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Author Topic: The Kiss of Death  (Read 9252 times)

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hillsbororiver

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The Kiss of Death
« on: May 08, 2007, 08:34:25 PM »


Any and all comments, opinions, experiences and observations on the subject of this article will be appreciated,

"THE KISS OF DEATH"

[Is your love pure or fake?]

I hear a lot of "huggie huggie kissie kissie" pious platitudes from the mouths of today’s religious hobbyists. Personally, it makes me a little ill in my midsection. Most of it is as phony as a three-dollar bill. Could you be guilty of using this emotional charade to deceive those you wish to impress?

There is nothing wrong with hugs, as I am quite fond of them myself. And there is nothing wrong with proper kissing. Paul instructs the assemblies to greet each with "an holy kiss" four times, and Peter instructs its use once, as a "kiss of charity."

The Greek word used is "philema." A "holy" kiss is merely a pure, sacred, ceremonial kiss—a simple kiss. Men no longer kiss men as a form of greeting non-family members in most western cultures—I’m personally kinda glad of that!

People also engage in "hugs and kisses" in their speech and writing. And this too can be fine and acceptable depending upon how it is done. At sixty-five, I still put a few xxxx’s and oooo’s at the bottom of a birthday card to my wife.

However, there is another way that hugs and kisses are used and overdone in which it is a camouflaged front to mask the real person that is no more holy than was Judas.

Had the twelve other Apostles already received the Holy Spirit of God, they would not have had to ask Jesus "who" is was that was about to betray Him—they would have known. Thank God that it is not possible to "deceive the very elect" (Matt. 24:24).

Like Satan’s ministers of righteousness (II Cor. 11:15), these deceivers are wolves, but they don’t come as wolves. These false teachers and deceivers:

"…come to you in SHEEP’S clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves" (Matt. 7:15).

But you could spot one of these "wolves" a mile off, couldn’t you? Just look for the GIANT TEETH that Little Red Riding Hood encountered, right?

"O foolish Galatians, who has bewitched [Gk: ‘to fascinate by false representations] you…" (Gal. 3:1).

The "wolves" COME IN SHEEP’S CLOTHING! You don’t see their teeth. They don’t show their teeth. They only show you a huggie huggie kissie kissie pious religious smile. THAT my friends, that pious front, IS the "sheep’s clothing." Wolves BITE, and their bite can be deadly:

"But if you bit and devour one another, take heed that you be not consumed one of another" (Gal. 5:15).

Now then, where are we to find these "wolves and sheep’s clothing" coming with hugs and kisses to deceive and devour? Well, wherever the SHEEP are found.

"For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous [savage] wolves enter in among YOU, not sparing the flock. Also of your own selves shall men [and women] arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them" (Acts 20:29-30).

Didn’t we all witness this ourselves in recent months? Are all the wolves gone now? Of course not—there will always be wolves wherever there are sheep.

I’m warning you: Wolves come in "sheep’s clothing," full of smiles, and hugs, and kisses. You will not see their teeth until it is too lake.

Judas was a wolf in sheep’s clothing. The apostles saw a sheep—Jesus saw a wolf. What was Judas’ ultimate sheep’s camouflage? Why, wasn’t it a simple, sincere, pure, godly "kiss?" Think again.

"Now he that betrayed Him give them a sign, saying, Whomsoever I shall kiss, the same is He: hold Him fast. And forthwith he came to Jesus, and said, Hail, master; and kissed Him" (Matt. 26:48-49).

You have all seen this drama acted out many times in films—a simple little peck on Jesus’ cheek. Oh really?

The five Scriptures using the word "kiss" from Paul and Peter, always used the Greek word "philema" which means "kiss" and nothing else. In Luke 22:48 we read this:

"But Jesus said unto him, Judas, betray you the Son of man with a kiss [Gk: a simple ‘philema’ kiss]?"

But in Matt. 26:48, we find something totally different. Judas told the elders and chief priest:

"…whomsoever I shall [PHILEO—passionate fondness] kiss, that same is He…"

Judas did not have a "philema" kiss in mind at all. The "kiss" in Matt. 26:48 is a "phileo" kiss, and it means a fond, affectionate, passionate kiss, not a simple "philemo kiss." And the elders and high priest knew the different in these two words. One was a peck on the cheek, but Judas determined to use a more a passionate, huggie huggie kissie kissie display in his attempt to betray Jesus to the devouring and ravaging wolves.

