> Testimonies / Prayer Requests / Fellowship
A Short Testimony (Seeker 1)
hillsbororiver:
This was originally posted in the "Radio Shack" thread on the "Off Topics" Board, it is more appropriate here;
Thanks for the warm welcome, To be truthful I am looking for FRUIT, as in being a fruit inspector.. We are told to do so, even though I feel woefully unprepared to properly judge. I really hope and pray that Ray is the woderful teacher that he appears to be... His whole premise is based upon the idea that the the early Catholic church adulterated the Gospel for the MISTAKEN benefit of the hordes of unconverted Pagans who were admitted to the church after Christianity became the official state religion. I don't have much problem accepting THAT because I can see the same thing happening right before my eyes, even as we speak.
I intend to pay some Greek and Hebew scholars for their opinion on the matter of "Hell".... I will let the chips fall where they may... My wife is a History Buff and a dyed in the wool Southern Baptist, she was terrrified that I would go to hell for merely doubting the doctrinne of hell.. Funny Huh? However after a few days of trying to prove that Ray is wrong even SHE is willing to let the TRUTH be TRUTH. Praise God...
I am searching for the TRUTH, even if it means BAD NEWS for weak,carnal and despicable creatures, such as myself....
I tend to think Ray is right because of the almost volcanic eruption that occured when I even Dared to cast Doubt on the Doctrine of Eternal Hell for the majority of mankind....I was really surprised at how many people think I will go to hell for merely DOUBTING the doctrine of "Hell"... I think it strange that the The only person who was NOT horrified at my" Blasphemey" was my Pastor at our Church, which is a Conservative Baptist Church in Idaho. I told him that I would no longer teach or support the doctrine of ETERNAL punishment because of my reservations about the truth of the doctrine. I further told him that I would no longer teach it to our children in our "AWANA" class. He said that he wished WITH ALL HIS HEART that the doctrine of eternal torment was NOT true, but he THINKS it IS true...
Please don't gang up on our pastor and tell me all about how he is a self deluded fool. He really LOVES,TEACHES and PROTECTS his flock the very best he is able to...
I am sorry that so many of you have been hurt by "THE CHURCH",, but don't throw out the "Baby With The Bath Water". They may have believed a lie, but it is is very posssible that some portions of the church are on the very edge of discovering the truth!!!
Even as I write this note I have great hope that the message of universal salvation MAY BE RECEIVED by a "Hell" of a lot more "Churches" than you could have ever have believed possible.
I could be just wistfully dreaming, so forgive my ignorance .. Is there ANY Scriptures that PROVES that the mainstream Evangalical church will NOT accept the truth of eternal salvation in this eon? I think that there is a pent up FRUSTRATION with the mainstream doctrine of eternal torment and that there may be MANY Pastors who are READY to listen, if we can just plant a few SEEDS NOW.
I am here to argue and sharpen iron against iron, so DO NOT think that you will "Scare Me Away" if you tell me I am full of Dung, as St. Paul admitted when he came to the knowledge of the truth... What IS Truth? Let's reason together!!
hillsbororiver:
--- Quote from: link=topic=3506.msg26157#msg26157 date=1171452793 ---
His whole premise is based upon the idea that the the early Catholic church adulterated the Gospel for the MISTAKEN benefit of the hordes of unconverted Pagans who were admitted to the church after Christianity became the official state religion. I don't have much problem accepting THAT because I can see the same thing happening right before my eyes, even as we speak.
--- End quote ---
Good morning Seeker,
Actually this is not Ray's premise at all, here is an excerpt from the "Lake of Fire" Part 7 http://bible-truths.com/lake7.html
THE SEVEN CHURCHES ARE ONE CHURCH
Jesus says that the seven messengers and the seven churches are all, "…in My right hand…" (Rev. 1:20). ONE hand—they are all ONE.
"These things say He that…walks in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks [addressed to Epheus, but for ALL SEVEN CHURCHES]" (Rev. 2:1).
"He that has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says unto…[unto WHOM? Unto Ephesus only? No, read it] …unto the churches" [ALL SEVEN CHURCHES]" (Ver. 7).
God wants ALL the churches to hear what He addresses to Ephesus. And He wants Ephesus to hear what He addresses to Smyrna, "He that has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says unto the churches" (Ver. 11, 17, 29, 3:6, 13, 22). All the churches are to hear what is spoken to ALL the other churches.
To Ephesus, we find, "He…Who walks in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks [plural]" (Rev. 2:1), must mean that He also walks in the midst of Smyrna too, and Pergamos, and Thyatira, and Sardis, and Philadelphia, and Laodicea ALSO.
Of Ephesus we read, "…to him that OVERCOMES will I give to eat of the TREE OF LIFE…" (Ver. 7).
Do those who "overcome" in Smyrna get "a crown of life" (Ver. 10), but are NOT allowed to "eat of the tree of life?"
Can those in Pergamos who overcome "eat of the hidden manna" (Ver. 17), but are NOT allowed to "eat of the tree of life" as are those in Ephesus?
Does neither Ephesus nor Smyrna get "a crown of life" as do the overcomers of Pergamos? Are the overcomers of Thyatira given "…power over the nations," albeit, they will NOT be allowed, "…to sit down with Me [Jesus] in My throne…." as will the overcomers in Laodicea (3:21)?
