will fly into the house of every thief and every liar. It will land in each house and tear it down, timbers and stones."

This is from, Word on the Street translation....

Zec 7:8-10 God says to me again, "This is what I say, 'Give people a fair deal: give each other some breaks 'cos there's genuine love between you. Don't rip off the disadvantaged, the foreigners or the poor. Don't let negative thoughts about people fester in your souls."
Zec 8: 9-11 "You old guys who remember what the couriers said the day the HQ foundations were checked off as finished; get your hands dirty; harden them up - there's a place needs building! Up till now there were no jobs. Who can run a business when society's disintegrating into gang rule? But from today the survivors get a new deal," says God. 14-15 God says this; "When your granddads wound me up, I pulled the carpet from under them. But now I'm going to do you good. Don't loose sleep over your future.".............

GOD'S ON HIS WAY. ETA SOON. .....!

Arcturus..... :D....
« Last Edit: October 30, 2006, 04:25:11 PM by Arcturus »
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hillsbororiver

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Re: Satellite in Zechariah
« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2006, 05:13:05 PM »

Hello Arcturus,

You are very welcome, your description of "spine chillingly exciting" is exactly how I felt when this was first brought to my attention the Saturday night of the Conference weekend, I probably only slept 3-4 hours that night and was up at 3:30 the following morning reading the entire book of Zechariah which was a real eye opener, as are all the scriptures but this was truly an epiphany experience.

Thank you for the additional translations as it has given even more texture to this subject.

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe 
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gmik

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Re: Satellite in Zechariah
« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2006, 05:15:02 PM »

 8) Cool version. 8)

I loved all this scripture, but nothing convinced me that Paul Crouch can use it to say it is about TBN's satellites!

gena

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hillsbororiver

  • Guest
Re: Satellite in Zechariah
« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2006, 05:43:18 PM »

Hi Gena,

Paul Crouch and Ken Copeland were sitting in the studio with a scale model of this on the coffee table, the amazing part was that they only referenced Zec 5:1 & 5:2, and proceeded to pat themselves on the back so hard I thought they were going to break bones. They claimed the scale model represented the exact size described in Zechariah 5:2, did not seem to be aware of the verse that immediately followed;

Zec 5:3  Then said he unto me, This is the curse that goeth forth over the face of the whole earth: for every one that stealeth shall be cut off as on this side according to it; and every one that sweareth shall be cut off as on that side according to it.

That seems like an apt description of TBN.  ;)

Were their eyes blinded to the verses that followed or were they sure their followers would not check the scriptures or understand them if they did?

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe


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