This is really intriguing stuff. Now after Judas tells the priest and elders what kind of a kiss he will give Jesus [a phileo kiss] to betray Jesus, He actually delivers this kiss. And how does he do that? He does it with yet another Greek word for kiss, which is, "kataphileo" mean "to kiss EARNESTLY."

This "kataphileo kiss" is used three other times in Scriptures:

Luke 7:45—"You gave me no kiss [no affectionate ‘phileo’ kiss, Jesus admonishes His disciples] but this woman since the time I came in has not ceased to kiss [‘kataphileo kisses’—earnestly] My feet."

Luke 15:20—"And he [the prodigal son] arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him [earnestly and passionately with a ‘kataphileo kisses’]."

Acts 20:37—"And they all wept sore, and fell on Paul’s neck, and kissed him [with ‘cataphileo kisses’ of great passion and earnest]."

Is it not abundantly clear that this super emotional use of hugs and kisses was used only on the most RARE occasions of deep and profound emotional circumstances? But this is not proper conduct for everyday behavior. See these over-pious charlatans for what they are. Be suspect of those who use super-pious and sanctimonious hugs and kisses every day of the week.

Now to the Judas Kiss of Death:

"And forthwith he came to Jesus, and said, Hail, Master; and KISSED HIM."

The Greek is "kisses"—multiple kisses, with ‘kataphilio kisses, just as we find in every single use of this word in Scriptures I showed above.

No, Judas did not betray Jesus with a peck on the cheek; he deceitfully delivered a "huggie huggie kissie kissie, fraudulent hugs and KISSES OF DEATH!

What must we learn from all this? Whenever we pretend to be Christ-like but it’s all a charade, we too are guilty of giving Christ a Judas kiss of death. What a disgusting display of the carnal mind and flesh, Judas has left us. Some have vengeance in their heart, others vanity, others bitterness and hatred, and yet others uncontrollable sins of the flesh, but they try to camouflage their evils with a plethora of hugs and kisses to all.

Don’t be afraid to hug; don’t be afraid to kiss, but beware of such phony displays of pious emotions, as they could be your "KISS OF DEATH."

A spiritual hug to you all, from my heart,

Ray

http://bible-truths.com/kiss.htm
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Jackie Lee

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2007, 10:10:11 PM »

I'll take the spiritual hug.  :D
When I was in the church I recieved many fake hugs I knew they were fake, especially when you see them at the supermarket or the Walmart and didn't recognize you and you knew you looked the same showered and the works. Lol
Has this ever happened to anyone you know?
I do believe the church served its purpose in my life though The beginning of church was my search for truth.
I have found many truths but have a long way to go.
I am slow at this but God reveals a little more all in his time.
I would like to be one of the elect but I seriously doubt it until I recieve more truth.
I am just happy I am learning even though it is very slow, I am trying to be patient.
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rick

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2007, 10:19:54 PM »

what is even worse than the fake hugs????? once i came out, when i see my former brothers and sisters in Christ they usually turn and go the other way or just walk past me and not speak at all. the latest rumor is that I am in a cult (heading for hell) but no one has come to rescue me even though many were some of my best friends. go figure!!!! i still say knowing the truth is a fiery trial!!!!..........rick
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Jackie Lee

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2007, 10:26:02 PM »

Exactly rick I understand what you are saying.
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skydreamers

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2007, 10:50:24 PM »

Personally I love to give hugs and be hugged.  I can be extremely affectionate, and I think this comes from my European (German) mom and grandparents.  I lived in Germany several times as a child, and over there it is common to touch the person you are talking to in some way, shake hands, and give hugs and cheeks kisses as greetings and goodbyes.  Needless to say, I think I have made people uncomfortable here in Canada when I greet them the same way...especially if I really like someone, I always want to hug them.  So as I've gotten older, I've lost some of this because of most of the responses I get, and instead lavish hugs and kisses on my husband and children.  I always welcome it when someone wants to hug and don't really concern myself with whether or not it is sincere...It never occurred to me that a hug could be fake or insincere... :D!! ::)  Call me naive I guess ;D!

Peace,
Diana

(I do however think that what Ray points out in the above article is extremely interesting...I just had never thought of it that way before...)
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hillsbororiver

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #5 on: May 09, 2007, 11:16:56 PM »

I experienced a little of the forced affection in some of the churches I passed through and it made me very uncomfortable, I really thought there was something wrong with me, too jaded, too suspicious.

Right here in this Forum I have seen virtual hugs and declarations of an unconditional agape love from some only to see it turn into bitter divisiveness and even slander when there was a disagreement, usually over matters that could have been eventually resolved between reasonable seekers of Truth, but pride reared its head and reason was sacrificed on the alter of vanity.

