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Author Topic: 1 Cor 2:2  (Read 11842 times)

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Deborah-Leigh

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1 Cor 2:2
« on: November 10, 2006, 06:21:57 PM »

When I came to this Forum I came I too....."resolved to know nothing, to be acquained with nothing, to make a display of the knowledge of nothing, and to be conscious of nothing among you except Jesus Christ the Messiah and Him crucified." 1 Cor 2:2

How does this scripture talk to you? What do you understand by it?

....I have since seen the testimonies of some, and felt the real warmth of lessons learnt and shared by the fellowship expressed here. I have been challenged to discern the difference between self agrandisement and the only motive acceptable to God...1 Cor 10:31 ...whether you eat or drink, or whatever you may do, do all for the honor and glory of God." I have seen testimony give that glory to God and it falls into line with what Ray advises in his Critique of James Kennedy Letter 2 on the home page wherein Ray states categorically:

quote.....


First, let me state my position succinctly:

1  Whatever we teach must "glorify" God

  "Glory to God in the highest..." (Lk 2:14)

  "...that in all God may be glorified..." (1Pt 4:11)

2.  Whatever we teach must not detract on iota from Ghrist's sacrifice for all humanity.

....there is one....mediator betwee God and men....Christ Jesus......" unquote


I know that the scriptures do not contradict. I understand that non of us should be sure that we are elect. Even Paul did not take his election for granted. 1 Cor 9:27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway."

I feel that I am the first in line here to say I have erred. Forgive me please.

May all glory be to our Lord. I am not the owner of my life and like Paul I should consider everything I have experienced in my life as rubbish except for Christ.This is not to say I feel ungrateful or that I reject Christs blessings that have been given to me throughout my life....on the contrary........! I thank Him and am grateful to Him

Arcturus..........



 

« Last Edit: November 10, 2006, 06:33:44 PM by Arcturus »
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orion77

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #1 on: November 10, 2006, 10:21:35 PM »

Hello Arcturus,

Good post and I also like this verse, it can bring discernment of where our or anothers faith comes from:


(Joh 5:44)  How are you able to believe, you who receive glory from one another, and the glory which is from the only God you do not seek?


I have often thought of this verse, we see this type of religion all around us everyday.  Not only do they pat each other on the back giving each other glory, but they trample on the ones who sincerely are seeking the glory of God.

Amen, all the praise and glory goes to Him.   8)

God bless,

Gary
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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2006, 03:29:11 AM »

Hello Gary

Thank you and I agrree.  The scripture you present has been surfacing into my thoughts.

My Lord has made me aware of it. It witnesses with this one from Galations too....

Galations 1:10  Now am I trying to win the favor of men, or of God? Do I seek to please men? If I were still seeking popularity with men, I should not be a bond servant of Christ the Messiah.

His special blessings to you Gary

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ned

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2006, 10:49:42 AM »

This is an excellent topic to consider, 1Cor2:2.
Here's another verse for a witness:

CEV Phi 3:8 
Nothing is as wonderful as knowing Christ Jesus my Lord. I have given up everything else and count it all as garbage. All I want is Christ.


We can say we've given up everything in this world and are living for Christ. We can even appear to others to be doing this. But this is just plain vanity to appear unto others. Jesus knows our heart. Plus, Jesus alone put the desire to live for Him in our hearts - so either the desire is there, or it is not. Each sentence of this verse has profound meanings, and returns the glory to its' Rightful Owner.

1. Nothing is as wonderful as knowing Christ Jesus my Lord.
Honestly, for any of us following Christ, is anything better than knowing Him? No. It is a blessing to know Him. And we know Him because He "dragged us (John6:44) to Him. We can only thank Him and give Him glory for the privilege of knowing Him. Now that we know Him, imagine not knowing Him? We'd be lost. This temporary life we're living would just be vanity upon vanity. I wouldn't even want to be here if I didn't know Him.

2. I have given up everything else and count it all as garbage.
For us following Jesus, what else matters? Think of your life before being called to Him. Everything evolved around the only thing you knew you were living for...you. What difference do you see now? Boy, not one thing in this life matters anymore when we have Christ to live for.  When we're living for Him, everything else that needs to happen in our worldly state is taken care of by God. He promised this, and He is faithful to deliver. Wow!

3. All I want is Christ.
Amen. I have had urges in my times only with Him to just reach out and hug Him. I'm talking a giant, bear hug. And only thanks to Him. There's not one thing I've done to earn the blessing of wanting Him in my life. His spirit touches our spirit in such a way that we know we belong to Him. What a thankworthy blessing He's bestowed upon us, His children. To want Him. 

All else is vanity.

Love,
Marie
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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2006, 12:39:43 PM »

Hello Marie

Amen to eyes that see and ears that hear......Thank you to Jesus.....quote.."Each sentence of this verse has profound meanings, and returns the glory to its' Rightful Owner. " Un quote.... Amen Marie!

Peace to you

Arcturus
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hillsbororiver

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2006, 01:23:24 PM »

Great topic Arcturus,

Your responses have been very edifying as well Gary & Marie.

It is easy to get distracted at times, our carnal nature strives for the approval of our peers while our spiritual being is consumed by growing in Him as He grows within us displacing the old nature day by day. We can be more vulnerable to this "seeking approval of men" during our "dry times" or when we feel a separation from His Spirit (even though He is ever with us) when we want recognition for a job well done or agreement in something we say or write and it is not forthcoming at that time. I have been guilty of this and I have seen others experience it as well, frustration becomes anger and we lose sight of the prize (Jesus Christ) and what our motivation should be, growing in His Spirit and helping out our brethren in their walks as well.

Col 2:8  Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

The above verse I believe speaks to what can happen when we are on a "spiritual roll" so to speak, when knowledge is easily obtained and the Word seems so clear that we can share wisdom and insight almost effortlessly, then comes the accolades or praise from others that once again can take our eyes off of the prize. We must always be aware that any wisdom or understanding we receive comes only from our Lord as He grants it, it is not of our own mind. The "dry times" are also of Him, to strengthen our spirit as we are humbled, it is a time to seek Him more fervently not to be frustrated or angry with our brethren.

