> General Discussions

The Deaths of the Apostles

<< < (2/9) > >>

rjsurfs:
Pax.

What is the reasonable argument that the apostle John did not write Revelation?  Yes, I am aware that some debate this... but a "kajillion scholars and experts"? 

I have found no reason to doubt that the apostle John wrote Revelation.

Bobby

Prosizz:
Thanks Kat for the post.
This post should serve as reply to people who question God's love for humanity, partucilarly to those who ask why do God allows evil. The torture and death the apostles and disciples suffered in the hand of those men is a Great evil.
Definitely evil serves a grand purpose in our salvation.

Deborah-Leigh:
Hello Kat

You observed : John faced martyrdom when he was boiled in a huge basin of boiling oil during a wave of persecution in Rome. However, he was miraculously delivered from death. John was then sentenced to the mines on the prison island of Patmos. He wrote his prophetic Book of Revelation on Patmos. The apostle John was later freed and returned to serve as Bishop of Edessa in modern Turkey. He died as an old man, the only apostle to die peacefully.

John was also the only one who went to the foot of the cross. He did not run away!....

Thank you for the study.

Peace to you

Arcturus :)

Jennie:
Amazing to see them all grouped togethr that way. I would like to say that I could be as steadfast as they were but I don't know.
In regard to wearing a cross as jewelry I know some just consider a fashion statement but it means a little different to me. I have 2 crosses. One is on a little tiny chain with a cross, a heart and a single pearl on it. It was given me when I was 13 and beginning the next nightmare of abuse. The cross was to remind me that Jesus loves me and is always there with me, the heart was to remind me that I was loved so much  and the pearl to remind me that God can make a thing of beauty out of hardship. Ya'll know how a grain of sand gets into an oyster and it hurts but the pearl is formed.
The other cross I have is from my Michael. He gave it to me on our first Christmas. I wouldn't marry him without telling him that I had been sexually abused because I did not think that was fair to him to have a damaged wife. The little cross is in the middle of a circle and he wanted it to remind me whenever I looked at it that he loved me so much and I wasn't damaged in his eyes.The cross was to remind me of God's love and the circle around it to remind me that God's love and Michael's love is forever. So because of all that I have a little different view of wearing a cross. Jennie

Pax Vobiscum:
Bobby,

From the looks of the entries in this thread, this may be out of place.  I will, therefore be brief...

As Early as the 3rd century, the shared authorship of the Fourth Gospel and the Book of Revelation has been seriously doubted.  Actually, it is not as much who wrote these pieces as much as it is agreed that the same person did not write these books.

Perhaps it is more correct to say that John the son of Zebedee could have been the author of Revelation because it is most likely that he did not pen the Gospel which traditionally bears his name.

The Book of Revelation bears no resemblance to the Fourth Gospel or the Epistles of John.  The grammar is different, word usage and other comparisions of literary criticism makes the likelihood of shared authorship mighty slim.

So, in short, we have the Fourth Gospel which does not claim to be written by a person named John, is called The Gospel of John while the Book of Revelation does claim to be written by someone named John.  Biblical irony.

But while the writer of Revelation occasionally mentions "the apostles" he never indicates that he is one of them.  Now look at other Epistles and notice how the authors introduce themselves.  Curious.

Even moreso in Chapter 4 of Revelation, the prophet sees 24 elders around the throne of God.  Most folks (perhaps you are not among them) have long considered these people to be the Jewish Patriarchs and the twelve apostles -- one of whom would have been John, son of Zebedee.  The author make no mention or even hints that he is seeing himself at the throne of Almighty God! 

I don't know about you, but if I had a vision/visit like the writer of Revelation and was shown that I would be among the honorees at the foot of God, I would probably mention that tidbit.  I'd probably have a T-shirt made up for the occasion!

Most (half a kajillion??) references put most of the parts of Revelation as written in the 60s CE.  This puts Nero as the leader of Rome (depending on who one counts as the first ruler).  There are those that claim that the book was not completed until  about 95 CE because (this will not go over well with some here) Jews in Rome used the code word "Babylon" to refer to Rome as the chief political enemy of God after the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 CE!

This got much lengthier than I had intended and I apologize -- the main question is, what difference does it make if it is shared authorship or not?

Early Christianity happens to be an interest of mine and an area where I posess some very, very modest expertise.   I thought it would be an interesting aside to the initial post.

I would certainly recommend David Aune's The New Testament in Its Literary Environment or What Are They Saying About the Book of Revelation by Pilch.

I hope I did not cause anyone to stumble.

Peace

Navigation

[0] Message Index

[#] Next page

[*] Previous page