> General Discussions
For it is Grace that.......
mari_et_pere:
Nole I hear what your saying! I struggled with that when I first came here. But what Gena said is right.
If Ray told me to drink the poisoned kool-aid so we could meet our maker sooner trust me, I'd turn it down. :D
God willing he won't do this, but assume Ray has something in his life that totally changes his point of view and is led astray himself (I've seen GREAT men of God go crazy) then I'll have no qualms in leaving here. But for now, it's the best place I've ever found for learning the truth of the Scriptures!
Matt
p.s. None of what I said is because I think he'd poison me. Just thought I'd clear that up! ;D ;D ::) :D
seminole:
Got you Matt! That guy with Jonestown was some kind of piece of work. I don't remember when that happened but it had to be scary for the world to see the end results. Did that guy king of style himself after Elvis or was that just the common look of the day? what made him turn so crazy? The documentary just blew me away!
Nole
mari_et_pere:
LOL styled like Elvis. ;D ;D :D :D ;D He was kind of wasn't he??????? LOL!! I don't know if you've noticed any, but I still see dudes like him here and there. The hair, the shades, they look like an Elvis type character (Elvish?) Now I'm only 32 so I was a little guy back then, 4 yrs. old, but believe it or not I can remember the news talking about it. Of course my little mind didn't wrap around it at all, but I remember my parents being shocked that something like that could happen.
But seriously, why he turned crazy is beyond anyone's imagination. The People's Temple had been in San Fransisco. Jones was known as a healer and community leader, helping out various organizations. (basically being a good guy) After Jones moved his congregation to Guayana, reports emerged about abuse and human rights violations. I'd say he went crazy before the move, making the move and later actions pre-meditated. Once they moved to Guayana he "claimed" divinity by saying he was a reincarnation of Jesus, Bhudda, Lenin, etc. We all know what happened next.
Matt
gmik:
Pride ALWAYS goes before a fall.
Not being grounded in something, needing love and validation, make people do strange things. The dravidians were very strange-even tho Janet Reno took 'em out for no good reason, but he was teaching heresy. Those folks waiting for aliens all committed suicide.
Now who in their right mind, and w/ a knowledge of scripture and a "relationship" w/ Jesus would be bluffed into thinking that yes it is OK for your leader to have sex w/ any woman or child that he wanted???Alll the time???? Wouldn't ya think something was wrong??? How 'bout lets all drink poison??? Huh? Everyone is against us, lets go hide out in guyana, or waco or wherever.....
I agree Matt, if ever Ray says, "I have a new revelation, I am Jesus returned and you all must sell all you have to give to me," then, duh, outta here.
I believe Ray is teaching the truth. He is not up in my face or private life telling me what to do. Goodness, he doesn't even ask for money!!!! He doesn't appear to live off others labor or live high on the hog, and I don't think he wants to be famous. So, no we don't put Ray on a pedastal. But lets respect the man that God is using right now to help us all get out of Babylon. And be greatful, and pray for him! <now, she gets off her soapbox pedastal> sorry :D
Deborah-Leigh:
Hi Randy
By grace (Divinity working its influence on our hearts...our stony evil hearts...to do the work of conforming them into the image of Christ) we are saved by faith.
Is faith enough to save us. No. Faith also translates to belief. Is belief enough to save us? No.
James 2 : 17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Faith without GRACE is alone! This was another major discovery for me!
BY GRACE, least anyone boast...GRACE that is GOD'S DIVINITY working and influencing our hearts to be like His we are saved through HIS work in us and HIS Faith tried tested and proven. THAT Faith is also not of our own but also a gift and not our Faith but the Faith of Christ.
kIND OF PUTS US IN OUR PLACE ;D :D 8)
Thanks for the thread and encouragement to listen to the Bible Study by Ray that expounded these insights. :) 8)
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
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