When we are being tested or feel out of touch with our brothers and sisters it is important to quietly seek One on one time with Him, remembering that this is a process to complete us as His creation, Sons and Daughters of God Almighty! As such we are the clay in the Potter's Hands. What a wonderful promise.

Pro 3:12  For whom the LORD loveth he correcteth; even as a father the son in whom he delighteth.

Heb 12:8  But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye ********, and not sons.

1Pe 4:13  But rejoice, inasmuch as ye are partakers of Christ's sufferings; that, when his glory shall be revealed, ye may be glad also with exceeding joy.

Thanks for this thread,

Joe
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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2006, 02:32:51 PM »

Hello Joe

........then comes the accolades or praise from others.......

This reminds me of when Jesus went into Jerusalem on the back of the Donkey with the people screeming their approval...followed by the same people screeming ....Crucify Him Crucify Him....! (Jesus knows what is in the heart of mankind I believe then, now and tomorrow and this will grow worse until He comes again )

....Unmoved cold and to temptation no. Lord and Master of His face....others stewards of His excellence.    From Shakespear with one little alteration. Shakespear writes...unmoved cold and to temptation slow....but then Shakespear was not talking about Christ.....


any wisdom or understanding we receive comes only from our Lord as He grants it,

Absolutely ....Matt28:18...ALL authority, ALL power of rule in heaven and on earth has been given to Me.

Peace to you Joe

Arcturus  :)



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orion77

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2006, 04:10:30 PM »

Amen, good posts.

We just as Jesus have to learn obedience through suffering.  These are the times where most knowledge is gained, that propels us from faith to faith.  The true faith never has been accepted by the world, they will hate and persecute you for it.  This is a great witness to us that God is working in our lives, and it should be counted for joy.  We are in great company.  Our many elder brothers and sisters who came before us have suffered greatly for the witness of Christ and their testimonies.

God bless,

Gary
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andrevan

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2006, 08:29:54 PM »

Thanks Arcturus for this post. I have seen a number of people in the church glorifying each other for their works and talents, however nothing is from us, it's all from God.
For me 1 Cor 2:2 always stands out when I read it, it tells me to remain humble in my attitude towards my knowledge, because it is not out of my own effort but a gift from God. It tells to me to watch myself, lest I become puffed up and think I'm qualified in the Word. All my understanding needs to be built on and around Christ crucified, all glory and honor to Him, not to any person, especially myself. The moment I look to someone else for approval, the warning bells need to go off, my eyes need to be fixed on the prize as Joe mentioned, the prize is Jesus Christ.
I've been guilty of doing things for the wrong motives in the past, to please people, I'm just thankful now that God is leading me away from that and into a new understanding.

The peace of God to you all.
Andrevan.
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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2006, 09:49:11 AM »

So true Andrevan.


I even cringe when I say thank YOU when it is not the YOU I need to thank. I feel, to thank the YOU is to give the acknowledgment away from The Christ that is in YOU. This leads to sounding rude or callous, insensitive or ungrateful, or worse pious when a brother or sister extends the love of Christ or the wisdom of Christ or the council of Christ.........

The world is a heinous place that corrupts and putrifies fleshy things. The world serves up man-made traditions and customs served as delecasies that are like small morsels of self adulation and customary courtesy and politeness that says nothing, means less and burns holes that void the word of God. Surely my brothers and sisters this is the suffering we are united to bear? The pain of sight and seeing as Jesus saw this world..."nullifying and making void and of no effect the authority of the Word of God through  tradition which is in turn handed on. And many things of this kind you are doing" Mark 7:13....... We are born spiritually weak and then conditioned by the world to correct behaviour and socialization skills that void the word of God.

Gods Holy Spirit is separate and distinctly removed from such and is smelled as perfume to those who are starting to live in and through it and this is anathma to those who are glorifying the Beast.

I feel jarred to the bone as I recall hearing and singing in with the blind so called praise and worship songs that say.....We...WE WE...give You glory!  What glory can a smelly rag give to a royal purple robe wafted in the fragrance of God, distinguished by His Holy blood splashed from His Wounds and carried  into the royal purple treads of such a mantle upon the Glorious Shoulders of our King?.............................................

The eyes He gives us shows us the error of the world and the Glory that is His to the Praise of our Father!

Peace to you

Arcturus
« Last Edit: November 12, 2006, 10:11:59 AM by Arcturus »
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hillsbororiver

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2006, 10:51:53 AM »


I feel jarred to the bone as I recall hearing and singing in with the blind so called praise and worship songs that say.....We...WE WE...give You glory!  What glory can a smelly rag give to a royal purple robe wafted in the fragrance of God, distinguished by His Holy blood splashed from His Wounds and carried  into the royal purple treads of such a mantle upon the Glorious Shoulders of our King?.............................................


Good morning Arcturus,

Although there is some merit in what you say here, especially when applied to those still carnal and unrepentant but His elect have been purified by faith in His blood and are no longer seen by God as being in filthy rags.


Rev 1:5  And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

Rev 7:14  And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

You are absolutely on the mark when you say our own righteousness is as filthy rags but once His Spirit is within us the Father sees us through the blood of His Son, blameless.


Phi 3:6  Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.

Phi 3:9  And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

1Jo 1:7  But1161 if we walk4043 in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe


 




 
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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2006, 12:44:24 PM »

Hello Joe


I am getting it.....am getting it....but... not....not ...quite there yet!..I want it GET IT!

Rev 7:14  And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

I have come out of Mystery Babylon.  Can I ....may I....believe.... I...me...Arcturus.....has come out of great tribulation too? ...the tribulation that is coming that is.....If so then although MY trials and tribulations be DAILY....I AM as a believer....PROTECTED by God Himself and I will be kept from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world. Rev 3 : 10-11   


............His elect have been purified by faith in His blood and are no longer seen by God as being in filthy rags......