Also I have seen others attempt to draw folks into their own circle with words appealing to one's ego laced with murmuring that put Bible Truths and this Forum in the worst possible light, we are not perfect but there are no ulterior motives here, our only motive is to learn and share His Word and understanding. I know this is all a part of our journey and wherever there are those who gather in His name then will come the wolves seeking to devour as many of the flock that stray.

This is an incredibly interesting journey and I thank the Lord for the sincere members of our fellowship here.

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe     
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Jackie Lee

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2007, 02:20:13 AM »

I really think words are cheap and so are hugs when it involves people that hardly know each other.
It is too bad that people let egos get in the way of their spiritual growth.
I know this happens in the church and also in real life.
I seldom tell anyone I love them but the ones that know me know I do.
I really have learned from Ray's teaching and this board but I don't get close to people very easy.
In some ways I am glad for this because I depend on God more than friendships.
In other ways It has been a very lonely life.
I have had potential for  friends but they distract me in my work and in my study.
I know I am the weirdest and feel it too, but I don't like to get involved in cliques.
I often wonder what my life would have been like if I had been more open to friendships.
When I have noticed just about all friendships end at some point.
I am rambling not sure if this even relates please delete if this is for no purpose.



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Kat

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2007, 10:28:43 AM »


Hi Joe,

This article of Ray's brought out to me a very real point.  That there are those that the elect must be wary of.

-------------------------------------------------------
The "wolves" COME IN SHEEP’S CLOTHING! You don’t see their teeth. They don’t show their teeth. They only show you a huggie huggie kissie kissie pious religious smile. THAT my friends, that pious front, IS the "sheep’s clothing." Wolves BITE, and their bite can be deadly:

"But if you bit and devour one another, take heed that you be not consumed one of another" (Gal. 5:15).

Now then, where are we to find these "wolves and sheep’s clothing" coming with hugs and kisses to deceive and devour? Well, wherever the SHEEP are found.

"For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous [savage] wolves enter in among YOU, not sparing the flock. Also of your own selves shall men [and women] arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them" (Acts 20:29-30).
-----------------------------------------------------

I too remember the fakeness that many showed while in the church.
But now that I have been having my eyes opened, I also have to seek God guidance for discernment, as to who is really like minded.  Some who read at BT and so glad they have found the truth and come here to fellowship and I'm always happy to see someone having their eyes open. 
But I can look back and see some that came here were really friendly and joined in the fellowship, and we were seeing only their sheep's clothing and sometimes they were here like that for months.  But when they began to hear the meat of the Word, they began to bite, and some get hurt by this.  I say this only in looking back. 
It's like the parable of the sower and the seed, not all that have the Word of truth sown in them will grow and bear fruit.

Mat 13:3  Then He spoke many things to them in parables, saying: "Behold, a sower went out to sow.
v. 4  And as he sowed, some seed fell by the wayside; and the birds came and devoured them.
v. 5  Some fell on stony places, where they did not have much earth; and they immediately sprang up because they had no depth of earth.
v. 6  But when the sun was up they were scorched, and because they had no root they withered away.
v. 7  And some fell among thorns, and the thorns sprang up and choked them.
v. 8  But others fell on good ground and yielded a crop: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.
v. 9  He who has ears to hear, let him hear!"
   
We all need to seek the guidance of the Holy Spirit, and for me that comes in staying in the Word and through pray, so that we will not be deceived.  There are those who come here, that are wolves in sheep clothing.

1Pe 5:8  Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour.

mercy, peace, and love
Kat


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hillsbororiver

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2007, 10:59:12 AM »

Amen to that!

His Peace to you,

Joe
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YellowStone

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2007, 11:13:13 AM »

Jackie-Lee,

I really enjoyed reading your post, so much so that I want to add to it :) (your words in brown)

I really think words are cheap and so are hugs when it involves people that hardly know each other. It is too bad that people let egos get in the way of their spiritual growth. I know this happens in the church and also in real life.

The old adage of "Actions speak louder than words" really rings true in friendships, especially when in the church. :)

Jam 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.  


I seldom tell anyone I love them but the ones that know me know I do.

I know exactly what you mean, the words "I love you" are much louder and mean so much more when spoken by thought and deed, than by the tounge.

I really have learned from Ray's teaching and this board but I don't get close to people very easy. In some ways I am glad for this because I depend on God more than friendships. In other ways It has been a very lonely life.

