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[Deborah-Leigh]

John 3 : 13....No one....NO ONE has EVER GONE UP TO HEAVEN but there is One Who has come DOWN FROM HEAVEN - the Son of Man Himself Who is dwells, has His home in heaven.

"Jesus said it I believe it and that is that."  someone once said.   

Right on Lisa...sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof!

Peace to you

Arcturus

[brothertoall]

Longhorn you are something else. You always make me laugh. So I guess this guy you want to kick in the nads is phony. Is that what you are trying to say?

Your silly!!!!!!

bobby

PS. still laughing

[joyful1]

Martinez--
I've read a good deal of Rick Joyner's material in the past too....as a matter of fact, I've reviewed Christian books for about 4 years now and have been exposed to just about all that "Babylon" and others have to offer...I'm not an expert on anything...but I've just had time to ponder the following...

I've always been amazed at how an experienced blind person entering a new room for the first time, can figure out where to walk and sit and what to do right off the bat.  But the fact remains that they have to rely upon:

(1) their hearing, sense of smell, taste, vibrations, sense of touch, etc.
(2) their "impressions" from echoes of their walking sticks and sometimes even "bumping into things"
(3) the guidance of others that "they trust" to help them...including their guide dogs if they have one

As spiritually blind people, I think we've all had to rely upon the same things to help us interpret the writing of God and of other people....we just didn't "get it" until our eyes were opened by God...until that happened, we relied upon:

(1) our hearing...  "faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God..." (in other words...we can't have faith until we can hear...we can't hear until "the Word of God" Jesus, comes to us and gives us "ears to hear!" While in Babylon...our hearing seems very limited, if you will...
(2) our "impressions" of what is out there as we "bounce our own sounds/words" off of them
(3) the "guidance" of others that we trust; parent, spouse, clergy, world religious leaders, etc....

I really think that myself, Rick Joyner...and many other Christian authors, from what I've read, are trying very hard to "interpret" the dark without actually having true "vision" or "sight." Some work very hard at interpreting the "things" that are out there and come close in some cases....giving you some "truth" mixed in with the "lying."  Being blind, however,they believe that they are giving you the "true picture." Do you get my point?

Now that Jesus is opening our eyes....we can really begin to "see" and discern for the first time!! This is both wonderful and frightening ....it gives us BOTH freedom....AND responsibility.....just as if someone had come along and given us the laser surgery necessary to remove physical blindness...in which case...we would then become BOTH free to move about and explore a world we'd never seen before AND RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT WE SAW!

just my thought for the day...thanks for showing me something that helped me as well!
Joyce 

[Kat]

Hi Joyce,

I 'see' what your saying 

mercy, peace, and love
Kat

[hebrewroots98]

Joyce, You are so right!!!  I AM AT A POINT IN MY LIFE TO WHERE I AM ACTUALLY BEING ABLE TO DISCERN GODS TRUTHS FOR THE FIRST TIME AND NOT ONLY THAT, BUT, AS YOU STATED, I AM BEING HELD ACCOUNTABLE BY HIM TO BACK UP MY BELIEFS AND TO 'EXPOSE THOSE WHOM CONTRADICT'.  I get so excited that HE has blessed me with dicernment finally, as I have sought after it for the past 26 years and I must say that GOD opened my eyes just this past year AMEN!!!! I have been used by HIM to correct, rebuke, encourage etc..with these new found pearls, and my husband and I are equally yoked too.  GOD IS  SO Awesome!

[joyful1]

Kat-- very intuitive-- you c-r-a-c-k me up!
Hebrewroots-- you go girl!  Joyce

[Sorin]

My neighbor called me over the other day to get a book. She wanted me to read it and told me that it had helped her so much to accept her husband's passing. the book is called "90 Minutes in Heaven". I read it and am still trying to "puzzle out" what I think about it. Has anyone read this? If so, what did you think? Much love, Jennie

Hi Jennie, I have not read it, but I wouldn't waste my time with it eighter. It sounds fake to me. Just like that Mary K Baxter fraud, who supposedly went to hell and she was walking around hell with Christ and Jesus would go up to a person in like a prison cell and is being burned by actual fire and Jesus tells him to 'be still'. While your burning in flames??? Be still?  Unbelievable!

There's one instance in where there's a fairly young female [teen years] locked in a cell and she is hugging her teddy bear while bracing herself for the inferno that comes upon all the prison cells, passes, and then comes again in a neverneding cycle. It's really sick disturbing evil stuff. Mary K Baxter is evil, more so than a liar.
I can't believe I blieved in hell and all that garbage, that was before finding bible-truths.com       Since I was a new believer, regularly attending the synagogue, I am embarrassed to admit that I actually believed her.............. 'cause I believed in hell   

Now I'm more upset with the person who gave me the book, sadly he still believes in all that crap. Thank God for opening my eyes and ears, and for Ray for writing those papers on hell. How stupid can we [the carnal minded man] be? Very stupid.


Take care,
Sorin




I can't believe I read that book, it was not the english version, but still, same lies being spewed nonetheless.

[snorky]

Basically I have stopped reading ANY book related to ANY "Christian" dogma and have stuck exclusively to reading the Bible (as well as Ray's stuff and a few other like-minded teachers over the Internet), and, instead of letting Joyner or Hagee or Lindsey or whoever "interpret" what's in the Bible I am letting the Bible "interpret itself" from discernment God has given me in the several years I have searched for the truth. Unfortunately, along with that I have had to deal with family members and former-church "friends" that can't believe I'd be so foolish as not to believe in the "rapture", "free will" and "hell for eternity", knowing full well that no matter how I use the Bible to explain the truth, God has hardened their hearts and they won't see the truth. My husband helped me get out of the church I was going to, but he just won't see the truth. He gets very upset with me when I argue humans have no free will...he really believes he chose to be a Christian on his own volition! At this point the only folks I can talk about the Bible to are those who Christendom would say are "not saved" because they are the only ones who don't believe all the bullcrap dogma!

Again I will repeat a quote above from 2 Timothy: 3-4 --"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; and they shall turn away their ears from the truth..."--Deb

[hebrewroots98]

Dear Snorky,
I seriously thought that I had written your post!  I had to check to see that the signature that was on your post wasn't by me; it sounds exactly what I AM saying and exactly what I am doing with readinig only BT and similar sites on line (and chunking the other crap  that I used to hold as truth) at this very time in my life.  Even the scripture that you used was one that I had used/shared this very week; (nothing different except the husband situation)... we are definately at the same place spiritually right now; that 's great to know that the Lord has been working the same things in each of us at the same times and we are 'strangers' (in the sence that we have never met oneanother and we probably live many miles apart.  Another AMAZING example of what and AMAZING CREATOR that we serve.  (Those words that you wrote were my sentiments exactly.)  BTW, thanks for the reminder that GOD DOES HARDEN THE HEARTS OF THOSE WHOM WILLNOT HEAR THESE TRUTHS!  For some reason I forget this at times; maybe b/c I still forget that it isn't up to me to try to 'convert' them.   

[Deborah-Leigh]

GOD DOES HARDEN THE HEARTS OF THOSE WHOM WILLNOT HEAR THESE TRUTHS!  For some reason I forget this at times; maybe b/c I still forget that it isn't up to me to try to 'convert' them. 

....and to add Sue and Deb...we would be THEM in the same circumstances! We would be Hitler or anyone else we think is less holier than moi!...Sobering, humbling corrective thoughts.....for me....    good medicine!

Peace to you

Arcturus

[hebrewroots98]

Exactly Arturus."..by Gods' grace go I.."