....His elect....have been....HAVE BEEN....Joe is this done or is it future....?... For me I really truly feel that I am not purified yet >:(  I am still washing....


Phi 3:9  And be found in him,
....[/color]

He is with me. I recieve gifts from Him......But I am not yet found....the first resurection has not happend for me yet. He is still coming.....When He comes if I am raised up in the first Resurection then I will be found in Him. If not, I  will be with King David and Abraham lining up for the White Throne....not found in Him but yet outside. I do not want to be outside! I do not know if I am inside out right now :-\  All I know is that He knows and I don't ???

Phi 3:9  And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ,

....not having my own righteousness....but that.....through the faith OF Christ....

Not my faith being sufficient but His in which I hope....will elect me to be raised in the first resurrection....By His election.... :o

I totally hear you Joe about knowing my election and calliing...but I truly feel it is not a done, completed deal yet and can only be once Jesus seals it and finishes it....and this for me is not now but ahead....my prize....for which I run.....

Do you see that I am on the wrong track?.....I am addressing you in the relative sence. I know and percieve that you neither see
me in a right or wrong way but in a blameless one as does the Father. I just feel it is wrong in an absolute way, to think or assurme or presume that anyone is Elect ahead of Christ to whom this unveiling is given supremely to Him at a time appointed by God alone of which even Christ does not know the time or day.

I think it is foolish to think any are Elected or to make anyone think they are the Elect, without having eyes to see the heart of man as Christ does. I can not see your heart Joe. In the White Throne Judgement all aims, motives and works will be revealed.
Rev 20 : 13.....Am I out of line here Joe....If so I sincerely appologise...SINCERELY....!...and I do not want to bring ANY division. I believe we are all here in this Forum, as His children and that He is leading us and tendering us as a Shepherd with His lambs.......Joe I do not mean any disrespect at all.....I do not mean any offence at all.........

I have tried to answer your post that challenges me and my responce I hope you see is  in a spirit of open candid straight talk.  I am not at a point where I  believe that I can know who Christ has appointed as His elect, me included. Where I am now is that  I have  hope. I want to hear His words "Well done " to me Joe. I truly do!  I believe the faith is HIS alone that can make it happen. Mine is the hope....not doubting the power of His faith....but hoping that He will choose me and cause me to be faithful to Him alone........................As this happens the consequence is His love is shed abroard in our hearts and spills over into the love we bear for one another.....

With reverance Joe

Arcturus....seeing only in part.....






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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #12 on: November 12, 2006, 04:59:56 PM »

Hello Joe

Just to clarify....I wrote...I just feel it is wrong in an absolute way, to think or assurme or presume that anyone is Elect ahead of Christ to whom this unveiling is given supremely to Him at a time appointed by God alone of which even Christ does not know the time or day.  What I mean to say here is, I think it is an error to assume or presume that anyone is Elect ahead of Christ.....I mean ahead of Christs unveiling His Elect.....not ahead of Christ per se.....Of course I do know that no one....certainly NO ONE HERE thinks or presumes such nonsence!

Also Joe, I appologize...please forgive me....I said ... I know and percieve that you neither see
me in a right or wrong way but in a blameless one as does the Father.
I should not say I KNOW and PERCIEVE that YOU....ANYTHING  I do not know or percieve you Joe...only God does.....I am so sorry Joe.....Please forgive me all of you who have read this. It is arrogance ...... All I have to go on is what you say to me or write to me and in that only I can respond..........and question and ask and hopefully learn.......


Arcturus....
« Last Edit: November 12, 2006, 05:09:22 PM by Arcturus »
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hillsbororiver

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2006, 05:43:49 PM »

Hello Arcturus,

I see no need of apology, these types of discussions are iron sharpening iron.

We are admonished to "run the race" seeking the prize at the finish line, do we not run this race with the hope and faith that we will win? Do we run with a blase' defeatist attitude that pardons and excuses a lackluster (read lukewarm) ready made justification for failure?

Of course I do not know for sure whether or not I have been chosen by Him to be of the elect, none of us do, but does that mean that I should not hope and pray for it, that it is prideful to consider that it is possible? Is it sinful or presumptuous to follow the admonishments to the elect?

Arcturus, my original response was in regard to our ability and justification in giving Him (heartfelt) praise, here is what is written;

Heb 13:15  By him therefore let us offer the sacrifice of praise to God continually, that is, the fruit of our lips giving thanks to his name.
 
Heb 13:16  But to do good and to communicate forget not: for with such sacrifices God is well pleased.

Any praise or any good thing at all comes not from me or anyone but through our Lord and Saviour, the Father sees this through the blood of Him who has given us salvation, anything that is worthwhile eminates from Him who is within us.

1Pe 4:10  As every man hath received the gift, even so minister the same one to another, as good stewards of the manifold grace of God.
 
1Pe 4:11  If any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God; if any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth: that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ, to whom be praise and dominion forever and ever. Amen.

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe



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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2006, 07:29:01 AM »

Hello Joe


To respond to your post to me I have had to slave for the answer!........ :D

1 Peter 4:11….let him speak as the oracles of God….

You write…”We are admonished to “run the race” seeking the prize at the finish line….

Reply:

Firstly, I see this prize in one of two ways …..I do not assume to know which way you see this prize or which way anyone of us may see it but there are two ways in which this prize may be seen. Just like there are one of two ways we are judged…now or White Throne. The scriptures do not contradict. Regarding the prize I see it also in one of these two ways, a or b. First:

a)   Matt 20 : 21 –28  And He asked her, What do you wish? She answered Him, Give orders that these two sons of mine (James and John) may sit, one at Your right hand and one at Your left in Your kingdom.  22. Do you NOT REALIZE what you are asking? ARE YOU ABLE to drink the cup that I am about to drink and to be baptized with the baptism with which I am baptised? They answered, We are able…..(sounds to me like when Peter told Jesus He would never deny Him!)
He said to them, You will drink My cup BUT seats at My right and at My left are not Mine to give, but they are for those for whom they have been ordained and prepared by My Father.