I am sure physiologists could speak for hours on what you just said. I share your thoughts exactly. I can only name 3 or 4 people that I would call close friends or confidants and I have only been in the house of one of them. The friendship's are not "social" so to speak, but rather intellectual, spiritual and dare I say deep and meaningful. These are friendships I cherish. Yes, I have seen lonelyness too, but it always seemed so much more comforting than the meaningless charade type friendships of the world.

I have had potential for friends but they distract me in my work and in my study. I know I am the weirdest and feel it too, but I don't like to get involved in cliques. I often wonder what my life would have been like if I had been more open to friendships. When I have noticed just about all friendships end at some point.

It seems that you have kept to the narrow road very well Jackie. :) For wide and easy is the path to destruction. I have often thought the very same question, what would have life been like? But I cannot complain, for I have some very dear friends who have stood by me, and I them. From them, I have learned much.

Pro 18:24 A man [that hath] friends must shew himself friendly: and there is a friend [that] sticketh closer than a brother.  


I am rambling not sure if this even relates please delete if this is for no purpose.
You were not rambling, at least not in my mind :)

Your words spoke to my heart and touched me. :)

Your brother (and friend) in Christ,
Darren
« Last Edit: May 10, 2007, 11:16:45 AM by YellowStone »
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LittleBear

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2007, 11:15:54 AM »

Ecc. 9:3  This is an evil among all things that are done under the sun, that there is one event unto all. Yea, also the heart of the sons of men is full of evil, and madness is in their heart while they live and after that they go to the dead.

I had a recent experience with an aunt and cousin whom I had not seen in many years. They unexpectedly visited my parents for a few hours and I happenned to be there. My parents are struggling with fraility, my father has Alzhimer's and my mother is having a very hard time coping with him and with managing her house, and her appearance even. She was always quit fastidious in looking right and her house was always neat in the past. Now, she usually looks unkempt and her house is messy and everything is old. She is aware of this and it doesn't bother her...... until someone, like her sister, makes a surprise visit.

When they came, they were very upbeat, dressed to the hilt, mighty hugs and kisses all around. They were super positive, and spent the whole two hours telling us all about their wonderful lives, showing us pictures of my aunt's meticulously kept house, and letting us know how perfect they are. They brought cake and I made tea in mugs, and I suddenly noticed there were tea stains in them. I had to pretend that there wasn't tea stains in them, you know, for the greater good.

Man, there were a lot of hugs and kisses, and declarations of great to see us. My mother always loves to be hospitable, and at the end of their visit she noticed that they were looking strangely at the house as they were leaving and she regretted that she didn't know they were coming or she would have bought something to treat them with, and would have cleaned up the house a bit.

I noticed that their conversation had not changed any in the last 30 years. They still exalt in their posessions and their status in life, and this is importaqnt to them. But they couldn't understand that my parents are struggling and maybe they ought to try some empathy, and to listen to the struggles of others.
My mother and I did not have a good experience. I felt sad and sorry for them because in their hearts was love for the things of the world and not for the things of God. In comparison to them, we looked frumpy, quiet, depressed. They were full of energy, and glowing with positiveness.

The scripture from Ecclesiastes came to mind because they will go to the grave with this madness in their hearts. They couldn't or wouldn't see the struggles of others. Money is their god. As I'm writing this, my point is related to this thread because their hugs and kisses were not sincere. Their hugs and kisses were a way of showing us their superiority, and ability to take over the situation and establish themselves there. I don't know if this makes sense, but their hugs and kisses made me feel inferior because I couldn't work up the kind of energy they had.

Jackie Lee, as you said, "I really think words are cheap and so are hugs when it involves people that hardly know each other." I think this was the case with my aunt and cousin.

Ursula 
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cherokee

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #11 on: May 10, 2007, 11:31:33 AM »

Kat,

I know I am still a newbie here and that I do not post much, but I can see what you were saying. I have read alot of the older post and see the wolves. I too pray for discernment that I and others of like mind may see them for what they are.

You and others like you here, have been a great joy to me and great help in my learning as has Ray. I thank God all the time that he led me here and that the truth is out there.

May the Lord continue to bless us with ears to hear, eyes to see and hearts to understand.

Ever learning in Christ,
Suzie
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Rene

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #12 on: May 10, 2007, 12:21:30 PM »

Hi Joe,

I personally want to stay mindful of the following quote from Ray's paper"

What must we learn from all this? Whenever we pretend to be Christ-like but it’s all a charade, we too are guilty of giving Christ a Judas kiss of death.

A huge part of my spiritual journey is examing my own heart and actions when I'm around others, as well as my conduct here at the BT Forum.  My deepest desire is to be more Christ-like, which is a process.  There is no need in pretending.  We may fool another person, but the Lord knows what's in our hearts.