Are the overcomers in Pergamos given "…a new name…" (Ver. 17), but do NONE of the other churches also get this new name? The overcomers in Sardis have Christ’s promise that, "I will NOT blot out his name out of the book of life" (3:5).
Is it Sardis ONLY that has this promise? How could Smyrna not have her name in the book of life, since she is given "A crown of LIFE?"
Are not "thy works" mentioned in ALL seven churches? Is not "overcoming" mentioned in ALL seven churches? Are not rewards promised in ALL seven churches? How could Laodicea be "lukewarm" (Rev. 3:16), except that she also "left her first love" (Rev. 2:4)? Or how could Sardis be spiritually DEAD (3:1), except that she also "left her first love?"
Does Jesus "walk in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks [plural] (Rev. 2:1), but speaks by the words of God, "…He which has the sharp sword with two edges [Heb. 4:12]…" to Pergamos only (Ver. 12)?
Does Jesus Christ, Who has "…the seven Spirits of God, and the seven stars…" (3:1), which are the seven messengers of the SEVEN churches (plural), speak by only one Spirit to one church (Sardis)? NO! Every church is admonished to "…hear what the Spirit says unto the churches."
Why should Smyrna or Pergamos listen to the Spirit’s message to Ephesus who "…left their first love?"
Is any so foolish as to think Jesus tells all seven churches to "…hear what the Spirit says to the churches" (all the other plural churches), so that they can compare themselves among themselves and see which one Jesus thinks is the holiest of them all? That is nonsense!
ALL seven churches individually, have ALL the problems and ALL the strengths of all the churches combined. It is ONE prophecy, of ONE church, in ONE hand of Jesus, which combine the characteristics of seven churches in Asia that shared all of the good qualities and all of the shortcomings. Some think that Smyrna and Philadelphia did not have any shortcomings. They did. The Scriptures prove it. We will cover that in Part VIII.
All seven churches were spiritually "lukewarm," which is like being spiritually "dead," because they all "left their first love," and they all had a members who "say they are Jews [spiritually circumcised and converted], and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan," and all the congregations of the churches of God down through the generations have been ruled over by the "Nicolaitanes."
ALL SEVEN CHURCHES HAD ALL OF THE PROBLEMS THAT EACH OTHER HAD, AND ALL OF THE CHURCHES OF GOD DOWN THROUGH THE GENERATIONS HAD ALL OF THE PROBLEMS THAT THE SEVEN CHURCHES OF REVELATION HAD. IT IS A PROPHECY OF THIS VERY CHURCH THAT EXISTS AROUND THE WORLD TODAY!
And that my dear readers is how these churches in Asia are all SYMBOLS for what the Church of God would be like from the time John saw this vision, down through two thousand years of Church history, and out into the future when Jesus purges all evil from His Church and brings them all into the Family and Kingdom of His Father!
I hope this clarifies.
His Peace and Wisdom to you,
Joe
Chris R:
--- Quote from: hillsbororiver on February 14, 2007, 08:33:13 AM ---
I am here to argue and sharpen iron against iron, so DO NOT think that you will "Scare Me Away" if you tell me I am full of Dung, as St. Paul admitted when he came to the knowledge of the truth... What IS Truth? Let's reason together!!
--- End quote ---
Hello Seeker1
No, your NOT here to argue, We do not wish to "scare anyone away" but, you will be monitored, and your posts removed if you do argue.
Thankyou
Chris R
rrammfcitktturjsp:
Seeker1,
Welcome the forum. Mods, thanks for moving this post to here, I was unaware that this post existed.
Nah, we are not scary people, only people like you learning the truth. Get ready for the time of your life here.
Look forward to getting to know you.
As to some of your premises, I wish not to comment becuase I realize that you are beginning your journey and that you will learn many things. All of us come in holding on to some last little things, becuase we do not know if it is wrong or not. Stay here learn from here and the bibletruths.com and the Truth that you are seeking after will be revealed. My word of caution though, what are you willing to do for the Truth? Many of us have faced persecution for this Truth, are you willing to face this? What this will eventually boil down to is the drinking in of the Truth from you mind into your heart. Where will you stand when it gets tough? I am saying this, becuase it WILL get hard, but please remember YOU are not alone. You have us at the forum and God will raise others in your life as he has mine. In the end you will decide whether you want to pass Go and collect the 200 dollars. Stay in the journey seeker1, and I promise looking back over my life, it is WELL worth it.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
Kat:
Hi Seeker,
It is good that you have joined us here at the forum.
It is always a wonderful feeling when you come to the knowledge of the truth.
I understand your wanting to share this truth with others. Well so you are going to try to show the Southern Baptist the truth, that should be interesting, keep us informed.
As you keep reading Ray's articles you will find lots of your questions answered. Who the church is, and why we do not have anything to do with it.
Ray has gotten thousands of emails, and has ask many to prove him wrong with two scripture proofs. No one has done so yet. His teachings are so sound, because he teaches totally what all the scripture says. One of his common statements is, 'you have to pay attention to the words,' because he does so very carefully.
So, we hope that you will find this a good place to fellowship and the get answers to some of your questions :)
mercy, peace, and love
Kat
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
Go to full version