These words were spoken before Jesus drank the cup that He anguished sorely over in the Garden of Gethsemane…..that same cup that the Mother of James and John blithely agreed to drink and was granted without obtaining any assurance of getting the status, rank and position for her sons next to Christ. Drinking the same cup as Christ does not guarantee the same status as Christ, or even the ones next to Him!

I notice what Jesus said to the remaining 10 disciples who were indignant after hearing of this ambition and aspiration to be made high, separate and distinctly above them and herein is the other way to “run the race”.

b)   Jesus said…You know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their great men hold them in subjection tyrannizing over them. 26. NOT SO SHALL IT BE AMONG YOU….whoever wishes to be GREAT AMONG YOU must be your servant. 27. Whoever wishes to be FIRST AMONG YOU must be your slave. 28 JUST AS the Son of Man came to serve and give His life.

Is the prize to be great and first? Then the race is to serve and be a slave.

Is the prize to sit on the left or right of Christ? Then the runner is a fool who has not a clue or the desire to either serve or be a slave.

You ask…”do we not run this race with the hope and faith that we will win?”Reply……Yes. If we run as fools, ambitious to win. I find only two places in my Concordance where win is mentioned.  2 Chr 32 : 1  After these things, and the establishment thereof, Sennacherib king of Assyria came, and entered into Judah, and encamped against the fenced cities, and thought to win them for himself.” ( Ie Ambition like the Mother of James and John. )With the king of Assyria note; vs 8 “With him is an arm of flesh; but with us is the Lord our God to help us, and to fight our battles.”

Compare Paul…what he, NOT how he….WHAT he proposes to “win”….(HOW requires self following laws. WHAT requires focus, eyes set on Christ alone. Paul had his eyes set on Christ and Christ alone)

Phil 3 : 8  Yes, furthermore, I count everything as loss compared to the possession of the priceless privilege, the overwhelming preciousness, the surpassing worth, and supreme advantage of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord and of progressively becoming more deeply and intimately acquainted with Him (…the race set before us….becoming acquainted…becoming as and like Christ as a servant and a slave….)of perceiving and recognizing and understanding Him more fully and clearly (…the prize…perceiving, recognizing and understanding Him)…For His sake I have lost everything and consider it all to be mere rubbish, refuse, dregs, in order that I may win, gain Christ. 9 And that I may actually be found and known as in Him, not having any, self-achieved (King of Assyria victory)….righteousness that can be called my own based on my obedience to the law’s demands (1050 commands in the NT for Christians to obey!) ritualistic uprightness and supposed right standing with God thus acquired) but possessing that genuine righteousness, which comes through faith of Christ, the truly right standing with Gold, which comes from God by faith.

 If we run as slaves and we serve by laying down our ambitions, then we are great and first.

You ask…”Do we run with a blasé defeatist attitude that pardons and excuses a lacklustre (read lukewarm) ready made justification for failure?

Reply…Yes. If we run as fools.
      No, if we run as servants and slaves among one another as siblings and then we are great and first and made so only by God.

You write…”Of course I do not know for sure whether or not I have been chosen by Him to be of the elect, non of us do….
Reply…That was my point. The whole point and nothing but the point. God  ordains and prepares. Jesus knows His sheep and His sheep know and follow His voice. We do not know if we are His elect. We know only His voice.

You ask…”…does that mean that I should not hope and pray for it…
Reply…No…no….NO. Jesus says it this way…Luke 21 : 36..Keep awake then and watch AT ALL TIMES be discrete, attentive, and ready, PRAYING that you may have the full strength and ability ..(John and James mother blithely said they had the ability to drink the cup Jesus shed blood in anguish to drink!)…Praying that you may have the full strength and ability to be accounted worthy to escape a) all the things coming on the world and b) to STAND in the presence of the Son of Man. We should pray for the means, not the goal, the strength not the result of the strength, the endurance not the object of that endurance, the love not the possession of that love that is Christ…not to possess Christ but to be Christ-like with joy, peace, patience, gentleness, kindness, goodness, faithfulness and self control to be strong and to have therefore this strength and ability…that is the goal that conceals the prize itself that will result in us being counted worthy to stand in the presence of Christ once fully conformed into HIS IMAGE. The result is Christ…..

Luke 10 : 19,20  Behold! I have given you authority and power to trample upon serpents and scorpions, and physical and mental strength and ability over all the power that the enemy possesses; and nothing shall in any way harm you. 20 Nevertheless, do not rejoice at this, …….but rejoice that your names are enrolled in heaven…. (How….Who? Those who serve and slave)

You ask…”Is it  sinful or presumptuous to follow the admonishments to the elect?
Reply…There are 1050 commands in the NT for Christians to obey. I can only list 800 because many are repetitions. Is it sinful or presumptuous to follow the admonishments you ask….I believe it is sinful, presumptuous and foolish to think we are able to. …and Yes even sinful and presumptuous  if we are motivated by Law through a James John or Mother’s ambition to try! The way to take up our cross and follow is… serve and slave…..then only are we great and first.  Outside of faith and the desire to become acquainted, to recognise and understand and  imitate Christ, all is sin, pride and self serving…is refuse as Paul wrote in Phil 3 : 8…and he said that about EVERYTHING.

Is it sinful or presumptuous to follow the admonishments to the elect? you ask…..I believe NO…. it is refuse, rubbish to follow admonishments to the elect. It is a consequence that you will follow the admonishments to the elect if your goal is to imitate Christ…to desire to become acquainted and to recognise and understand HIM.  Every thing else is refuse. You will follow the ten commandments if you love the Lord your God with all your heart. If the Lord is your Shepherd then you will not want. If the Lord is your Shepherd then you will lie down in green pastures. If the Lord is your Shepherd then you will be beside the still waters, He will restore your soul etc….The Lord is our Shepherd and He is our King….. we who serve and slave. His face is set against the proud of heart………….Does that make Jesus Christ two faced? No! Jesus planted the tree of life. Of that tree we are to know recognize and acquaint ourselves with knowing and recognising that  there is God and Mammon….that there are two Judgments…that there is good and evil…. a correct way and an incorrect way….that there is righteousness and unrighteousness. That it is Gods will that we be righteous and His plan that we come to know recognise and understand the difference. That we are made in His image to know and be made able, by God,   to distinguish between good and evil………………….