Therefore, I pray daily asking the Lord to continue to bless me with a converted heart.  As my heart becomes more spiritually converted, the more Christ-like my conduct will become in showing true love and affection to others.

Rene'
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skydreamers

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #13 on: May 10, 2007, 05:25:53 PM »

Quote
Hi Joe,

I personally want to stay mindful of the following quote from Ray's paper"

What must we learn from all this? Whenever we pretend to be Christ-like but it’s all a charade, we too are guilty of giving Christ a Judas kiss of death.

A huge part of my spiritual journey is examing my own heart and actions when I'm around others, as well as my conduct here at the BT Forum.  My deepest desire is to be more Christ-like, which is a process.  There is no need in pretending.  We may fool another person, but the Lord knows what's in our hearts.

Therefore, I pray daily asking the Lord to continue to bless me with a converted heart.  As my heart becomes more spiritually converted, the more Christ-like my conduct will become in showing true love and affection to others.

Rene'

Amen to that! :)
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gmik

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #14 on: May 10, 2007, 07:27:23 PM »

Hi all.  I tend to make "friends" quickly and can be quite naive.
You know, like meeting someone and then overnight being best friends, sharing everything, seeing or talking everyday, everything going too fast...then taking a trip together!!!! and...Nevermore being friends!!! :D  Oh yes, too true.

I have heard it said a friendship is like an onion.  Peel away the layers slowly and carefully.  Dont treat a new person as you do a friend for years.  Don't move so fast...tyranny of the urgent so to speak.

Lastly, the way we were brought up and our nationality has a lot to do w/ our personality.  Shy or outgoing, content or restless, etc.

 We are who the Lord wants us to be... the wolf or the sheep.
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Jackie Lee

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #15 on: May 10, 2007, 07:41:35 PM »

This thread is so useful and really has brought some new things to light for me.
Thanks Joe for starting this thread.
 Little Bear I understand exactly what you are saying I lived in similar circumstances growing up.
It wasn't easy but being poor then helped me to have compassion for the poor now.
 Darren I really appreciated your post it helped me see I am where God wants me to be.
Thanks everyone this has been the most touching  thread for me in some time.
                                                                                  Jackie
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Jackie Lee

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #16 on: May 10, 2007, 07:45:09 PM »

Gena you posted the same time I did I liked your bubbly happy post. :)
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gmik

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #17 on: May 10, 2007, 08:11:36 PM »

Thanks Jackie ;D

I have enjoyed this thread.
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pylady

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #18 on: May 10, 2007, 11:10:04 PM »

Hi Jackie-Lee,

Just wanted to know that you've been a blessing to me today by your post.

I know exactly what you mean when you say you felt you were weird, although I would prefer to say I've always felt different!  Although I've made and had friends I've never really felt a deep connection with them.  Guess that's because while we shared some interests, my greatest interest has for the most part been in spiritual things, even though the spiritual things were not the truth, but part of the seeking for the truth.   And I never met anyone, until coming to this website, who really has a passion for spiritual things.  It definitely was the great missing element in any friendship. 

Anyway thanks for letting me know that I'm not the only one who feels that way.

Now I'm really wishing I could come to the Nashville conference and meet everyone there.  If it is God's will I will be at the next one!

Christian love,

               Cindy
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Jackie Lee

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Re: The Kiss of Death
« Reply #19 on: May 10, 2007, 11:24:10 PM »

Hi Jackie-Lee,

Just wanted to know that you've been a blessing to me today by your post.

I know exactly what you mean when you say you felt you were weird, although I would prefer to say I've always felt different!  Although I've made and had friends I've never really felt a deep connection with them.  Guess that's because while we shared some interests, my greatest interest has for the most part been in spiritual things, even though the spiritual things were not the truth, but part of the seeking for the truth.   And I never met anyone, until coming to this website, who really has a passion for spiritual things.  It definitely was the great missing element in any friendship. 

Anyway thanks for letting me know that I'm not the only one who feels that way.

Now I'm really wishing I could come to the Nashville conference and meet everyone there.  If it is God's will I will be at the next one!

Christian love,

               Cindy

Thank you Cindy I guess there are people like us. ;D
This board has helped me immensely well the board and the people here.
I also believe most people like my company but I like you can not connect.
I was  embarassed to post that but now glad I did.
About the conference...
My Mother only lives about 80 miles from Nashville I was hoping to go to Nashville conference also but I doubt I will, circumstances changed so therefore so did my plans. :'(
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