I am in Chorus with you as you say…”Any praise or any good thing at all comes not from me or any one but through our Lord and Saviour….anything that is worthwhile emanates from Him who is within us…..” Amen to that!

In line with 1 Peter 4 :10….as I have received the gift to write this, and it is a gift and privilege to (oracle…..3051 neut of 3052 and utterance (Of God); - oracle.  3052 from 3056; fluent, ie an orator; - eloquent. 3056 log-os; from 3004 something said  including the thought, by impl. A topic, subject of discourse, also reasoning,{ the mental faculty} or motive; by extens. A computation; spec.( With the art. In John) the Divine Expression. (ie Christ);- account, cause, communication, x concerning, doctrine, fame, x have to do, intent, matter, mouth, preaching, question, reason +  reckon, remove, say (-ing), shew, x speaker, speech; talk, thing, + none of these things move me, tidings, treatise, utterance, word, work.

So Joe, ….. not as iron against iron…..  but rather as one to another…as  good stewards of the manifold grace of God…..Peace to you

Arcturus….
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hillsbororiver

  • Guest
Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2006, 02:22:20 PM »

 Arcturus,

 I think we are to live, act and believe we have the hope of being among the elect, this is what I am seeing. If we attribute the trials and tribulations to our Lord and our Father in heaven, is it not appropriate to consider ourselves (day by day) His Sons and Daughters? Not saying anyone should feel secure that they have made it, or have definitively been "chosen" but that we should live as one that has the hope of attaining this reward?
 

 Hebrews 12

 5And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:

 6For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

 7If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

 8But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye ********, and not sons.


 I see the Word admonish us to seek and hope for this great reward.


 Romans Chapter 15

 10And again he saith, Rejoice, ye Gentiles, with his people.

 11And again, Praise the Lord, all ye Gentiles; and laud him, all ye people.

 12And again, Esaias saith, There shall be a root of Jesse, and he that shall rise to reign over the Gentiles; in him shall the Gentiles trust.

 13Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost.
 

 1 Corinthians 9

 24Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.

 25And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

 26I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:


 Colossians 3:12

 12Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;



1John 3

 1Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.

 2Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

 3And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.



Ephesians Chapter 1 speaks of this hope as a forgone conclusion, the Is, Was, Will Be nature of our God as he sees us through the blood of our Lord.

 Ephesians 1

 1Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:

 2Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

 3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

 4According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

 5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

 6To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

 7In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

 8Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;

 9Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:

 10That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:

 11In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:

 12That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

 13In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

 14Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

 15Wherefore I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus, and love unto all the saints,

 16Cease not to give thanks for you, making mention of you in my prayers;

 17That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:

 18The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

 19And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power,

 20Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,

 21Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:

 22And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,

 23Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

 Joe

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Deborah-Leigh

  • Guest
Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2006, 04:45:12 PM »

Hello Joe



You say:
I think we are to live, act and believe we have the hope of being among the elect, this is what I am seeing.

1 Cor 10:24  Let no one then seek his own good and advantage and profit, but rather each on of the other, let him seek the welfare of his neighbor.

The above Scripture is what I see regarding serve, slave and trust rather than hope, believe and expect to be elelct.

2 Cor 5 :10 For we must all appear and be revealed as we are before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive his pay according to what he has done in the body, whether good or evil, considering what his purpose and motive have been and what he has achieved, been busy with, and given himself and his attention to accomplishing.

Eph 5 : 10 And try to learn in your experience what is pleasing to the Lord, let your lives be constant proofs of what is most acceptable to Him.

Eph 5 : 1 Be imitators of God, copy Him and follow HIS EXAMPLE

1 Peter 2 : 23 When He was reviled and insulted, He did not revile or offer insult in return, when He was abused and suffered, He made no threats of vengeance, but he trusted Himself and everything to Him Who judges fairly. (This is not to say that Jesus did not upbraid and expose those who contradict God and His word and Scripture! ....Ref. Ray's article:"You Fools! You Hypocrites! You Snakes!")

Rom 5 : 10 For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, it is much more certain now that we are reconciled, that we shall be saved daily, delivered from sin's dominion through His resurrection life.

You ask; If we attribute the trials and tribulations to our Lord and our Father in heaven, is it not appropriate to consider ourselves (day by day) His Sons and Daughters?  It is appropriate BUT IT IS NOT A gurantee.

E-mail to ray on March 15, 2006 Faith. quote..... .... not everyone who is chosen "endures to the end." It is not enough to be both called and chosen. There is also a third necessary ingredient. We must not only be called and chosen, but we must also be "faithful."

Rev 17:14  These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Judas was "chosen," but Judas was not "faithful... to the end."
   unquote

It is appropriate to recognise that our names are written in the book of life as we imitate Christ. Eph 5 : 1...when we see that the spirits are subject to us we should Luke 10 : 20...not rejoice at this, that the spirits are subject to you, but rejoice that your names are enrolled in heaven.

Rom 9 (The Message)... God (in the case of Rebecca) made it perfectly plain that His purpose is not a hit-or-miss thing dependent on what we do or don't do, but a sure thing determined by His decision, flowing steadily from HIS INITIATIVE.  God told Moses
" I'm in charge of mercy. I'm in charge of compassion."  Compassion doesn't originate in OUR BLEEDING HEARTS, or moral sweat, but in God's mercy. The same point was made when God said to Pharaoh, "I picked you as a bit player in this drama of MY SALVATION POWER." All we are saying is that GOD has the FIRST WORD, initiating the action in which WE PALAY OUR PART for good or ill. Are you going to object?............................."unquote

You write:Not saying anyone should feel secure...   RIGHT! ...THAT... is my point!

You continue....but that we should live as one that has the hope of attaining this reward?

Joe I can walk with you up to...we should live as one that has the hope....Then I stop and you continue...I agree, we should live as one's who have and share the hope in belief that Jesus came to do the Father's Will John 5:30, Jesus came to save all John 12:47 Jesus led captivity captive Eph 4: 8-12, Jesus is able tosave to the uttermost Heb 7:25 Jesus has all in His hands and is Savior of all 1 Tim 4 :9-11 Jesus is ransom for all 1 Tim 2:6 Jesus tasted death for everyone Heb 2:9 Jesus set creation free Rom 8:18,20 Jesus subdues all unto Himself Phil 3 :21 jesus restores all things Acts 3 :20,21 Jesus will give life to all Father gives Him Jn 17.2 Jesus died for all 2 Cor 5:15 Jesus wil be worshipped by all Rev 5:13. therefore hope in Christ alone...not the reward!

For me Joe, before we can get to any reward we have to do the work. One of my favourite Scriptures is  John 6 : 28, 29..What are we to do, that we may habitually be working the works of God: What are we to do to carry out what God requires? (Follow 1050 NT commandments?.......)Jesus replied,....THIS IS THE WORK, SERVICE that God asks of you; that you BELIEVE in the One Whom He has sent, that you cleave to, trust, rely on, and have faith in His Messenger. (Amplified)

I know that I am predestined by God. Does this mean I should give up and bury my tallents. NO! I believe that Rom 14:11-12 All of us shall be presented at the dais of God....Consequently then each of us shall be giving account concerning Himself to God.

I do not desire to say when I get there that I lived my life to get the reward. I prefer to say I lived my life to believe in Christ, to become like Him and where ever You gave me the Grace, Mercy and Unmeritted Favor to experience Christ in me, that was my reward and I am here now with you God to say THANKYOU face to face! I pray that my account is Thank you, Thank you, THANK YOU GOD AND FOREVER THANKS TO YOU.  That Joe is my personal hope....for which I pray for the strength to be accounted worthy. Only God can make me faithful.

This is how I see it and this is what I hope for, for myself and all my brothers and sisters. This is my prayer for us all....and I know God is faithfull to perform it :D

All the scriptures you so kindly were CAUSED to post....confirm and I believe do not contradict.

Peace to you

Arcturus :)

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Andy_MI

  • Guest
Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2006, 05:06:15 PM »

Hi Arcturus,

Thank you for that very edifying post!

I was reading in 2 Peter and seemed to go right along with what you are saying.

2Pe 1:3-11 ESV
(3)  His divine power has granted to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of him who called us to his own glory and excellence,
(4)  by which he has granted to us his precious and very great promises, so that through them you may become partakers of the divine nature, having escaped from the corruption that is in the world because of sinful desire.
(5)  For this very reason, make every effort to supplement your faith with virtue, and virtue with knowledge,
(6)  and knowledge with self-control, and self-control with steadfastness, and steadfastness with godliness,
(7)  and godliness with brotherly affection, and brotherly affection with love.
(8   For if these qualities are yours and are increasing, they keep you from being ineffective or unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.

(9)  For whoever lacks these qualities is so nearsighted that he is blind, having forgotten that he was cleansed from his former sins.
(10)  Therefore, brothers, be all the more diligent to make your calling and election sure, for if you practice these qualities you will never fall.
(11)  For in this way there will be richly provided for you an entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.


Thanks again for that post.

Peace,

Andy
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hillsbororiver

  • Guest
Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2006, 05:17:52 PM »

I do not desire to say when I get there that I lived my life to get the reward. I prefer to say I lived my life to believe in Christ, to become like Him and where ever You gave me the Grace, Mercy and Unmeritted Favor to experience Christ in me, that was my reward and I am here now with you God to say THANKYOU face to face! I pray that my account is Thank you, Thank you, THANK YOU GOD AND FOREVER THANKS TO YOU.  That Joe is my personal hope....for which I pray for the strength to be accounted worthy. Only God can make me faithful.




Arcturus,

To become Christlike is the reward.

I must admit I am not really sure what you are saying as not once have I suggested that anyone knows for sure if they are of the elect, but only that we should live in the hope that we are.

Here is a portion from the Lake of Fire PartXII (God Judges the World in a Pond) [/color]

GOD IS CALLING YOU
TO BE A PART OF HIS MARVELOUS PLAN

Here is God’s plan:

"And God said, Let us make man in OUR IMAGE…" (Gen. 1:26).

"Ye [‘ye’ means ‘all of you’] therefore shall BECOME [it’s a process] perfect even has your Father which is in heaven is perfect" (Matt. 5:48).

"But as many as received Him, to them gave He power to BECOME [it’s a process] the SONS OF GOD…" (John 1:12).

"For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the SONS OF GOD" (Rom. s8:14).

"The Spirit itself bears witness with our spirit, that we are the CHILDREN OF GOD: And if children, then heirs, HEIRS OF GOD and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with Him, that we may be also GLORIFIED TOGETHER. For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. For the earnest expectation of the creature [and the whole creation] waits for the manifestation of THE SONS OF GOD" (Rom. 8:1618).

"And what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For ye ARE the temple of the living God; as God has said, I will dwell IN them, and walk IN them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. Wherefore come out from among them [‘my people’ Rev. 18:4] and be ye separate, says the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you, and will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be MY SONS AND DAUGHTERS, says the Lord Almighty" (II Cor. 6:16-18).

"But when the fullness of the time was come, God sent forth His Son, made of a woman, made under the law, To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the ADOPTION OF SONS. And because ye ARE SONS, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts crying Abba, Father. Wherefore you are no more a servant, but a SON; and if a SON, then an HEIR OF GOD through Christ" (Gal. 4:5-7).

"That ye may be blameless and harmless, THE SONS OF GOD, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world" (Phil. 2:15).

"For it became Him, for Whom are all things, and by Whom are all things, in bringing MANY SONS UNTO GLORY, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings" (Heb. 2:10).

"According as He has chosen us in Him before the disruption of the world, we to be holy and flawless in His sight, in love designating us beforehand for the place of A SON…" (Eph. 1:4, Concordant Literal New Testament).

"Behold, what manner of love the Father has bestowed upon us, that we should be called THE SONS OF GOD: therefore the world knows us not, because it knew Him not" (I John 3:1).

Now then, did God plan to call these sons? Did He have it all worked out in advance? Is there any chance of failure in bringing these Sons to glory? Let’s read it:

For whom He [GOD] did FOREKNOW, He also did PREDESTINATE to be conformed to THE IMAGE [Remember Gen. 1:26—"Let us make man in OUR IMAGE…"] of HIS SON, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom He did PREDESTINATE, them He also CALLED; and whom He called, them He also JUSTIFIED: and whom He justified, them He also GLORIFIED" (Rom. 8:29-30).

It should be noted that the verbs in this verse are in the Greek aorist tense and should more properly be translated, PREDESTINATES, CALLS, JUSTIFIES, AND GLORIFIES. This is not a past and completed act only, but a continuous process into the future.

God is calling Sons and Daughters into Glory! All that He "foreknew" He will bring to fruition. But for what purpose? To roll ‘round heaven all day? To play harps and sing gospel music for all eternity? To glut ourselves on dainty foods like some fat monarch? What is God’s first order of the day when all these SONS of God are manifested? Just what will they do? Or will they do nothing? We read part of the answer in one of the Scriptures quoted above. Let’s read a little more. There is a GRAND CHALLENGE AND MARVELOUS WORK waiting to be accomplished by the manifested SONS OF GOD:

THE WORLD IS GROANING FOR IT KNOWS NOT WHAT

"For the earnest expectation of the creation waits FOR THE MANIFESTATION OF THE SONS OF GOD" (Rom. 8:19).

Notice this verse in a few other translations:

"For the EAGER outlook of creation ARDENTLY awaits the revealing of the Sons of God" (The Emphasized New Testament).

"For the LONGING of the creation LOOKS EAGERLY for the time when [the glory of] the sons of God shall be revealed" (The Epistles of Paul by Conybeare).

"All creation is YEARNING, LONGING to see the manifestation of the sons of God" (The New Testament in Modern Speech).

Or the creation waits with EAGER LONGING for the revealing of the sons of God" (The Revised Standard Version).

"THE WHOLE WORLD IS ON TIPTOE to see the wonderful sight of the sons of God coming into their own" (Phillips’ Translation).

To be sure, it is GOD Who is telling us that the whole creation is groaning in earnest expectation. It is groaning for it knows not what, but GOD KNOWS! In other words, God is telling US, who are growing in spiritual truths, what it is that the whole world and indeed the whole creation is in desperate need of—the saving power of the Sons of God. We ARE the BODY OF CHRIST! What Christ does, he DOES THROUGH US!

WHY? Why are they waiting for the manifestation of the Sons of God? Of what value will these Sons be to them? We can see why the Sons themselves would want to be manifested as such with God their Father and Elder Brother Jesus Christ, but why would all the wicked humanity of the entire "CREATION" be "waiting in EARNEST expectation?" What in the world is taking place here?

The church teaches that after all the Sons and Daughters of God are in their glory, the rest of the world will be tortured eternally by real fire in a terrorist hellhole of hopeless doom (never mind the fact that God says "there will be NO MORE DOOM") (Rev. 22:3, Concordant Literal New Testament).

Seriously, when all the Sons and Daughters of God are manifested IN THEIR GLORY, why would the ENTIRE CREATION be awaiting this event with almost uncontrollable bated breath, excitement, and anticipation? WHY? What is it that the churches have never told you? What is God going to do with all these glorified Sons and Daughters?

You have heard enough lies, now let’s read God’s Truth. Here is one of the most profound and all-encompassing Scriptures in the entirety of the Bible:

"For the earnest expectation of the creature [creation] waits for THE MANIFESTATION OF THE SONS OF GOD. For the creature [creation] was MADE subject to VANITY [‘…surely, EVERY MAN IS VANITY’-- Psalm 39:11], NOT WILLINGLY, but by reason of Him [GOD] Who has subjected the same in HOPE. Because the creature [creation] itself also shall be DELIVERED from the bondage of corruption [corruption includes DEATH] into THE GLORIOUS LIBERTY OF THE CHILDREN OF GOD. For we know that THE WHOLE CREATION GROANS AND TRAVAILS IN PAIN together until now" (Rom. 8:19-22).

WOW! Let me point out a few marvelous things in this verse. Notice the chronological order of things in this Scripture and see how it contradicts the terrible teaching of orthodox doctrine:

First the Sons of God are manifested or shown to be what they really are—SPIRITUAL SONS OF GOD (and DAUGHTERS—II Cor. 6:18)! No longer flesh and blood. No longer subject to the pulls of a carnal mind, but True Sons in the very IMAGE OF GOD and His Son, Jesus Christ.

But what happens next? What happens to all the rest of humanity who are not sons and daughters and are not saved? What will happen to them? Just why, pray tell, are they eagerly awaiting the manifestation of these Sons and Daughters? Of what value is the salvation and manifestation of the few chosen saints to those left behind who are not saved?

The Church teaches the world that the rest of humanity will be tortured for all eternity in the lake of fire. Is that true? Is that the purpose of the lake of fire is?

Next we read what the condition of the rest of humanity is, how they got that way, and what is the solution to the problem.

"For the creature [creation] was made subject to VANITY, not willingly, but by reason of Him who has subjected the same in hope" (Rom. 8:20).

God MADE man subject to vanity. God did not ask man’s permission to do this. God did it for His own wise purpose. But God is not a fiend that takes pleasure in the failures of weak humanity. God did not make man in a condition of vanity so that most of humanity would fail of the ideal, and God would then torture most of his creation eternally, when it was He Who created them weak and subjected them to every form of vanity in the first place. God created the whole creation subject to vanity. It is, therefore, God’s responsibility to get man out of this mess.

God supernaturally made a way for the "manifested Sons of God" to conquer the flesh and the carnal mind and be formed into the very image of God with the very mind of Christ! They will be no longer subject to vanity when they are manifested. They will be no longer subject to "the BONDAGE OF CORRUPTION." They will be FREE!

And it is they who will then FREE the rest of humanity from their bondage! What was the purpose for this subjection to vanity? So that they will eternally fail and God would eternally torture them for their failure? No! Let’s read it:

God has, "subjected the same IN HOPE" (Verse 20). Wait a minute, am I saying that all of humanity, who fail to be in the first resurrection and become the manifest Sons and Daughters of God, will nonetheless still have "hope?" Is there really hope for all the lost and unsaved? How can this be? Aren’t they going to be subjected to the "lake of fire?" Yes, but there is "hope" in the lake of fire. In fact, the lake of fire is their ONLY HOPE! They will not be eternally tortured just because they did not attain to the first resurrection, but will rather be "DELIVERED!" Let’s read it:

HOPE AND BLESSED ASSURANCE IN THE DAY OF JUDGMENT

"And as it is appointed unto men ONCE TO DIE, but after this THE JUDGMENT" (Heb. 9:27).

So all creation spoken of in Rom. 8 will ultimately die. And "after" death comes "judgment." Who is in charge of this judgment and when will it take place?

"Because He [God] has appointed A DAY, in which He will judge the world [how?] IN RIGHTEOUSNESS [eternal torture is NOT righteousness] by THAT MAN Whom He has ordained [‘For the Father judges no man, but has committed ALL judgment unto the Son,’ John 5:22]; whereof He has given ASSURANCE unto ALL MEN [Gee, could this ‘assurance to ALL men … in the WORLD" be the same as the ‘hope for all creatures in ALL CREATION’ that we just read about in Rom. 8:20? And just how can there be hope and assurance for all these lost, unrepentant, unbelievers of the world? Read on…], in that He has raised Him [Jesus] from the dead" (Acts 17:31).

Notice the reason given that THE WHOLE WORLD, or the WHOLE INHABITED EARTH as some translations have it, is given "assurance." It is because Jesus Christ ROSE FROM THE DEAD! Paul plainly tells us that if Christ has not been raised from the dead, then even WE are still in our sins:

"And if Christ be NOT raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins. Then they also which are fallen asleep [died] in Christ ARE PERISHED" (I Cor. 15:17-18).

And so it is because of Christ’s resurrection that we have HOPE and ASSURANCE for a future life with GOD! And now you also have Scriptural proof that the ENTIRE CREATION which was SUBJECTED TO VANITY and CORRUPTION, NOT WILLINGLY, has "HOPE" in the same risen Christ. And the whole inhabited earth, in that day of judgment, ALSO has full ASSURANCE because Jesus Christ was raised from the dead! Do you even begin to comprehend what you are now reading in God’s Word? God’s day of judgment is a time of "hope" and "assurance."

We read that all judgment has been given unto the Son, Jesus Christ. But Jesus is not the only Judge in that day. Here is where the manifested Sons and Daughters of God come into their most important role in the salvation of all mankind, all creation, and the entirety of the creation in both the heavens and the earth:

THE SAINTS SHALL JUDGE THE WORLD

The called and chosen were born to be Judges:

"Or are you not aware that the saints [the manifested Sons and Daughters of God] shall JUDGE THE WORLD? And if the world shall be judged by YOU, are you unworthy to judge the smallest matters?" (I Cor. 6:2).

"And I saw thrones and they sat upon them, and JUDGMENT was given unto them [the saints, the manifested Sons of God]…" (Rev. 20:4).

Every man will be judged and the Saints will do the judging:

"And the sea gave up the dead which were in it: and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were JUDGED EVERY MAN according to their works" (Rev. 20:13).

JUDGES, LORDS, PRIESTS AND KINGS

The called and chosen were born to be Judges, Lords, Priests and Kings:

"If we suffer, we shall also REIGN with Him…" (II Tim. 2:12).

"And has made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall REIGN on the earth" (Rev. 5:10).

We are the church of the Living God, and what is the church in relation to Christ?

"And has put all things under His feet, and gave Him to be the Head over all things to the church, Which IS HIS BODY, the fullness of Him that fills all in all" (Eph. 1:22-23).

"For we are members of HIS BODY, OF his flesh, AND OF his bones… This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and THE CHURCH [the heavenly, not the carnal church]" (Eph. 5:30 & 32).

Whatever Christ does, WE DO ALSO, because we ARE HIS BODY! Yes, WE, the manifest Sons and Daughters of God, will JUDGE THE WORLD!

But are the saints ready, equipped, and experienced to actually judge the world by the mere fact that they accept Jesus as the Priest, Lord, King, and Judge of the world? We are part of this world until God takes us out of it. We too have need of a Priest, a Lord, a King, and a Judge.

All too many Christians accept Jesus as their Priest, Lord, King, and Judge in ceremony only. In fact, I doubt that many accept Jesus as their "JUDGE" even in a ceremonial way, let alone by actual experience OF that judgment in their daily lives.

We must first be judged ourselves if we are to became the judges of the great sea of humanity.

The entire article can be read here;

http://bible-truths.com/lake12.html

Is it wrong to want to be, hope to be, aspire to be a part of this?

It is all about becoming, being transformed into the Body of Christ, to be Christlike, to be with Him during this wondrous work of bringing ALL to the Father.

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe
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Andy_MI

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Re: 1 Cor 2:2
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2006, 05:28:23 PM »

Hi Joe,

Forgive me for jumping in here. I must say amen to what you said here:

Quote
Is it wrong to want to be, hope to be, aspire to be a part of this?

It is all about becoming, being transformed into the Body of Christ, to be Christlike, to be with Him during this wondrous work of bringing ALL to the Father.

I believe that is what God inspired Peter to write this:

2Pe 1:10 ESV
(10)  Therefore, brothers, be all the more diligent to make your calling and election sure, for if you practice these qualities you will never fall.


Peace,

Andy

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